ERRORS of the POST-TRIB. view.

[Marilyn C]

4 hours ago, Reinitin said:

well i lean post trib but for none of the reasons you listed. Jesus said. when he explained the wheat and the tares. "First gather the tares bundle them and throw them in the fire." 

there are tons of scriptures in context that plainly tell us, give us instructions, warn us, and encourage us to endure. Pre trib is a very few out of context obscure verses and all the blanks filled with human explanation and ideology. surely there are hidden treasures for us all through scripture but the Lord did not hide his plans from us. He doesnt want us to be caught unaware.  1 thess 5.

 

Hi Reinitin,

However who is the Lord talking to? Remember that the Body of Christ had not been revealed to man. (Eph. 3: 3 - 5) So if you think the Lord is talking about us, then He would have been deceitful to the people of Israel and a liar. As we well know, He is neither, so then He was talking to the people of Israel concerning their future.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[fixerupper]

2 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Reinitin,

However who is the Lord talking to? Remember that the Body of Christ had not been revealed to man. (Eph. 3: 3 - 5) So if you think the Lord is talking about us, then He would have been deceitful to the people of Israel and a liar. As we well know, He is neither, so then He was talking to the people of Israel concerning their future.

regards, Marilyn.

 

That's another pre-trib fabrication.  I would think people know better than to fall for such nonsense.  Whether a person was called a Christian before Mathew 13 or 24 OR NOT is moot.  The words "elect and chosen" are used over 20 times in the NT to indicate Christians, NOT ONCE ISRAEL OR JEWS!  It's really bad hermeneutics to use such an argument to support anything.  When the ministry of Jesus the CHRIST began, those who followed him were CHRISTIANS whether they were identified as such at that time OR NOT.  You folks really need to look not so much at what you believe, BUT WHY YOU BELIEVE IT.  I am just so thouroughly amazed and impressed that some Christians just can't see, refuse to see, or just don't care at the unscrupulous level of fabrication and contradiction in pretribulationism.  It's so bad, and such a false deceitful hope that leaves many with NO desire to prepare for tribulation, and one reason why we've been warned about it.  All this deems it the deceitful 'spirit' of pretribulationism.  It's a complete adding to and taking away, i.e. perversion of God's Word.

Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:  And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.  And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect (christians) from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

I can make a pretty good argument that John the Baptist is the first Christian AND the last OT prophet.

[Last Daze]

1 hour ago, fixerupper said:

I am just so thouroughly amazed and impressed that some Christians just can't see, refuse to see, or just don't care at the unscrupulous level of fabrication and contradiction in pretribulationism. 

In short, people believe whatever they want to believe for a number of reasons, and everyone thinks they're view is accurate.

In the final analysis, its not the accuracy of our eschatology that will deliver us.  A lifestyle of obedience to the will of God will give us the discernment we need and the strength to endure.  That should be our focus. 

[Last Daze]

50 minutes ago, inchrist said:

Welcome back!!!!...man you have been missed!

Thanks!  I've spent the past few months reflecting and re-calibrating.  Good to see you and the others too, and some new names.

[Reinitin]

6 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Reinitin,

However who is the Lord talking to? Remember that the Body of Christ had not been revealed to man. (Eph. 3: 3 - 5) So if you think the Lord is talking about us, then He would have been deceitful to the people of Israel and a liar. As we well know, He is neither, so then He was talking to the people of Israel concerning their future.

regards, Marilyn.

 

Wow. Accusing the Lord of being decietful and a liar if your doctrin isn't correct? His thoughts are not our thoughts and his ways are not our ways. The perfection of His purposes in Christ Jesus are way above human logic.

Jesus told the multitude of Israel Gods plans in a parable (and gives his reason for the parables) But spoke the command He will give His angel's to "First collect the tares" plainly. He was speaking to his disciples the first fruits in Gods Kingdom.

If you read Ephesians 2 you will have the context of the statement your referencing in Ephesians 3. With the context your point is a mute point.

God can deal with the rebellious and protect those in Christ.

God has promised to protect the physical seed of Israel and Jerusalem as a sign. The Spiritual Promises in Christ are extended to jew and gentile with out distinction gentiles are grafted into the same tree of life in Christ with Abrahams physical seed.

Verse Doctrins that take scripture out of context are just Cons.

Edited July 20, 2017 by Reinitin
typos

[Reinitin]

8 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Reinitin,

However who is the Lord talking to? Remember that the Body of Christ had not been revealed to man. (Eph. 3: 3 - 5) So if you think the Lord is talking about us, then He would have been deceitful to the people of Israel and a liar. 

 

I tried to just let this one slide but i do care for my brothers and sisters in Christ. So I implore you dear sister step back from your argument consider the Lords Holy Spirit within us and ask yourself are the words bolded in this text something that would come from The Spirt or from the arrogance of flesh or the arrigance of the deciever? What spirit is my doctrin concieved of? 

[Last Daze]

On 6/14/2017 at 2:19 AM, Marilyn C said:

The main reason, I believe that people think that the rapture is at the end of the tribulation, is because they confuse God`s purposes for – the Body of Christ, Israel and the Nations.

Hi Marilyn,

According to scripture, Paul told us when the rapture would take place.  It happens at the last trumpet, when the trumpet of God sounds.  Any explanation of the timing of the rapture needs to address those clear characteristics first and foremost.  Purposes, unless explicitly stated, are subjectively inferred.  Those characteristics are explicitly stated.

Who sounds the trumpet of God but God?  When is the last time He does so?  The timing of the rapture will line up with the scriptures that speak of the last time God sounds His trumpet.  Find those scriptures, find the rapture.

I can't find a time later than Zechariah 9:14.  Consequently, my view of the rapture is the time that that verse is speaking of whether you call it pre, post, mid, or whatever.  Its the last time I see God sounding His trumpet.  According to Paul, that's when the rapture happens.

[fixerupper]

6 hours ago, Reinitin said:

I tried to just let this one slide but i do care for my brothers and sisters in Christ. So I implore you dear sister step back from your argument consider the Lords Holy Spirit within us and ask yourself are the words bolded in this text something that would come from The Spirt or from the arrogance of flesh or the arrigance of the deciever? What spirit is my doctrin concieved of? 

It's sickening actually.  Several people on the forum like to prop their beliefs up by saying, "if we disagree with them we disagree with God, Jesus, the apostles, prophets, or the holy spirit and call them liars." 

I hate it.

[Reinitin]

10 minutes ago, fixerupper said:

It's sickening actually.  Several people on the forum like to prop their beliefs up by saying, "if we disagree with them we disagree with God, Jesus, or the holy spirit and call them liars." 

I hate it.

yeah, it is scary.

[Marilyn C]

7 hours ago, Reinitin said:

Wow. Accusing the Lord of being decietful and a liar if your doctrin isn't correct? His thoughts are not our thoughts and his ways are not our ways. The perfection of His purposes in Christ Jesus are way above human logic.

Jesus told the multitude of Israel Gods plans in a parable (and gives his reason for the parables) But spoke the command He will give His angel's to "First collect the tares" plainly. He was speaking to his disciples the first fruits in Gods Kingdom.

If you read Ephesians 2 you will have the context of the statement your referencing in Ephesians 3. With the context your point is a mute point.

God can deal with the rebellious and protect those in Christ.

God has promised to protect the physical seed of Israel and Jerusalem as a sign. The Spiritual Promises in Christ are extended to jew and gentile with out distinction gentiles are grafted into the same tree of life in Christ with Abrahams physical seed.

Verse Doctrins that take scripture out of context are just Cons.

Hi Reinitin,

Thank you for your comments. I see we read those scriptures differently. So can you explain please, what you believe the Apostle Paul was saying, by the Holy Spirit, -

`...how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I wrote before in a few words, by which, when you read you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His apostles and prophets., that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ...` (Eph. 3: 6)

Thank you, Marilyn.