Heb 13:8 Posted May 27, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,533 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 27, 2017 17 hours ago, wingnut- said: II Corinthians 5:We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. Paul here is saying he would rather be clothed in his resurrected body than be naked in the grave. The "tent" he is speaking of is our resurrected body.. Rom 8:18-25 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God. 22We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently. 1 Cor 15:50 I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.” 2 Cor 5:1-4 For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. 2Meanwhile we groan, longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, 3because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. 4For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 27, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 27, 2017 16 hours ago, Heb 13:8 said: Souls cannot exist without bodies. Scripture says otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heb 13:8 Posted May 27, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,533 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 27, 2017 36 minutes ago, wingnut- said: Scripture says otherwise. Nah, hollywood says otherwise Job 34:14 If it were his intention and he withdrew his spirit and breath, 15all humanity would perish together and mankind would return to the dust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 27, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 27, 2017 1 hour ago, Heb 13:8 said: Nah, hollywood says otherwise Job 34:14 If it were his intention and he withdrew his spirit and breath, 15all humanity would perish together and mankind would return to the dust. I wouldn't know what Hollywood says, I don't watch TV or go to movies. I do know what the verse I posted said though, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. I also know in Revelation there are souls under the altar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heb 13:8 Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,533 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 14 minutes ago, wingnut- said: to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. You're taking one passage and drawing a conclusion from it, is sloppy exegesis. Paul here is saying he would rather be clothed in his resurrected body than be naked in the grave. The "tent" he is speaking of is our resurrected body.. Rom 8:18-25 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God. 22We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently. 1 Cor 15:50 I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.” 2 Cor 5:1-4 For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. 2Meanwhile we groan, longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, 3because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. 4For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. Quote I also know in Revelation there are souls under the altar. No there are no souls under the alter. It's symbolic wingnut, similar to how Abel's blood doesn't talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 1 minute ago, Heb 13:8 said: You're taking one passage and drawing a conclusion from it, is sloppy exegesis. Paul here is saying he would rather be clothed in his resurrected body than be naked in the grave. The "tent" he is speaking of is our resurrected body.. You post the verse and fail to grasp what it says. II Corinthians 5 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. Earthly house, do you see that? That is the body you currently have. Destroyed, do you see that? The resurrected body cannot be destroyed, it is immortal. My exegesis is fine, your understanding is another question. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heb 13:8 Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,533 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 16 minutes ago, wingnut- said: Earthly house, do you see that? That is the body you currently have. I have a better idea. See if you can connect the dots in red here. What do you see? Do you see the first resurrection? Take your time... 1. groan 2. redemption of our bodies 3. clothe / clothed / unclothed Rom 8:18-25 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God. 22We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently. 1 Cor 15:50 I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.” 2 Cor 5:1-4 For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. 2Meanwhile we groan, longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, 3because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. 4For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heb 13:8 Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,533 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 1 Joined: 11/03/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 21 minutes ago, wingnut- said: You post the verse and fail to grasp what it says. II Corinthians 5 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. Earthly house, do you see that? That is the body you currently have. Destroyed, do you see that? The resurrected body cannot be destroyed, it is immortal. My exegesis is fine, your understanding is another question. God bless Correct, the resurrected body cannot be destroyed. Very good. Are you starting to get it? IF IF IF.. II Corinthians 5 For we know that IF our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, WE HAVE a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, Heb 13:8 said: I have a better idea. See if you can connect the dots in red here. What do you see? Do you see the first resurrection? Take your time... Lol, nice try changing to completely different scripture. I understand the difference between the natural body and the spiritual body, so try to comprehend what the passage we are discussing says first. Misdirection, nice try lol. II Corinthians 5 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. The two are discussed right there, the tent which can be destroyed is the natural body, the building from God is the spiritual body, it cannot be destroyed, it is immortal. II Corinthians 5:2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed with our habitation which is from heaven, 3 if indeed, having been clothed, we shall not be found naked. 4 For we who are in this tent groan, being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed, that mortality may be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. In the earthly body we groan, to be clothed in the spiritual body, only possible for believers. II Corinthians 5:6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. Believers can be confident in the natural body, but we are absent from the Lord, as in not with Him yet. Because we have faith in Him. II Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. Yes confident, because when this earthly tent is destroyed, we will be in His presence. We all get our spiritual bodies at the same time though, as Paul tells us later in the letter. That is why you see souls under the altar, because they are waiting for their spiritual bodies still. God bless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted May 28, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.12 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted May 28, 2017 35 minutes ago, Heb 13:8 said: You're taking one passage and drawing a conclusion from it, is sloppy exegesis. Paul here is saying he would rather be clothed in his resurrected body than be naked in the grave. The "tent" he is speaking of is our resurrected body.. Rom 8:18-25 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed. 20For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the freedom and glory of the children of God. 22We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 23Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption to sonship, the redemption of our bodies. 24For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what they already have? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet have, we wait for it patiently. 1 Cor 15:50 I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. 51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.” 2 Cor 5:1-4 For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands. 2Meanwhile we groan, longing to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, 3because when we are clothed, we will not be found naked. 4For while we are in this tent, we groan and are burdened, because we do not wish to be unclothed but to be clothed instead with our heavenly dwelling, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. No there are no souls under the alter. It's symbolic wingnut, similar to how Abel's blood doesn't talk. It is NOT symbolic; if souls couldn't exist outside of a body, there would be no way to reunite with the glorified body would there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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