Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 11, 2017 Hello all, I've been trying to figure out who God's "elect" are. Some Christians (who believe in "once saved, always saved") apparently believe that *all* born-again Christians are of God's "elect." When speaking of God's "elect," I found the following Bible verses to be of interest: "For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified." (Romans 8:29-30) NKJV [and then, just a few verses later]: "Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies." (Romans 8:33) NKJV From these Bible verses, it appears to me that with regards to God's "elect," salvation is already a "done deal." Could this mean then that "once saved, always saved" is accurate for *all* born-again Christians? Perhaps... However, I found something in the book of Hebrews that may possibly indicate that at least some born-again Christians *can* lose their salvation: "For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame." Hebrews 6:4-6) KJV Please notice: the people being spoken of here were "...made partakers of the Holy Ghost..." [i.e., of the Holy Spirit]. Apparently, these people *had* become born-again Christian believers, and yet, by "falling away," they appear to have lost their salvation. But if they lost their salvation, then it would seem (at least to me) to indicate that they - even though having become born-again Christian believers (at least, for a period of time) - were *not* of God's "elect." So my question is: are *all* born-again Christian believers of God's "elect," or not? Does anyone here have any thoughts to share on this? (Thanks for reading my post.) Lar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aimes Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 26 Topic Count: 35 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,734 Content Per Day: 2.77 Reputation: 8,345 Days Won: 21 Joined: 08/29/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 11, 2017 I have to agree with Yowm here, I think the references in the NT are speaking of all believers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 (edited) Hi Yowm, Thanks for your reply to my post. I understand what you are saying here. Actually, my understanding with regards to God's elect in the church age is that *none* of those born-again Christian believers who are *elect* will lose their salvation! The passages in Hebrews 6:4-6 still do confuse me a bit though. The persons that Hebrews 6:4-6 described had (apparently) been "...partakers of the Holy Ghost..." (a.k.a. the Holy Spirit). Therefore, it would appear to me that - for however short a time - these persons actually *were* born-again Christian believers. But in Hebrews 6:4-6, these persons were described as *falling away*, and therefore, unable to renew their salvation. (because if so, then it would mean the unthinkable - that is, that Christ would have to be crucified all over again on their behalf - which, [the Bible says] - would then have exposed Him to open shame - and therefore, this would be not only unthinkable but also impossible! Therefore, I have to conclude that the persons spoken of in Hebrews 6:4-6 were - (even if only in a temporary way) - "Christians." So therefore, it does not seem to me that these persons could possibly have been of God's elect. Because God's elect are (spiritually) spoken of (in Romans 8) as having *already* been glorified. So are *all* true born-again Christians of God's elect? Yes they are -- but with the possible exception of the "temporary Christians" spoken of in Hebrews 6:4-6. Yowm, do you see why the passages in Hebrews 6:4-6 tend to confuse me? Certainly, God *already knows* who is (and who isn't) going to be genuinely saved. So maybe I'm just "splitting hairs" here, but it does somehow appear that there will be some persons, who, (if even only for a little while) will have the "status" of being "Christians," but who will *not* be of God's elect. And *that* was what prompted me to ask my question in the first place. Lar Edited September 11, 2017 by Lar I accidentally added an incorrect word... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 Hi The Aimes87, I understand your point... Thank you for responding to my post. Would you please read my above response to Yowm? Thank you. Lar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDofTX Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 66 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 32 Days Won: 0 Joined: 08/14/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 11, 2017 God's Elect is Jesus. All who abide in Christ are God's Elect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 Hello AlexDofTX, You make an interesting point here. I do agree with your thinking on this. Thanks for reading my post. Lar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 Thank you Giller, My goodness, I certainly have gotten quite a bit of interest in my question. May God bless you, Lar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.81 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted September 11, 2017 God's elect are all those who genuinely believe that Jesus Christ is the risen Son of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 Hi missmuffet (and all who have replied to me), Perhaps I may have been "splitting hairs" in my original question, but when I had first read Hebrews 6:4-6, it kind of upset me a bit. However, all of the thoughtful and interesting replies that I have received have made me feel better about things now. Thanks... Lar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lar Posted September 11, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 92 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 72 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/05/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 11, 2017 Hi missmuffet, Thanks for sharing that truth; apparently, as long as Christians believe that Jesus is the risen Son of God, then they are of God's elect. And if they stop believing that, then they never were of God's elect. Lar P.S. (I seemed to have lost my first response to you just now - I hope that this isn't a double-post!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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