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Can someone show me the scriptural passage that ...

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In Revelation 22:18-19 we read the following precepts: “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:  And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book”. Can someone show me the scriptural passage that exempts Martin Luther from the above injunction?

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Luther believed he was living in the end times, and that the pope was the antichrist.  He makes the Revelation and allergy of his current events.  In "A Mighty Fortress Is Our God" he refers to the pope as satan himself.  He had good reason for his beliefs.  The pope was ignoring the Bible, trying to control all the catholic countries and to extract money from rich and poor alike to build the Basilica.  He did this mainly by the sale of "Indulgences" which were sold so a person could buy his way out of purgatory, a place that is not even mentioned in the 66 books of the Bible.  He claimed to be infallible in matters of faith yet he consistently refuted the Bible and made ungodly judgements.  He had excommunicated Luther for these reasons, refusing to reform the Catholic Church in the light of the teachings of Scripture, so Luther felt he had no choice but to go to war against the pope in defense of Scripture, especially since the pope was trying to have him killed.  

When believers trust in Christ's death and resurrection, God declares them righteous.  Their names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life.  There deeds would be evaluated as to whether they had done them following the Holy Spirit by faith--the Just shall live by his faith, and would be rewarded accordingly.   Their sins had already been paid for by the blood of Christ.   They would not appear before the great white throne judgement.  But unbelievers would be judged by their sins, especially for the sin of rejecting Christ.  

Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over these, the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and will reign with him one thousand years.

Rev 20:11  I saw a great white throne, and him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. There was found no place for them. Rev 20:12  I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and they opened books. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged out of the things which were written in the books, according to their works. Rev 20:13  The sea gave up the dead who were in it. Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them. They were judged, each one according to his works.  Rev 20:14  Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.  Rev 20:15  If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.

Luther excluded those Old Testament books from the Bible that had been excluded by the Masoratic Jews.  Recent scholarship shows that this text was used in the Temple while Christ lived on earth and it was written in Hebrew. They were most meticulous in copying the old testament and it was found to be the most reliable.  Books written after the book of Daniel and before Christ were held suspect due to errors and lack of authenticity, so they were placed in a separate section and he held them unfit as a basis for doctrine.  But the warning at the end of the Revelation applies strictly to the scroll of the Revelation.  The scrolls were not printed in book form or assembled into a single book for several hundred years after their writing.  Calvinists and some German printers excluded the apocrapha from their bibles.  

He also wanted to exclude the book of James for its inclusion of works being necessary for salvation.  The rest of the New Testament is not as terse concerning this, claiming that salvation is a gift given to those true believers who have faith in Christ's death and resurrection for their sins. James claimed that saving faith will produce works.  Luther, like most catholics, had been in bondage to works, and was set free when the Holy Spirit showed him the verse "the just shall live by his faith'.  So he resisted any hint that he must return to the horrible bondage he had been freed from.  Jude was also suspect, as well as Hebrews because it is the only book that does not reveal it author.

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Posted (edited)

Sola fide is the idea that one is saved by faith alone.

Quote*

"The doctrine of sola fide asserts God's pardon for guilty sinners is granted to and received through faith alone, excluding all "works"."

Revelations has some passages that argue against that point.

As wikipedia explains in detail there was some argument over deeds versus faith in that time period you mentioned above.

The Catholic Church favored 'deeds' while Luther felt faith alone gained you the Kingdom of God (my personal take away on what wikipedia shares).  he choose to see Revelations in this light and did not look very far into it himself.  But we can look now at their true meaning.

So let us take a look at Revelations from that stance.

"Revelation 2:23: "Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds."

There are fours verses that all state 'deeds' are judged*.

This verse qualified 'deeds' as a response to various 'Churches' that have sinned and fallen short, of the glory of God.  7 Churches, yet only one Christian Church is deemed worthy of salvation.  So their deeds are judged.  Jesus offers advice to the other 6 Churches (angels) on how they can atone their sins.  

Next verse,

"Revelation 14:12-13: "Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and hold fast to the faith of Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying, ‘Write this: Blessed are the dead who from now on die in the Lord.’ ‘Yes,’ says the Spirit, ‘they will rest from their labours, for their deeds follow them.’"

This says the saints that are to be resurrected were judged by their deeds.  That too falls under the 'Church' category as one Church is allowed to enter Heaven if they die in Jesus's name.

Next verse, 

Revelation 20:13: "All the dead were judged according to their deeds."

Here we see that God judges all of mankind, by their deeds, at the end of the millennium.  This means he is judging all.  

At this time we would have been ruled by the Saints and by Jesus and would have been out of the Church age for a very long time.  The Bible reflects this by adding that we are to be ruled by Jesus (not church affiliations).

There will be therefore a different set of criteria to follow (ie. rules), than we have right now, as well, where our deeds matter.  I refer to this time as a time of growth of the Holy spirit in our lives, individually.

We, here now, will be dead by then and will have to be judged by this criteria, versus the criteria set forth previously prior to the Resurrection of the Saints.  I feel we are now in that period, though few agree.

Many again will fail to follow the Holy Spirit in all matters.  How are we then to be judged worthy of entrance to God's throne room then?

We did not have to follow the Holy Spirit prior to the resurrection of the Saints and Jesus's return.

We were judged instead by our fellowship with our Church and faith in Jesus Christ.  A much lesser burden of proof of atonement.  We just had to 'hang' onto the word, versus profess it throughout our life.

There are hints about how this time period prior the final and last judgement would have people filled with the Holy Spirit and of course, satan bound for a thousand years (ie. reducing temptations), thus allowing incredible growth, in such matters.

Final note.....

And lastly, deeds are not exactly 'works' either.  They are not exactly the same word and invoke different pictures, in my mind.  Deeds are more along the line of 'sins'.  As you are judged for your crimes against God.  While doing good works, like caring for people is noble, it is not judged as being a confession of sin (and therefore atonement seeking), either (by these passages meanings).

 

*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_fide.  

Edited by eileenhat

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On 3/19/2017 at 8:14 PM, zeland said:

In Revelation 22:18-19 we read the following precepts: “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:  And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book”. Can someone show me the scriptural passage that exempts Martin Luther from the above injunction?

I don't think there is such a passage in the Bible regarding Martin Luther and this warning in Revelation. What have you seen that would make you think there is?Martin Luther I believe was amillennial such is the RCC and the Lutheran Church. That is a dangerous belief.

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On 3/19/2017 at 8:14 PM, zeland said:

In Revelation 22:18-19 we read the following precepts: “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:  And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book”. Can someone show me the scriptural passage that exempts Martin Luther from the above injunction?

I do not even understand the question, so, will ask for clarification.

Why do you think there would be a scripture about Martin Luther, and more to the point, what is it you think that Martin Luther did, that takes away or adds to the book of Revelation. What scripture did Martin Luther ever write? What words did Martin Luther remove from the Book of Revelation, or what words, events, prophecies etc. did he ever say were not true?

Like I said, I do not really even understand what you are asking or what you think he did or did not do?

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I received a detailed message from zeland, a private message, not a post in this forum. Zeland had much to say. I started off with:

The purpose of the question is to bring attention to the fact that Luther has no authority to tamper with the Bible. In violation of Revelation 22:18-19 . . . 

Basically, seems to me that Zeland is a Roman Catholic Apologist, with an agenda, as stated above. As this is a discussion forum, and not intended to be a means by which one can make contacts for private messages, I would rather see zeland address the thread directly.

I do not see where, zeland really addressed what I was fishing for in my reply above, so, I will get a bit more specific and focused. Restating what was was asking . . . 

Zeland, you asked if there was a scriptural passage that exempts Martin Luther from the injunction of Revelation 22:8-9. When Revelation 22 make reference to "this book", there was no Bible. The Bible, is not a book. The Bible is a collection of books. One of those books is, of course, the book of Revelation, and Revelation 22 is refering to itself, this book, is the book we call Revelation.

It is not proper, for us to make up rules of exegesis, that would allow us to lift Rev 22 from it's context, and then apply it to an entire collection of books, the Bible. Therefore, the injuction of Rev 22 is that a person not add to the book of revelation, not subtract from in, not alter it's prophecies, etc.

So, with that clarification established, I ask once more . . . 

"What is it you think that Martin Luther did, that takes away or adds to the book of Revelation?"

Unless there is some Martin Luther version of the book of Revelation which I am unaware of, where he added or removed words or verses from it, there is no just grounds to ask what exempts him, from something he never did.

All this is, is a straw man fallacy, where you present an argument, a false premise, and then attempt to refute the false premise that your 'opponent' has not made. Since (unless I am shown otherwise) Martin Luther did not alter the book of Revelation, there is no need to provide a passage to defend and action that Luther never did.

So then, the question should become: on what principle does a person accuse another of wrong doing which he never committed, or on what basis does a person presume to invent new exegetical principles that would allow us to ignore the context of a verse (the book of Revelation) and apply it outside of it's context, to the whole Bible, a collection of books not even assembled at the time the book of Revelation was penned?

So, the answer to the question posed by zeland is:

There is no passage exempting anyone from adding to or subtracting from the book of Revelation, and none is needed, since it was never done. 

A little study of systematic theology, exegesis, logical fallacies and other disciplines could go a long way toward asking improper questions, and answering them for oneself.

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On 3/21/2017 at 1:11 PM, missmuffet said:

I don't think there is such a passage in the Bible regarding Martin Luther and this warning in Revelation. What have you seen that would make you think there is?Martin Luther I believe was amillennial such is the RCC and the Lutheran Church. That is a dangerous belief.

Nothing about Martin Luther but in Revelation 22:19-20.

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Thanks Omega man,

I thought he may be a RC because of the way he phrased his question 

It's very telling what people do say and what they blatantly don't say.

I'd like for him to check out Mike Gendron and see what he thinks of Mike.

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On 3/19/2017 at 11:14 PM, zeland said:

In Revelation 22:18-19 we read the following precepts: “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:  And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book”. Can someone show me the scriptural passage that exempts Martin Luther from the above injunction?

 

I can't speak to the Luther's angle, but the reason John spoke this concerning just the book of Revelation is because of Rev 13:18. 

Here's the oldest text of Rev 13:18 mistranslated 666. Because the translators thought the writings of John were Greek letters, the scribes transposed them.

image015.png

Here is what it said:

Bismillah[1].png

Then the comparison:

 

Bismillah2[1].png

 

Even Jesus spoke of "In the name of Allah":

John 5:43 (KJV)
I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 

 

The letter chi:

image022.png

shows 

image023.png

Crossed swords of Islam.

image025.png
This holder of the Quran is called a Rahal. While this requires some study, gematria is rejected by many, yet 666 is exactly that which is why NO ONE can find what it means. 9/11 showed me what this verse means. Just my two cents.

 

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P.S. God told John to write what he SAW.... this is what he saw:

 

image027.jpg

image041.png

 

image049.jpg

 

image051.jpg

 

image052.jpg

 

image005.jpg

image031.png

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Luther was NOT exempted from God's commands and, IMO, was an evil man.  An antisemitic one. 

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