Does the Spirit always remain in the born-again believer?

[Heb 13:8]

1 hour ago, ZacharyB said:

... you will lose any eternal life you may have had.

This is absolutely guaranteed to be true in the NT.

E.G. How many born-again believers will stand by and watch their families die of starvation?

So much easier to take the dreaded mark of the beast, get some food, and survive!

Those of us who are alive will get to CHOOSE between surviving physically or surviving spiritually.

In that day it will be one or the other. Scripture says so, not me!

Well, fortunately for the church, they are going to be raptured prior to the 70th week. The 70th week is a time of darkness and gloom.

Zeph 1:15 That day will be a day of wrath— a day of distress and anguish, a day of trouble and ruin, a day of darkness and gloom, a day of clouds and blackness—

1 Thess 5:5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness.

[ZacharyB]

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 1:37 PM, Teditis said:

I'm not sure what you're saying because you seem to contradict yourself in this post.

You say that it isn't work to pick up our cross and follow Jesus... but then you say that

it sure sounds like work to you. Which is it?

Yes, sorry that I wasn't clear!

And sorry that I cannot give a post # to those trying to follow.

I meant people consider carrying your cross, etc. to be works,

but it is not works to co-operate with the Holy Spirit and be obedient.

Edited April 17, 2017 by ZacharyB

[Willa]

On 4/13/2017 at 10:51 AM, ZacharyB said:

Not strange at all to me ... because ...

Unfortunately, almost every woman I've encountered on Christian forums ...

is much more focused on her emotions than on what Scripture actually teaches!

This wouldn't be why Paul says women need to follow the male lead, would it?

Statements like this make me emotional.   Grumble Grumble.  

That would be "I just know I am saved because I feel saved!.  So if you don't feel saved there is no use in believing Scripture.  You have no hope."

But :  Joh 1:12  But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,  Joh 1:13  who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Joh 3:13  No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man. Joh 3:14  And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, Joh 3:15  that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. Joh 3:16  "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. Joh 3:17  For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

Joh 4:10  Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you, 'Give me a drink,' you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water." Joh 4:14  but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.

"Joh 5:24  Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life

.Joh 6:47  Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.

Joh 6:47 AMP I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, he who believes in Me [who adheres to, trusts in, relies on, and has faith in Me] has (now possesses) eternal life.

Joh 6:67  NKJV Then Jesus said to the twelve, "Do you also want to go away?" Joh 6:68  But Simon Peter answered Him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. Joh 6:69  Also we have come to believe and know that You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

Joh 7:38  He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water." Joh 7:39  But this He spoke concerning the Spirit, whom those believing in Him would receive; for the Holy Spirit was not yet given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Joh 7:38  He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water." Joh 7:39  But this He spoke concerning the Spirit, whom those believing in Him would receive; for the Holy Spirit was not yet given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Joh 8:31  Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, "If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed.

Joh 10:27  My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. Joh 10:28  And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. Joh 10:29  My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand.

I know I am saved because Jesus told me so in John.   These are only highlights.    

[ZacharyB]

38 minutes ago, Willa said:

Statements like this make me emotional.   Grumble Grumble.  

"Unfortunately, almost every woman I've encountered on Christian forums ...

is much more focused on her emotions than on what Scripture actually teaches!"

What does your response have to do with my statement in red?

If it didn't make you so emotional, you might have understood what I said.

And it has nothing to do with whether you're saved or not.

I.E. understanding Scripture doesn't make you saved, etc. etc.

Bottom Line: IMO, the idea of losing salvation freaks women out more than it does men.

Edited April 19, 2017 by ZacharyB

[Willa]

You said women don't pay any attention to what the Scripture teaches.  I replied that I base my salvation on what the scripture actually says and not on emotion.  I don't interpret them emotionally.  I do interpret them with the light of the Holy Spirit and in context.  If the Holy Spirit applies them to me, it is not emotion, it is fact irregardless of how I may respond to the fact.  

So how did I misinterpret your statement?  

I interpret the whole idea of losing or being kept by Luke 8"s interpretation of the parable.  And according to Jesus a person's salvation has everything to do with what we do with His word as I posted previously.   Joh 8:31  Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, "If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed.

Luk 8:11  "Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.

Luk 8:12  Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

Luk 8:13  But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

Luk 8:14  Now the ones that fell among thorns are those who, when they have heard, go out and are choked with cares, riches, and pleasures of life, and bring no fruit to maturity.

