Fidei Defensor Posted September 25, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 25, 2017 (edited) The Byzantines were Eastern Romans, their capital of Byzantium was Constantinople (Instanbul) which is in Modern Day Turkey. Their style of art was gold leaf, gold columns, and golden icons. Christ Pantokrator (Pantocrator) made of mosaic tiles, Hagia Sophia (Church of Holy Wisdom) in Istanbul, Turkey. Edited September 25, 2017 by Fidei Defensor 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annette Posted September 28, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 65 Topic Count: 105 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,568 Content Per Day: 1.40 Reputation: 4,029 Days Won: 7 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 28, 2017 On 9/25/2017 at 3:24 PM, Fidei Defensor said: The Byzantines were Eastern Romans, their capital of Byzantium was Constantinople (Instanbul) which is in Modern Day Turkey. Their style of art was gold leaf, gold columns, and golden icons. Christ Pantokrator (Pantocrator) made of mosaic tiles, Hagia Sophia (Church of Holy Wisdom) in Istanbul, Turkey. Thanks for giving us the name as well as the modern day name. That really helps. There is a lot to learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted September 28, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 28, 2017 4 hours ago, Annette said: Thanks for giving us the name as well as the modern day name. That really helps. There is a lot to learn. You are most welcome. The Byzantines were very sophisticated, and their art style reflects that (though it was two dimensional in style). To this day, Orthodox Christians use Byzantine style, when they make Icons (I will start thread on them soon). Icons are wood or metal 2D paintings of Saints and Jesus. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annette Posted September 29, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 65 Topic Count: 105 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,568 Content Per Day: 1.40 Reputation: 4,029 Days Won: 7 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted September 29, 2017 20 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: You are most welcome. The Byzantines were very sophisticated, and their art style reflects that (though it was two dimensional in style). To this day, Orthodox Christians use Byzantine style, when they make Icons (I will start thread on them soon). Icons are wood or metal 2D paintings of Saints and Jesus. You are putting a lot of work into this group, thank you. Blessings 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted September 29, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 29, 2017 1 hour ago, Annette said: You are putting a lot of work into this group, thank you. Blessings Thank you for the compliment. When I ran clubs at my college I always was all in and commited to making the experiance enjoyable and full of beauty (in art and presentation) and information. Its just how I am, Chriat made me this way (John 1:3, Colossians 1:16). ✝️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted September 29, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted September 29, 2017 (edited) ICONS The Byzantines invented an artform called Icons (which means image) because of command from God, "You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below." (Exodus 20:4). They took this so literally that they refuse to this day to depict Jesus or any of Saints in three dimensions via statues, and three dimensional art like busts. To this day Eastern Orthodox Christians who follow the Byzantine Rite, wither Greek or Slavonic will only use 2D Icons in their sanctuaries. The problem is the context of what LORD commands about art, "You are not to make for yourselves an idol (image of worship), or any likeness of what is in heaven above, or on earth below, or in the water under the earth." (Exodus 20:4). Idol and image of art are two different things; one is to worship a god, another is to appreciate and enjoy. Christ Pantocrator or Pantkrator Icon, Pantocrator is combination of words Y'WH (Yahweh) and Jehovah. You will notice that Jesus seems Mongolian or even Arab in coloring, this is because Eastern Orthodoxy had its seat, Constantinople in Turkey, so Jesus appears Turkish, just as Jesus appears in Asian paintings as Asian: Back to the Icons: The Icon above, has themes that all Icons have. Firstly, Icon means image, and this is because Orthodox Christians like the Byzantines believed that every human is in image of God, "So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." (Genesis 1:27). Every Eastern Orthodox Christian then believes you are icon of God, an image of God and that when you sin, you taint that image by "missing the mark" and must repent "turn from sin" to restore the image of God for others to see Him better. A beautiful thought no? But this goes futher, Orthodox believe icons, the painting you see above, is also an icon (person), and that icons are windows into heaven, time traveling devices back to those scenes depicted like Crucifixion, and etc. Icons are believed to be transmitters, and wormholes to other places; very mystical: According to the official stance on Icons in Eastern Orthodoxy, "they are windows into heaven and time". (From Book Praying with Icons, Linette Martin, Ancient Spiritual Disciples, and https://www.theosophical.org/publications/quest-magazine/42-publications/quest-magazine/1433-icons-windows-to-the-divine Icons act as transmitters, conduits, and windows into a spiritual dimensions, which frankly is rather creepy. I do not read anywhere in Scripture where an Apostle or Jesus emphasizes such mystical practices. Icons are suppose to help Orthodox travel in time to the event depicted or transport you spiritually to a place with them, and if you are Orthodox you suppose to greet an Icon as if its the person represented, wither Christ or saint, and kiss the icon. All of this is called veneration, but It boardens on idolatry and worse in my book. Most Icons feature at top in Greek these letters: IC XC, which is Christogram, Jesus' name abbreviated in Greek, "Iesous, Ἰησοῦς, οῦ, ὁ." Most depicitons of Jesus will have him making these letters (IC XC) with his hand. Slavonic and Russian Icons differ in that Jesus is depicted more traditional and caucasion: Often Slavonic or Russian Icons will be made of precious metals, gold, gems, and etc: Sources: I have studied Eastern Orthodoxy for five years by read books by Bishop Kallistos Ware's The Orthodox Church and Katherine Clark's Orthodox Church Simple Guides, read from The Orthodox Church: An Introduction to Its History, Doctrines, and Spiritual Culture by John Anthony McGuckin, watching videos of Orthodox Priests teaching theology and doxology, and visiting theological Orthodox sites. I have been to Eastern Orthodox Vigil Service. I have talked extensively with Father Photios, a priest in Eastern Orthodox Church. I have been in communication with Eastern Orthodox Ascetics and Monks. I have spent time reading on Icons, and their effects. -From Book Praying with Icons, Linette Martin, Ancient Spiritual Disciples and The Orthodox Church Simple Guides, Katherine Clark, and websites. I owned expensive Icons, IC XC Christ Pantokrator and had to throw them out. I had icons blessed by priests, I had expensive ones made of monastic church wood, and jeweled ones from Russia. I have since removed them after learning about their mystical properties and the strange doctrines and spiritually surrounding them. Edited September 30, 2017 by Fidei Defensor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annette Posted October 6, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 65 Topic Count: 105 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,568 Content Per Day: 1.40 Reputation: 4,029 Days Won: 7 Joined: 04/12/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 6, 2017 On 9/29/2017 at 3:35 PM, Fidei Defensor said: Thank you for the compliment. When I ran clubs at my college I always was all in and commited to making the experiance enjoyable and full of beauty (in art and presentation) and information. Its just how I am, Chriat made me this way (John 1:3, Colossians 1:16). ✝️ It is great that you have an opportunity to share something that you really seem to enjoy. Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debp Posted June 19, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 52 Topic Count: 1,010 Topics Per Day: 0.15 Content Count: 12,206 Content Per Day: 1.79 Reputation: 16,282 Days Won: 92 Joined: 07/19/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted June 19, 2018 On 9/29/2017 at 4:55 PM, Fidei Defensor said: ICONS The Byzantines invented an artform called Icons (which means image) because of command from God, "You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below." (Exodus 20:4). They took this so literally that they refuse to this day to depict Jesus or any of Saints in three dimensions via statues, and three dimensional art like busts. To this day Eastern Orthodox Christians who follow the Byzantine Rite, wither Greek or Slavonic will only use 2D Icons in their sanctuaries. The problem is the context of what LORD commands about art, "You are not to make for yourselves an idol (image of worship), or any likeness of what is in heaven above, or on earth below, or in the water under the earth." (Exodus 20:4). Idol and image of art are two different things; one is to worship a god, another is to appreciate and enjoy. Christ Pantocrator or Pantkrator Icon, Pantocrator is combination of words Y'WH (Yahweh) and Jehovah. You will notice that Jesus seems Mongolian or even Arab in coloring, this is because Eastern Orthodoxy had its seat, Constantinople in Turkey, so Jesus appears Turkish, just as Jesus appears in Asian paintings as Asian: Back to the Icons: The Icon above, has themes that all Icons have. Firstly, Icon means image, and this is because Orthodox Christians like the Byzantines believed that every human is in image of God, "So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." (Genesis 1:27). Every Eastern Orthodox Christian then believes you are icon of God, an image of God and that when you sin, you taint that image by "missing the mark" and must repent "turn from sin" to restore the image of God for others to see Him better. A beautiful thought no? But this goes futher, Orthodox believe icons, the painting you see above, is also an icon (person), and that icons are windows into heaven, time traveling devices back to those scenes depicted like Crucifixion, and etc. Icons are believed to be transmitters, and wormholes to other places; very mystical: According to the official stance on Icons in Eastern Orthodoxy, "they are windows into heaven and time". (From Book Praying with Icons, Linette Martin, Ancient Spiritual Disciples, and https://www.theosophical.org/publications/quest-magazine/42-publications/quest-magazine/1433-icons-windows-to-the-divine Icons act as transmitters, conduits, and windows into a spiritual dimensions, which frankly is rather creepy. I do not read anywhere in Scripture where an Apostle or Jesus emphasizes such mystical practices. Icons are suppose to help Orthodox travel in time to the event depicted or transport you spiritually to a place with them, and if you are Orthodox you suppose to greet an Icon as if its the person represented, wither Christ or saint, and kiss the icon. All of this is called veneration, but It boardens on idolatry and worse in my book. Most Icons feature at top in Greek these letters: IC XC, which is Christogram, Jesus' name abbreviated in Greek, "Iesous, Ἰησοῦς, οῦ, ὁ." Most depicitons of Jesus will have him making these letters (IC XC) with his hand. Slavonic and Russian Icons differ in that Jesus is depicted more traditional and caucasion: Often Slavonic or Russian Icons will be made of precious metals, gold, gems, and etc: Sources: I have studied Eastern Orthodoxy for five years by read books by Bishop Kallistos Ware's The Orthodox Church and Katherine Clark's Orthodox Church Simple Guides, read from The Orthodox Church: An Introduction to Its History, Doctrines, and Spiritual Culture by John Anthony McGuckin, watching videos of Orthodox Priests teaching theology and doxology, and visiting theological Orthodox sites. I have been to Eastern Orthodox Vigil Service. I have talked extensively with Father Photios, a priest in Eastern Orthodox Church. I have been in communication with Eastern Orthodox Ascetics and Monks. I have spent time reading on Icons, and their effects. -From Book Praying with Icons, Linette Martin, Ancient Spiritual Disciples and The Orthodox Church Simple Guides, Katherine Clark, and websites. I owned expensive Icons, IC XC Christ Pantokrator and had to throw them out. I had icons blessed by priests, I had expensive ones made of monastic church wood, and jeweled ones from Russia. I have since removed them after learning about their mystical properties and the strange doctrines and spiritually surrounding them. Thanks for the interesting information. Yes, that is very odd that they believe icons are transmitters to other places! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 23, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.58 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 23, 2018 On 6/19/2018 at 2:07 AM, Debp said: Thanks for the interesting information. Yes, that is very odd that they believe icons are transmitters to other places! I could understand if they meant transports you in a spiritual sense, as in remindinf you of Christ’s sacrifice and etc (like The Communion), but the official stance in The Eastern Orthodox Church is they are windows into spirit realm and can make you time travel. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debp Posted July 23, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 52 Topic Count: 1,010 Topics Per Day: 0.15 Content Count: 12,206 Content Per Day: 1.79 Reputation: 16,282 Days Won: 92 Joined: 07/19/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted July 23, 2018 2 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: I could understand if they meant transports you in a spiritual sense, as in remindinf you of Christ’s sacrifice and etc (like The Communion), but the official stance in The Eastern Orthodox Church is they are windows into spirit realm and can make you time travel. Yes, I could also understand the spiritual sense as well....but the spirit realm and time travel, well that's just too strange! Some years ago I went to a Greek festival. It was held by St. Sophia Church here in L.A. We went inside to sit and see the church....there was so much gold leaf on absolutely everything that it about knocked my eyes out! I thought that architecture would take away from the worship of God...my thoughts anyhow. It was so overwhelming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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