PlanetChee Posted May 22, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 791 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 547 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/20/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 22, 2017 1 hour ago, notsolostsoul said: This why I go God 1st, scripture after. If he directs us to other scripture which he deems inspired by him he will send us seeking. God is always first. God was before anything else. Paul said all of nature delivers testimony of God so that we are of no excuse to not believe. Then God sent himself in the flesh of Christ so that The Word became flesh and dwelt among us. Immanuel, God with us. And that was a spoken ministry that expounded on the old testament bible that the Jews of the time would have known for attending temple. Much of Jesus' teachings expounded on parables they were familiar with. The bible was the inspiration of God so as to give testament of his presence in all things. So that those whom he calls in their flesh can find their proof of him in writing as well as in nature. Jesus told us, no one comes to his Father but the Father calls them forth. That is an innate awakening of God's presence within us. That instills for some, like in my personal testimony, a deep hunger that is not sated by anything else I sought to satisfy that urge to seek out what was trying to get my attention. I'd previously investigated all manner of faith and practice. Nothing felt like an eternal life long fit. Even though at the time it seemed right. I always gravitated toward the Bible. Then I'd start watching sermons on TV. Listening to Christian radio when in the car. That is what I believe Jesus was talking about when he said the Father calls us. And when we arrive at responding to that exclusive calling of us by name, as the bible tells us God knew that before we were born, it stops. That hunger to seek out that beckoning within. And it is replaced by a desire to remain wrapped in the comfort of having found my way home. I think that is what is happening in your personal journey. Because there are people all over the world that follow a religion. But with Christ it is a relationship made covenant in blood. And the blood of the lamb that covers all sins of the believer for all time is also I believe what inspires The Word to speak in our own bloodstream , which is life, to seek out the Son of God. And how we venture to find him, and feel that satisfaction of having arrived "home" in the Lord, is unique to each one of God's son's and daughters . Don't let anyone make you feel insecure as you journey to answer that calling. It is God's will that you seek. No one can overshadow that. But they can lend their own example of the opponent of God's truth laying up roadblocks so as to forestall the arrival of God's chosen to His heart and home. Pray for your enemies. But keep on seeking God in the manner he inspires you to travel so as to feel satisfied and at home once arrived. This is your eternal life we're speaking of. God's holy light guide your steps. Blessings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Bridges Posted May 23, 2017 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 1 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 349 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 300 Days Won: 2 Joined: 05/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2017 4 hours ago, Judas Machabeus said: How is this against TOS???? Claiming the cannon is not accurate? Is claiming the Bible is errant and not of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Judas Machabeus Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Wolf Bridges said: Claiming the cannon is not accurate? Is claiming the Bible is errant and not of God. Okay so what was said was: There is nothing in scripture one can point to as proof the cannon is accurate so can you give us the verse that tells us which books belong in the bible? Questioning the canon is not questioning the errancy of the bible. The canon would have to be IN the bible to question the errancy. So can you give me the verse that tells us the canon. This is why we have different canons in Christendom. Because the table of contents are not inspired. At least that's how I see, but I could be wrong. Happened once in this thread. Edited May 23, 2017 by Judas Machabeus Brain faster than fingures Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted May 23, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 711 Content Per Day: 0.28 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, Judas Machabeus said: Okay so what was said was: There is nothing in scripture one can point to as proof the cannon is accurate so can you give us the verse that tells us which books belong in the bible? Questioning the canon is not questioning the errancy of the bible. The canon would have to be IN the bible to question the errancy. So can you give me the verse that tells us the canon. This is why we have different canons in Christendom. Because the table of contents are not inspired. At least that's how I see, but I could be wrong. Happened once in this thread. Josephus said that the OT canon was unchanged for over 400 years by the time of Christ - and it "alone" was kept as scripture ... no other books. The term "scriptures" and even "all of scripture" is used repeatedly in the NT. Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, He expounded to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning Himself. So it is not the OT that is in question even in your own post since the NT makes it clear that they already had what Josephus claimed - an OT canon such that "in all the scriptures" was a well known term. Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures to SEE IF those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul - were so" Edited May 23, 2017 by BobRyan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Judas Machabeus Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 1 hour ago, BobRyan said: Josephus said that the OT canon was unchanged for over 400 years by the time of Christ - and it "alone" was kept as scripture ... no other books. The term "scriptures" and even "all of scripture" is used repeatedly in the NT. Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the Prophets, He expounded to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning Himself. So it is not the OT that is in question even in your own post since the NT makes it clear that they already had what Josephus claimed - an OT canon such that "in all the scriptures" was a well known term. Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures to SEE IF those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul - were so" I have to respectfully disagree with your conclusion. 80% of the OT quotes come from the Septuagint and only 20% from the Pharisee canon. So I have to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted May 23, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 711 Content Per Day: 0.28 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Judas Machabeus said: I have to respectfully disagree with your conclusion. 80% of the OT quotes come from the Septuagint and only 20% from the Pharisee canon. So I have to disagree. We would expect a Greek text such as the NT to quote from a Greek text such as Septuagint. But never does it quote from the apocrypha - because even the Jews knew (as did Jerome) that apocrypha was not included in the actual canon. So the hoped-for result of the NT text quoting the apocrypha out of the Septuagint - does not happen. Also the Jews did not wait another 400 years for Christians to tell them what is the OT. As I am sure we both agree. And the Jews today have no Tanakh with the Apocrypha in it - which is again irrefutable. In any case - we all have free will. I am not saying you must agree with me. Edited May 23, 2017 by BobRyan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Judas Machabeus Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 9 minutes ago, BobRyan said: In any case - we all have free will. I am not saying you must agree with me. Nor do you have to agree with me. I respect what you are saying. I just don't agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanetChee Posted May 23, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 791 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 547 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/20/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2017 21 minutes ago, BobRyan said: We would expect a Greek text such as the NT to quote from a Greek text such as Septuagint. But never does it quote from the apocrypha - because even the Jews knew (as did Jerome) that apocrypha was not included in the actual canon. So the hoped-for result of the NT text quoting the apocrypha out of the Septuagint - does not happen. Also the Jews did not wait another 400 years for Christians to tell them what is the OT. As I am sure we both agree. And the Jews today have no Tanakh with the Apocrypha in it - which is again irrefutable. In any case - we all have free will. I am not saying you must agree with me. Is the Book of Enoch part of the Apocrypha? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobRyan Posted May 23, 2017 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 711 Content Per Day: 0.28 Reputation: 266 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, PlanetChee said: Is the Book of Enoch part of the Apocrypha? I think the RCC Apocrypha is the same as Jerome's in the Vulgate http://www.usccb.org/bible/books-of-the-bible/ Tobit Judithr 1 Maccabees 2 Maccabees Wisdom Sirach Baruch - but the larger set is this 1 Esdras (Vulgate 3 Esdras) 2 Esdras (Vulgate 4 Esdras) Tobit Judith ("Judeth" in Geneva) Rest of Esther (Vulgate Esther 10:4 – 16:24) Wisdom Ecclesiasticus (also known as Sirach) Baruch and the Epistle of Jeremy ("Jeremiah" in Geneva) (all part of Vulgate Baruch) Song of the Three Children (Vulgate Daniel 3:24–90) Story of Susanna (Vulgate Daniel 13) The Idol Bel and the Dragon (Vulgate Daniel 14) Prayer of Manasses (Daniel) 1 Maccabees 2 Maccabees As for Enoch -- well then "reaching" now for the pseudepigrapha https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudepigrapha 3 Maccabees 4 Maccabees Assumption of Moses Ethiopic Book of Enoch (1 Enoch) Slavonic Second Book of Enoch Book of Jubilees 3 Baruch Letter of Aristeas Life of Adam and Eve Ascension of Isaiah Psalms of Solomon Sibylline Oracles 2 Baruch Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs Jerome's Vulgate included these texts as "Apocrypha" http://sacred-texts.com/bib/vul/index.htm TobiasJudithWisdomSirach Baruch1 Macabees2 Macabees Edited May 23, 2017 by BobRyan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Judas Machabeus Posted May 23, 2017 Share Posted May 23, 2017 3 hours ago, PlanetChee said: Is the Book of Enoch part of the Apocrypha? No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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