Luk 8:15  But the ones that fell on the good ground are those who, having heard the word with a noble and good heart, keep it and bear fruit with patience.

Those who reject or disregard God's Word are neglecting so great a salvation and will be judged.  Jesus in us bears fruit by His own nature and His words are Spirit and they are life.

[Danger Noodle]

On 4/8/2017 at 2:12 PM, ZacharyB said:

These verses do not give any conditions for the indwelling Holy Spirit

 

“But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His … But if the Spirit of Him

who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead

will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

… you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, ‘Abba, Father’ ” (Romans 8:9-15)

 

“Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?” (1 Corinthians 3:16)

 

“Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you,

whom you have from God, and you are not your own?” (1 Corinthians 6:19)

 

“And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts,

crying out, “Abba, Father!” (Galatians 4:6)

 

“That good thing which was committed to you, keep by the Holy Spirit who dwells in us.” (2 Timothy 1:14)

 

“But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you

… the same anointing teaches you concerning all things” (1 John 2:27)

 

These verses give conditions for the indwelling Holy Spirit

 

“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father,

and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever —

the Spirit of truth … you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 

… you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you. 

He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me.

And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and

manifest Myself to him … If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word;

and My Father will love him, and We will come to him

and make Our home with him.” (John 14:15-23)

Conditional indwelling: love Jesus and keep His commandments

 

“Every branch in Me (born-again believer!) that does not bear fruit He takes away

… Abide in Me, and I in you … He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit;

… If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered;

and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.” (John 15:2-6)

Conditional indwelling: bear fruit, abide in Jesus

 

“And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit

whom God has given to those who obey Him.” (Acts 5:32)

Conditional indwelling: obey God

 

“Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves,

that Jesus Christ is in you? — unless indeed you are disqualified.” (2 Corinthians 13:5)

Conditional indwelling: be “in the faith” (whatever that means exactly)

 

“Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.” (1 John 3:24)

Conditional indwelling: keep Jesus’ commandments

 

“No one has seen God at any time. If we love one another, God abides in us,

and His love has been perfected in us. By this we know that we abide in Him, and He in us,

because He has given us of His Spirit … Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God,

God abides in him, and he in God. And we have known and believed the love that God has for us.

God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God in him.” (1 John 4:12-16)

Conditional indwelling: love one another, confess that Jesus is the Son of God, abide in love

 

“Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door,

I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me.” (Revelation 3:20)

Conditional indwelling: respond to Jesus’ voice

Note: This is the Laodicean church where it is said by some Bible teachers

(such as Dr. C. S. Lovett of Personal Christianity) that everyone is unsaved.

And that would surely explain why the Spirit is NOT already inside.

IMO, this is Jesus’ invitation to salvation for those who are spiritually dead (unsaved)!

This agrees with verses which teach that people need to have a real and

personal relationship with Jesus to have eternal life (John 10:27, John 17:3).

 

Do all of these conditions have to be maintained for the Holy Spirit to remain in the born-again believer?

Does the Spirit leave when these conditions are not maintained?

If so, are there any verses which say the Holy Spirit will return?

And if so, upon what conditions? How about …

“If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins

and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:9)

.

Yes, the Holy Spirit of God enters the person as soon as they accept Jesus on faith as their Savior. They are then sealed with that Holy Spirit at Baptism. As we are to take and understand from the story of John the Baptist. He Baptized Jesus and the Holy Spirit of God descended from Heaven upon Jesus. And God said from the Heavens, this was his Son in whom God was well pleased. 

That entire example shared in the scriptures as it happened is to inform the faithful too. Isn't it glorious?  Praise God. 

[Malcomx]

We try to explain but we used most of our own words and interepration and as a result switch the truth meaning. We collect texts that do not have the beginning and it's end. We just quote what is in the bible and support it with our explanation. 

If we have received the Holy Spirit then why are we having many answers to a question and why do we come up with many questions and why are we confuse which Jesus said the Holy Spirit will not make you confuse John 14:26.

[Willa]

On 4/13/2017 at 1:13 PM, Teditis said:

The true believer has the Holy Spirit indwelling them and He convicts us of sin and guides us into repentance daily.

It's by His work in us that we walk our daily lives... the work of Christ, God and the Holy Spirit is ever-present in the

believer's life. And Scripture makes this clear. We pray without ceasing and our sins are ever-present before us.

