Sower Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,246 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,847 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Online Share Posted July 23, 2017 8 hours ago, Mateo said: 14 hours ago, Gary Lee said: Mateo, you do realize you are proving what everyone has been trying to show you, by your remark above to your fellow Christian, missmuffet. 1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us 1Ti 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. Why does Paul say he is chief? You know why. "sinners; of whom I am chief" . Reasonable easy to understand. What do you say about the other verse, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" Is this one too difficult to understand? What do you believe this means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 331 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 117 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 22 minutes ago, Gary Lee said: You know why. "sinners; of whom I am chief" . Reasonable easy to understand. What do you say about the other verse, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" Is this one too difficult to understand? What do you believe this means? It means (starting in verse 7) that if we walk in light Jesus will cleanse us from ALL sin. But if we say we have no sin to be cleansed of (verse 8) then we are a liar and the truth is not in us because all have sinED and come short of the glory of God(this is where you can use Romans 3:23). Rather than saying you have no sin to be cleansed of(like in 1 John 1:8), Confess your sins(verse 9) and Jesus Christ is faithful and just to cleanse you from ALL unrighteousness(also in verse 9 and remember verse 7). Now if you say that you have not sinED you are a liar (verse 10, also remember Romans 3:23). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coheir Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 104 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,458 Content Per Day: 0.55 Reputation: 729 Days Won: 5 Joined: 02/09/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/31/1950 Share Posted July 23, 2017 16 minutes ago, Mateo said: It means (starting in verse 7) that if we walk in light Jesus will cleanse us from ALL sin. But if we say we have no sin to be cleansed of (verse 8) then we are a liar and the truth is not in us because all have sinED and come short of the glory of God(this is where you can use Romans 3:23). Rather than saying you have no sin to be cleansed of(like in 1 John 1:8), Confess your sins(verse 9) and Jesus Christ is faithful and just to cleanse you from ALL unrighteousness(also in verse 9 and remember verse 7). Now if you say that you have not sinED you are a liar (verse 10, also remember Romans 3:23). in all the world there has only one man that was sinless none since Jesus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sower Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,246 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,847 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Online Share Posted July 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, Mateo said: 37 minutes ago, Gary Lee said: You know why. "sinners; of whom I am chief" . Reasonable easy to understand. What do you say about the other verse, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" Is this one too difficult to understand? What do you believe this means? It means (starting in verse 7) that if we walk in light Jesus will cleanse us from ALL sin. But if we say we have no sin to be cleansed of (verse 8) then we are a liar and the truth is not in us because all have sinED and come short of the glory of God(this is where you can use Romans 3:23). Rather than saying you have no sin to be cleansed of(like in 1 John 1:8), Confess your sins(verse 9) and Jesus Christ is faithful and just to cleanse you from ALL unrighteousness(also in verse 9 and remember verse 7). Now if you say that you have not sinED you are a liar (verse 10, also remember Romans 3:23). Mateo. I ask you a specific question, what does 1jn; 8 mean. "If we say that we "have" (not had) no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" You cannot explain it away, as, God is light, and in Him is no darkness, at all. That verse is truth, no matter how you try to bring in your other thoughts about it. I'll agree with you that just about everybody that is born from above, with the Holy Spirit within for guidance, could HIT THE TARGET more often than we do. But not every time. The more you grow, the more you know, the more targets there are to hit, that you didn't even know about. To whom much is given, much is required. I'm still learning, and by God's grace, will continue to recognize more of the targets God has for me. And learn to trust in God for better aim. Php_3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 331 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 117 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 9 minutes ago, coheir said: in all the world there has only one man that was sinless none since Jesus The sinless Jesus lives in the Christian by the power of the Holy Spirit. Read Romans 8:11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 331 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 117 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 1 hour ago, Gary Lee said: Mateo. I ask you a specific question, what does 1jn; 8 mean. "If we say that we "have" (not had) no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" You cannot explain it away, as, God is light, and in Him is no darkness, at all. That verse is truth, no matter how you try to bring in your other thoughts about it. I'll agree with you that just about everybody that is born from above, with the Holy Spirit within for guidance, could HIT THE TARGET more often than we do. But not every time. The more you grow, the more you know, the more targets there are to hit, that you didn't even know about. To whom much is given, much is required. I'm still learning, and by God's grace, will continue to recognize more of the targets God has for me. And learn to trust in God for better aim. Php_3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Paul there is talking about the resurrection. Question: what's more powerful your sinful nature or the power of God? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 331 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 117 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/12/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Yowm said: So does the flesh exist in the Christian... Galatians 5:17 KJV [17] For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. Romans 7:16-18 NASBS [16] But if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good. [17] So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me. [18] For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. Yes.You must read the scripture in context Read Galatians 5:16. Also you must understand the context of Romans 7 which Paul gives in Romans 7:1, he is speaking as one under the law of sin and death (see Romans 7:23). A Christian is not under the law of sin and death (see Romans 8: 1-2 and compare it to Romans 7:23, ask yourself which category do you fall under). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 53 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,412 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,508 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted July 23, 2017 23 hours ago, Mateo said: Where does the Bible say sin will cease when we are in His Presence. Then you miss the meaning of Holy. God is Holy and we will be in his presence and be co-heirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 185 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,224 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,647 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted July 23, 2017 23 hours ago, Mateo said: No, he's saying he writes that so we do not sin. Where does he say habitual. If we keep sinning we have an advocate? Does that make sense? 23 hours ago, Yowm said: It means a life of habitual sin...not that we won't have lapses or failures which is sin. The verb tenses in 1 John regarding sin are not accurately translated into English. There are some Greek word forms that have no English equivalent. 1Jn 3:2 English Standard Version" Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. 1Jn 3:3 And everyone who thus hopes in him purifies himself as he is pure. 1Jn 3:4 Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. 1Jn 3:5 You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. 1Jn 3:6 No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. 1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. 1Jn 3:6 Amplified Version: No one who abides in Him [who lives and remains in communion with and in obedience to Him—deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] commits (practices) sin. No one who [habitually] sins has either seen or known Him [recognized, perceived, or understood Him, or has had an experiential acquaintance with Him]. 1Jn 3:4 Textus Receptus LITV Everyone practicing sin also practices lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. 1Jn 3:5 And you know that that One was revealed that He might take away our sins, and sin is not in Him. 1Jn 3:6 Everyone remaining in Him does not sin. Everyone sinning has not seen Him, nor known Him. 1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no one lead you astray; the onepracticing righteousness is righteous, even as that One is righteous. 1Jn 3:8 The one practicing sin is of the devil, because the devil sins from the beginning. For this the Son of God was revealed, that He might undo the works of the devil. 1Jn 3:4 WUEST (4-8) Everyone who habitually commits sin, also habitually commits lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. And you know absolutely that that One was manifested in order that He might take away our sins; and sin in Him does not exist. Everyone who in Him is constantly abiding is not habitually sinning. Everyone who is constantly sinning has not with discernment seen Him, nor has he known Him, with the result that that condition is true of him at present. Little born-ones, stop allowing anyone to be leading you astray. The one who habitually does righteousness is righteous, just as that One is righteous. The one who is habitually committing sin is out of the devil as a source, because from the beginning the devil has been sinning. For this purpose there was manifested the Son of God, in order that He might bring to naught the works of the devil. These verses have not "watered down" sin as I have heard some say. They have captured the original Greek word more correctly and accurately. This is true of both Textus Receptus, the Byzantine Majority texts, and the alexandrian texts. No difference in this respect. KJV and most Bibles have done a very poor job of translating words that have no direct English translation, as to tense especially. This is one more reason why I don't prefer KJV. Php 3:9 ESV and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith— Php 3:10 that I may know him and the power of his resurrection, and may share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, Php 3:11 that by any means possible I may attain the resurrection from the dead. Php 3:12 Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own. Php 3:13 Brothers, I do not consider that I have made it my own. But one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead, Php 3:14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. Php 3:15 Let those of us who are mature think this way, and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal that also to you. Mature and perfect are both good translations of the same Greek word. Being made perfect is in fact the process of maturing as Christians, of being conformed to the likeness of Christ. No one has arrived at the perfection of God the Christ. But we keep pressing on toward that goal. Not even Paul considered himself to have attained the perfection of Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sower Posted July 23, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,246 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,847 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Online Share Posted July 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Mateo said: Paul there is talking about the resurrection. Question: what's more powerful your sinful nature or the power of God? The one you submit to. Question; which fishing lure in your tackle box catches the most fish? Answer; The one you use the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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