Guest shiloh357 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 Will gay people go to heaven? It's a question that not many pastors--even conservative ones--would want to answer. Because the answer isn't one that society wants to hear. And many pastors these days would rather avoid public persecution than speak the truth. But not Pastor John MacArthur of the evangelical Grace Community Church in Sun Valley, California. In a panel last month, the pastor was asked a very tough question concerning homosexuality, reports the Christian Post. And his answer was very bold, as he frankly answered that no one is gay. "If you mean by that, 'That's some hardwiring,' no one is gay," he said. "People commit adultery, they commit sins of homosexuality, they lie, they steal, they cheat. That's like saying, 'You know, I keep robbing banks, but I'm a robber. I'm a bank robber. What am I gonna do? I'm a bank robber.' That is not an excuse for what you do." "Are there certain kind of impulses that lead people in that direction? Yes. But I think one of the really deadly aspects of this is to let people define themselves as gay," he continued. "They are not gay any more than an adulterer is hardwired to be forced by his own nature to commit adultery. Those are all behavioral sins that are condemned in scripture. God didn't hardwire anybody in such a way that they are not responsible for certain behaviors." MacArthur ended his answer by saying that calling people gay is actually doing them a disservice by "letting them define themselves by that sin." http://www.faithfamilyamerica.com/pastor_john_macarthur_stuns_with_answer_to_gays_getting_into_heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne222 Posted July 7, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 32 Topic Count: 471 Topics Per Day: 0.17 Content Count: 6,543 Content Per Day: 2.30 Reputation: 7,619 Days Won: 9 Joined: 06/12/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted July 7, 2017 I think maybe something biological could be off in some people. Remember after the fall we were no longer perfect in our selfs. Its still sin but who can know in all cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notsolostsoul Posted July 7, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 38 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 419 Content Per Day: 0.16 Reputation: 204 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/07/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 7, 2017 Will Murderers, Rapists, Child Molesters, Adulterers, Liars...etc go to heaven? No sin is greater nor less than any other. Only God will decide who goes to heaven. He gives us all warnings on what we should not do, yet we all fail somewhere. So why would some go and not others? It's God's choice. Who are we to judge or say who does? Maybe this separation (persecution, outcasting, condescension, egotism) towards gay people from some Christ followers is a test in itself? These are all God's people, he gave them life. He sees them, He knows their heart and He will judge them accordingly and call to heaven who he sees fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 13 minutes ago, notsolostsoul said: Will Murderers, Rapists, Child Molesters, Adulterers, Liars...etc go to heaven? No sin is greater nor less than any other. Only God will decide who goes to heaven. He gives us all warnings on what we should not do, yet we all fail somewhere. So why would some go and not others? It's God's choice. Who are we to judge or say who does? Maybe this separation (persecution, outcasting, condescension, egotism) towards gay people from some Christ followers is a test in itself? These are all God's people, he gave them life. He sees them, He knows their heart and He will judge them accordingly and call to heaven who he sees fit. Actually, we already know who will go to heaven. Only those who have trusted in Jesus as their Savior and Lord, who have received eternal life will go to heaven. Those who practice homosexuality or make a lifestyle of sin prove they have not obeyed the Gospel. One cannot be a unrepentant, practicing liar, practicing homosexual, practicing thief, etc. andenter the Kingdom of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Wayne222 said: I think maybe something biological could be off in some people. Remember after the fall we were no longer perfect in our selfs. Its still sin but who can know in all cases. Homosexuality is a sin in all cases. There is nothing biological about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notsolostsoul Posted July 7, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 38 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 419 Content Per Day: 0.16 Reputation: 204 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/07/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 7, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: Actually, we already know who will go to heaven. Only those who have trusted in Jesus as their Savior and Lord, who have received eternal life will go to heaven. Those who practice homosexuality or make a lifestyle of sin prove they have not obeyed the Gospel. One cannot be a unrepentant, practicing liar, practicing homosexual, practicing thief, etc. andenter the Kingdom of God. Who is to say when God turns around or forgives an individual? We can speak, preach and attempt to enforce God's word but in the end GOD DECIDES. So yes we have word of what we should avoid or turn from, but each individual gets dealt with by God on an individual bases. We are not to Judge, He is. We don't decide who goes to heaven, He does. We should only lead to God, not try and dictate God's outcome or Judgement. Nor another's salvation. Edited July 7, 2017 by notsolostsoul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 3 minutes ago, notsolostsoul said: Who is to say when God turns around