The seeds that fall on "bad soil" will sprout and show signs of life (in Christ) but eventually it's realized that there is no

significant growth in them... these are those that often act like Christians and even seem like Christians, but have no real

depth of root. What they are not, is Christians who fall out of favor with God and somehow give-up Salvation. They didn't

mature.

Scripture is clear that none are snatched away from God, that He finishes the work that He starts and that Salvation is eternally

given to the ones that truly turn themselves over to Christ as Lord. Christians don't reject God, ever... they have Him living within

themselves and are internally changed by the process. That would be like saying I'm choosing to change my gender or my species.

We are born-anew and there's no reversal process for that.

Well said, Teditis.

I do believe it is possible to quench the Holy Spirit within us till our hearts are hardened and we reject God' Word.  We become prideful as satan did when he fell.  This can happen prior when being introduced to Christ, or after having received Christ when we decide that the Bible doesn't apply to us so we fail to put down roots into His promises that keep us grounded by His grace and faith during trials.  It can occur when we are starting to grow but we allow other things become our gods and choke out our love for God and His word.  This is when we neglect so great a salvation.  No fruit comes to maturity.  

From God's perspective, since He knows the end from the beginning, He knows which ones of us will endure to the end and receive the final salvation of our bodies.  From our perspective, we know our souls are saved because we still hear our spirits crying Daddy to our Father God.  We have entered the rest of the finished work of the cross and ceased from our self effort, allowing Christ to live in us.  We have entrusted our salvation to our Father to keep us, to chasten us when necessary, and to continue to draw us closer to Him as we direct our attention to our eternal riches awaiting those who are in Christ and in whom Christ lives.  

When people think they are the only ones on these boards that are going to heaven, and that those with a different understanding of Scripture are going to hell, I always take a few steps back from them.  Their lack of compassion starts to show and an accusing and condemning attitude starts to come through.  It causes me to pray for forbearance among us, that we all strive for the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace, and that we be given hearts to try to understand each others perspective.  

Col 3:1 AMP    IF THEN you have been raised with Christ [to a new life, thus sharing His resurrection from the dead], aim at and seek the [rich, eternal treasures] that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. [Psa 110:1]

Col 3:2  And set your minds and keep them set on what is above (the higher things), not on the things that are on the earth.

Col 3:3  For [as far as this world is concerned] you have died, and your [new, real] life is hidden with Christ in God.

Col 3:4  When Christ, Who is our life, appears, then you also will appear with Him in [the splendor of His] glory.

Col 3:5  So kill (deaden, deprive of power) the evil desire lurking in your members [those animal impulses and all that is earthly in you that is employed in sin]: sexual vice, impurity, sensual appetites, unholy desires, and all greed and covetousness, for that is idolatry (the deifying of self and other created things instead of God).

Col 3:6  It is on account of these [very sins] that the [holy] anger of God is ever coming upon the sons of disobedience (those who are obstinately opposed to the divine will),

[ZacharyB]

22 hours ago, Willa said:

I base my salvation on what the scripture actually says and not on emotion.   

I truly must apologize ... because I forgot to include:

Most women on Christian forums are focused on THEMSELVES,

whilst I am clearly talking about people in general, believers in general, etc. 

IOW, I don't spend mucho time on individuals ... I'm talking about the masses.

Da problema (or blessing) is not with one individual woman, but with the masses.

Just possibly, da problema in the churches is not with you, but with the masses.

Do you get both points about women in Christian forums that I'm trying to make?

Edited April 20, 2017 by ZacharyB

[Willa]

 I understand, Zachery and realize this may be based on your observations.  Men are often more detached and analytical, as well.  Dry. lol.  But it does sound a little male chauvinist oinkish when I see statements like that.  In the 50s it was a mans world and women were to stay in their places, not have opinions or voice any, and leave intelligent conversation to the men.  I was not raised that way.  So it was a shock to get out of my home and find that women were supposed to be empty headed twits who only talked about fashions or the latest achievements of their kids.  Yes, we women are more subject to emotions caused by hormonal fluctuation, but that doesn't mean we don't make intelligent decisions.  Nor does it mean we don't enjoy sound hermeneutics and expository teaching.  So thank you for giving me a break.  I forgive you and will stop crying.  lol