Your closest friendnt Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,851 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,760 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 3 hours ago, wingnut- said: Hello friend, First, I want to apologize for misunderstanding what you were saying in your original post. After re-reading the discussion I see that in your original post you clearly state that ocean does not appear in scripture. I got confused in your explanation when you brought ocean into it and developed tunnel vision lol. If I understand you correctly, it appears you hold to the theory I had mentioned earlier who see the mention of sea in Revelation as a symbolic reference to the "sea of humanity". Second, to answer your question as to whether or not I believe the sea has passed away. No, I do not. When God called the waters to one place in Genesis, He named His creation the seas, and I do not believe He changed His mind. The reason for this is simple, because nowhere in scripture does He call it anything else. Over time people have given the seas different names, I suspect this was done to assist in navigation. Today we have oceans, seas, lakes, gulfs, and bays to name the ones that come to mind immediately. It makes it simpler for us when we look at a map, but I don't think that changes what God calls it. I do find it interesting that when God gathered all the water into one place He named it seas. We automatically think of seas as being plural, but clearly if all the waters were gathered into one place the word "seas" was singular. How that plays into the word sea in other parts of scripture I do not know, perhaps it is a matter of different languages, or perhaps it is symbolic. God bless The "sea' is figurative for the "captivity", going back before the Cross, everyone was going there, because there was only one place for all mankind. That was the descending inheritance for all mankind, including Abraham and all the children of the Lord God, the children without the life, the seperated ones from their Lord God. This all change with the Cross. There is something new. Since the Cross those have not remained the same. Jesus Christ have the Keys of Hades and Death. This is the big change. Before someone else had the keys of Hades, and he closed the door and no one could open it. The Death rained upon all, till the life was given to all who believe. Now there is Heaven for those with the life, and Hell, for those JESUS CHRIST has judged that the have denied to believed in (the lifegiver) himself. Those who choose death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said: The "sea' is figurative for the "captivity", going back before the Cross, everyone was going there, because there was only one place for all mankind. That was the descending inheritance for all mankind, including Abraham and all the children of the Lord God, the children without the life, the seperated ones from their Lord God. What scriptural references lead you to connect the "sea" to "captivity"? By captivity, are you referring to what is called sheol or Abraham's bosom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 4, 2017 Just now, eileenhat said: Probably means no 'sea' as in barriers between the people, as the sea right now is such. Interesting thought, it is true the New Jerusalem will be more than enough to house the trillions of believers from all the ages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 4, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 4, 2017 11 minutes ago, eileenhat said: Trillions? Don't think it could get that high. Rather not conjecture about numbers. Best to look to one's self (and your walk with the Lord) rather than worry about numbers of saved (in end). There 2.2 Billion Christian in this century (21st). Then add the numbers of Great Awakenings and conversions in each century. See how many at Pentecost were saved, 3,000 and then 4,000. Add up the believers over 2017yrs and I think you'll find at least a trillion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted May 5, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,851 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,760 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted May 5, 2017 4 hours ago, wingnut- said: What scriptural references lead you to connect the "sea" to "captivity"? By captivity, are you referring to what is called sheol or Abraham's bosom? Hello Wing Nut, I have a few Scriptures that shows what kind of power JESUS CHRIST had to deal with, not only when he was here on earth, but also when he descended in the place of the dead and what he did down there. By default every one from the first man, till the time of the redemption on the Cross, inherited through birth from Adam the fallen inheritance. The Devil only had to take the first couple captive, to have the right and take captive their descendants. Till the time the Lord God set apart Abraham and his descendants from the rest of the world. Specifically, Isaac , and Jacob with all his house. At this specific situation we have two people on earth, two nations on earth, the Gentiles with their own inheritance , after they die which is the fallen, at the time of death they descent into Hades. They were judge by non Other than Hades the God of the place of the dead, and death rained in them, by inheritance. The other Nation of the children of Abraham first of the sircoumsission, and later of the Law, which were the children of the Lord God, but the Lord God couldn't give them LIFE ETERNAL, for many reasons and death rained in them by inheritance. The Lord removed the uncleaness from them, but not the inherited death. Death remained in all from Adam till JESUS CHRIST. This Nation had an inheritance after they die, but that was not an ascending inheritance the Heavens, it was also a descending inheritance, but they didn't mix with the Gentiles , they had their own place, still down there but seperated from the rest of the world. They were gathered together with Abraham in Sheol, thus the name "Bossom of Abraham", which was still in the place of the dead. They were alive but still dead in Spirit, all of them needed the Savior, the life giver. This is the "sea" everyone was taken there, by the Devil, or his Agents, no matter what. Jesus Christ put an end to this situation. He put an end in this state of captivity upon the people, he