or forgives an individual? When a person repents. God's forgiveness must be received. It is not automatic. Quote We can speak, preach and attempt to enforce God's word but in the end GOD DECIDES. Yes, and He has decided that only those who have received Jesus as personal Savior and Lord go to Heaven, as they are the only ones who have accepted God's forgiveness. Quote So yes we have word of what we should avoid or turn from, but each individual gets dealt with by God on an individual bases. Yes, which is why we all must have a personal relationship with God through Jesus in order to be saved and make it to heaven. Quote We are not to Judge, He is. We don't decide who goes to heaven, He does. We should only lead to God, not try and dictate God's outcome or Judgement. Nor another's salvation. God has already decided who will be saved. He has decided that those who trust in Jesus are saved. It is not a mystery and God doesn't leave us in the dark about it. The Bible is very clear on the matter. God has already explained how a person is saved and that only those who are saved will enter the Kingdom. Time for you believe the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notsolostsoul Posted July 8, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 38 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 419 Content Per Day: 0.16 Reputation: 204 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/07/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 8, 2017 37 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: The Bible is very clear on the matter. Yes Written Word is clear on these matters and many others. Yet God is not confined to written word. 38 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: God has already explained how a person is saved and that only those who are saved will enter the Kingdom. Written Word gives an explanation of what God has inspired but as you said: 40 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: we all must have a personal relationship with God through Jesus in order to be saved and make it to heaven. How can we as humans judge God's personal relationship with another individual? We can not. I do not control God and "God is not confined to what is written." Humans had law before and Jesus was sent to explain that the way the law was practiced was not how God intended. What we may think God has explained in written word may not be as easily understood as most interpret. He thinks differently than we think. HE KNOWS. WE assume off of what we are given and from human understanding. I repeat, "GOD IS NOT CONFINED TO WHAT IS WRITTEN." Nor is He limited by what we think we know. HE gives GRACE to all HE chooses. Not what or whom man agrees he should or will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bryan Posted July 8, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 422 Content Per Day: 0.06 Reputation: 319 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/13/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted July 8, 2017 1 hour ago, notsolostsoul said: Will Murderers, Rapists, Child Molesters, Adulterers, Liars...etc go to heaven? No sin is greater nor less than any other. Only God will decide who goes to heaven. He gives us all warnings on what we should not do, yet we all fail somewhere. So why would some go and not others? It's God's choice. Who are we to judge or say who does? Maybe this separation (persecution, outcasting, condescension, egotism) towards gay people from some Christ followers is a test in itself? These are all God's people, he gave them life. He sees them, He knows their heart and He will judge them accordingly and call to heaven who he sees fit. Nicely summarized. Christians spend a lot of time talking about homosexuality compared to other sins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culinary Posted July 8, 2017 Group: Junior Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 121 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 321 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/25/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 8, 2017 Who are we to say if it is biological or not? We are not God and while our moral convictions lead us to believe that it would be unfathomable that it would be biological the truth is that we really do not know. The bible is just a sampling of God's beliefs and it's interpreted by us...imperfect human beings. Aside from that what difference does it make. Homosexuality is a sin just as so many other things are. While we don't condone those behaviors as Christians we also have compassion for and empathy for those individuals who commit those sins. We as Christians are all imperfect human beings, servants of God and He created us, not to be perfect but to be human. He tells us to honor all parts of the body..even the weak...the unpresentable parts. As a human being and Christian it's hard for me to believe that someone would willingly choose to be homosexual or transgender or anything like that. The opposition that they face and live with on a daily basis is just so horrible. Look at the statistics for suicides in that demographic....its staggering. In my heart I just can't believe that someone would willingly choose that for themselves. It's not our place or job to judge these individuals. We can agree or disagree...but it's our job to love. That's the greatest task as a Christian is to love and to bestow grace to the people of the world...and that includes homosexuals. As a Christian I feel that it's our job not to judge and condemn others based upon my convictions but to try to build a bridge of understanding, of love, empathy and compassion. Maybe if we spent more time and attention on those things then we could have peace among all of God's people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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