Can you reconcile science and religion

[Guest]

I believe science and God go hand in hand. My suspicion is that God created the universe and is the singularity point. Nothing existed before this point according to astrophysicists. (Christ says I am the alpha and omega, the first and the last). Very interesting that the singularity point is the very first moment of creation and in the Book of Genesis when it says Beresheet bara Elohim....Beresheet means in the beginning of time and space, not just matter and energy. So my belief is that God created the universe through the formulas of science, math, and physics and there are many things we are just now understanding about advanced physics. I think the controversy lies in these dogmatic views atheists and other non-believers take and expound upon with the media and political help. Scientists and mathematicians who go against the Darwinist tradition of 'no god anywhere' often lose their standing, their papers, and sometimes their careers. You have to be a top notch scientist of brilliant intellect to be able to survive this gauntlet. So my suspicion is that the non-believing world are the ones who are behind the campaign stating that science and God are incompatible. Christ said to beware of false prophets in the last days...make sure that you are not deceived. Ask yourself....from the non-believing scientific world, where is their money coming from? You'll find your answers there.

[Kevinb]

Bk1110 you asked my background. I live in the UK...I've learnt how very different our countries are in terms of religiosity. Census polls say most don't believe in any God now here.

First I've got to say..creation science isn't a credible term...there's just science. Even stated by judges in US courts when the teaching of creation science or intelligent design gets thrown out of science classrooms. So called creation science isn't demonstrable..it isn't falsifiable..it isn't peer reviewed etc etc ..this is how all other sciences get into the classroom. Creation science or intelligent design is religion trying to get into science classes. I think religion in schools is important ...in the UK there are a few week blocks a year for religious studies whereby you're taught what the most common religions in the world are and what they teach.

On mainstream TV here..the BBC we see regular science documentaries. Last night for instance I watched a program on star formation and life cycle and ultimate demise including our sun...included was how we know this even mathematically and the progression to get us to that point..and how things like neutron stars were predicted by science before we even discovered them.

I believe in evolution because it's yet to be falsified...there dozens of scientific disciplines that have added weight to it and our understanding. Darwin knew nothing of nucleotides and dna and this area alone is enough to demonstrate common ancestry. We've even mapped the neandathal genome and can demonstrate an interbreeding with homosapeins tens of thousands of years ago. Even to the point of being able to attribute some modern diseases to our 2% ish neandathal dna. Modern medicine is increasingly built upon our knowledge of dna and we will be further able to treat illness based upon the individuals dna. We now know we've vestigial ancestral dna more broadly. This is briefly dna alone..not even approached the fossil record..aging..distribution... embryology to name a few more all add weight but they didn't have to.

 How about vestigial remnants like whales have a pelvis and leg remnants buried in their bodies from ancestral land mammals..snakes also. We have fossils records of mammalian land living noses gradually moving to the top of the head to form a blow hole. Ever wondered why the mammalian spine such as whales and dolphines moves up and down water rather than side to side like a fish. This is how mammals on land move of course.

 Creationists sometimes say how well things are designed but thats such a superficial view as so much is poorly "designed"the human eye with an optic nerve smack in the middle of the retina giving us a blind spot rather than out the back of the eye. Teeth don't adequately fit in our jaw...the recurrent laryngeal nerve from our heads terminating in our throats but goes into our chest as it's been looped around the vein of the heart. In fish ancestral and current not too much a problem but in giraffes that's a journey of 15 feet. Anyway 100s of examples of poor design. Evolution can explain demonstrably why but you get the idea. For me this is overwhelming. The little God belief in had here I lost not least because I saw how people have decided what's true ie God did it.. already before asking the question or looking at the evidence. Evidence must form beliefs rather than beliefs form the evidence surely. I'm sure or I hope everyone does it in every other aspect of life and decision making. 

The money coming from? Isn't this why churches actively recruit in the usa? Doesn't happen here to the same degree. Your statement also implies some intent or conspiracy? Again I'd quote evidence forming beliefs rather than beliefs forming evidence. Science has no anti God agenda... it's just devising and testing methodologies based on evidence of the natural world. 

I realised for me a while ago ..how can I quote Christ..how can I say that's true...because where and when I was raised? Another country or place I could easily be coming from another religious perception right? 

Anyways all fascinating stuff. Anything I post isn't intending to be offensive to people personally...I see it as discussing politics or anything else. Already been told I'll burn in hell..doesn't affect me as I don't believe in one. I turned that around and said how worried are you about not going to an Islamic hell or Hindu hell. 

To sum up...I've not said there is no God..whichever God people have picked in human history I just see no evidence ..until that changes..by default I can't yet accept the claim

Edited May 11, 2017 by Kevinb
Misc

[BK1110]

Thanks for taking the time to reply. Here's some info if you're willing to take a look.

http://creation.com/fossils-questions-and-answers

http://creation.com/vestigial-organs-questions-and-answers

[Kevinb]

Thanks...I'll take a look over the weekend. 

[Guest shiloh357]

On 4/18/2017 at 4:37 AM, Kevinb said:

What do people feel on this topic. Do we see a lack of scientific knowledge to bolster religious views? Can science be incorporated into religion? Can we refute the scientific in favour of religious ideas?

It is only the atheistic community in the world of science that presents religion as anti-science, which it is not.    The problem isn't "science vs. the Bible."  Or "science vs. religion."   It is Evolution vs. the Bible/religion.  We cannot reconcile Evolution with the Bible and we should not try to do so.

[Guest shiloh357]

22 hours ago, Kevinb said:

 

I believe in evolution because it's yet to be falsified...

 

Evolution can't be falsified, scientifically.   The way something is falsified is through continued experimentation and there are no experiments that can test the claims of Evolution or Creationism.  

Evolution has not been intuitively observed and has not been proven.

If Evolution is true, then the earth, over billions and billions of years, would be pregnant with fossils of every intermediate stage of every species of every creature that ever lived.

[enoob57]

On ‎5‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 5:26 PM, BK1110 said:

1. Young Earth is just one view. There are a lot of old Earth creationists; I tend to lean that way myself. Look up Hugh Ross, for that and many other issues like it (like the Flood, for instance), I think you might find his lectures and research very eye-opening.

2. What's wrong with Adam and Eve?

3. The Bible isn't a scientific textbook; just because it talks about the moon giving light at night doesn't mean it's claiming the moon is producing the light. It's just saying that the moon is the big lighted object in the night sky, which it is; the fact that it's reflecting light from the sun instead of producing it's own light isn't relevant to the point the Bible is making in that instance because, again, the Bible isn't trying to teach science like a textbook.

4. Virgin birth and resurrection are both miracles; I.E. direct action by God. Those would both be tiny things indeed for a God who had created everything, one who is literally omnipotent. The Bible never claims that those things are possible within the natural order, in fact the opposite; it claims that they are only possibly through the direct action of God, who supersedes the natural order. Circling back to Adam and Eve, if this is also your problem with them, again, same thing; their creation is the result of direct action of a being with omnipotence.

God creates a meter of time from nothing calls it day (24 hours by meter) and then people ignore it... go figure! Evolution is a faith based religion built upon the thoughts of men not The Word of God...

[enoob57]

Romans 1:20 (KJV)

[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

There are some very Godly men that are scientist as well! They understand that the creative Word perfectly harmonizes the written Word...

[Kevinb]

Well absolutely evolution could be falsified...or at least given a major problem..a rabbit fossil in the triassic would do it? That would be one instance but nothing has yet been found out of evolutionary "sync" as it were. 

I'd have to disagree with evolution being faith based..even judges in courts with intelligent design vs evolution regarding what's taught in schools when presented with evidence from both sides have directly said evolution isn't a religion where as ID is. 

[Sight]

KevinB, why do you even care?

Is the answer to this question going to benefit you in any sort of way? Why is it bugging you? Is it REALLY that important?