can gives Life to all who believe in him, in his name, beggining first with Abraham and those who were gathered to him, and then to all who had died before him, if they believe in him. Later to his own disciples and the women, when he was raised from the dead, and since that time to everyone who believes in him. Heavens is his inheritance and for his children the redeemed ones. He is now the Judge of all, there is no more captivity upon everyone. If there was still captivity, or SEA he cannot be the Judge of all, he cannot have the Keys of Hades and Death. He cannot rein as the King of Kings, in the Throne of God....... He has Judge the Devil, prophecy in Genesis has been fullfilled, the seed of the woman has Judge the Devil and destroy his authority upon the people. no more one inheritance for mankind. The Devil can have only those who denied to believed in Jesus Christ. JESUS CHRIST has to deside where everyone goes. He had the Keys of Hades, and Death, he conquer death in his life on earth, Death did not sting him, O! Death where is your sting. those who had the opportunity to believe, but they didn't and we say they choose death and not the life, we said they choose death, not because death was upon them, but because they rejected the Lifegiver. There is no more death upon the humanity. Isaiah 61:1, Luke 4:17, Isaiah 9:2, Luke 1:73, 79, 72, 73. 74. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Limey_Bob Posted May 5, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 327 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 172 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 5, 2017 13 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: There 2.2 Billion Christian in this century (21st). Then add the numbers of Great Awakenings and conversions in each century. See how many at Pentecost were saved, 3,000 and then 4,000. Add up the believers over 2017yrs and I think you'll find at least a trillion. Ridiculous! A trillion is one million x one million = a Trillion (1,000, 000, 000, 000). If you assume that a generation is 50 years, then 2,000 years divided by 50 = 40 generations. Let us assume that you have 1 billion Christians (1,000,000,000) per generation, that's a total of 40 billion Christians. For most of world history, the entire world population has been well under a billion. But 40 billion is 4% of a trillion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted May 5, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted May 5, 2017 Come on ... about how many believers. First, there will be believers from before Christ, so just the last 2000 years is incorrect. Second, Jesus said in Matthew 7:13-14 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it." so not many will be saved in comparison to how many lived. Only God knows how many are saved, so why argue about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted May 5, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,157 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,444 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted May 5, 2017 God answer the question about no more sea... Revelation 21:1 (NKJV) REVELATION 21 All Things Made New [21:1] Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. [2] Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. [3] And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. [4] “And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; >there shall be no more< death, nor >sorrow<, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.” [5] Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and faithful.” [6] And He said to me, “It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts. The reasoning of no more sea in The Scripture... in Genesis we find due to sins increase so all the world, but one family, thought and obeyed it continually God brought the destruction of by flood... that was brought about by God breaking up the deep! God 's love for His creation and that which sin had brought about is a reminder of... The eternal state God will remove all that was and reminders there of >sorrows< ... Ezekiel 33:11 (NKJV) [11] “Say to them: ‘As I live,’ says the Lord GOD, ‘I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?’ Luke 19:41 (NKJV) [41] Now as He drew near, He saw the city and wept over it, [42] saying, “If you had known, even you, especially in this your day, the things that make for your peace! But now they are hidden from your eyes. [43] “For days will come upon you when your enemies will build an embankment around you, surround you and close you in on every side, [44] “and level you, and your children within you, to the ground; and they will not leave in you one stone upon another, because you did not know the time of your visitation.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted May 6, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.57 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted May 6, 2017 20 hours ago, Limey_Bob said: Ridiculous! A trillion is one million x one million = a Trillion (1,000, 000, 000, 000). If you assume that a generation is 50 years, then 2,000 years divided by 50 = 40 generations. Let us assume that you have 1 billion Christians (1,000,000,000) per generation, that's a total of 40 billion Christians. For most of world history, the entire world population has been well under a billion. But 40 billion is 4% of a trillion. Do you know the census of every century? The numbers fluxated considerably. It you count deaths as well as those who lived as Christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Limey_Bob Posted May 6, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 327 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 172 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/30/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 6, 2017 23 hours ago, OneLight said: Come on ... about how many believers. First, there will be believers from before Christ, so just the last 2000 years is incorrect. Second, Jesus said in Matthew 7:13-14 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it." so not many will be saved in comparison to how many lived. Only God knows how many are saved, so why argue about it? I agree its ridiculous, but Fidei Defensor said that one Trillion Christians have been saved and I was refuting this statement of his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts