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Once Saved always Saved, Is A Doctrine Of Devils


Bro.Tan

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On 10/28/2017 at 10:35 PM, Bro.Tan said:

Then they become unbelievers and we know that Paul said in Romans 6:23

But that's the thing.....anybody who received knowledge of Christ and rejected it doesnt 'become' an unbeliever, they were never saved to begin with. They were always unbelievers

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15 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

I actually witness this, and seen people leave who have been in the word of God for years. I'm talking about keeping the commandments and all, with very good knowledge and understanding, basically all of what I preach.

One is not saved by keeping the commandments as though we are still under the Law

 

Acts 15:5

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

Jesus may have said Himself, Keep the commandments 

 

Matthew 19:17 

And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

But He said that because He hadnt DIED yet and thus men were still under the Law, not under grace.

Galatians 3:24 

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.


Galatians 3:25

But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

 

The people you speak of are likely those who still believed in keeping the Law. A true believer in Jesus doesnt ever leave

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19 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

I actually witness this, and seen people leave who have been in the word of God for years.

So you're the judge of who is born again or not? :rolleyes:

 

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2 hours ago, Heb 13:8 said:

So you're the judge of who is born again or not? :rolleyes:

 

In the scriptures its written in Proverbs 15: 2 The tongue of the wise useth knowledge aright: but the mouth of fools poureth out foolishness.

 

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6 hours ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

One is not saved by keeping the commandments as though we are still under the Law

 

Acts 15:5

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

Jesus may have said Himself, Keep the commandments 

 

Matthew 19:17 

And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

But He said that because He hadnt DIED yet and thus men were still under the Law, not under grace.

Galatians 3:24 

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.


Galatians 3:25

But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

 

The people you speak of are likely those who still believed in keeping the Law. A true believer in Jesus doesnt ever leave

I hope people go back and read my full reply, because my point was through Paul in Hebrews 12 Chapter and Peter. 

 

 

 

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21 hours ago, warrior12 said:

Bro. Tan.  So lets ask the question.  If a man believe and dies before he is baptized, is he saved or not ?.   When Christ shed his blood at the cross, all other sacrifices ended . Believers are now under the grace of God and though the law is not abandoned, it is God's grace through the blood of Jesus Christ which is embedded in that believer.   Paul in Romans 6 has explained this so well.  You can't keep every jot of the law, as you would spend your whole life just trying to do that.    Maybe some others here can shed this light better than i have as i am not a theologian to put it into proper words .     When a believer is saved, there are processes that starts to take place and when he examines the word and compares it with his life, he would make the necessary adjustments as he also has the helper to guide him along the way.   God did not save us and left us on our own, he knows that we would have struggles and trials here and at times we would fall short and he has provided graces for that, like repentance and others to build us up like sanctification.    It is a real time situation that every believer would experience if he is true to himself.

As far as I could grasp from the gospels and the NT,  we are not under the law of OT, but by grace.   It is not a licence to sin, but knowing who paid for your sins, not the blood of bulls and others, but by Jesus Christ. He paid it all.  The book of Romans is great in explaining who we are in Christ as born again believers.  But it must be read in context and not cherry pick sentences to get the full meaning of Paul, the apostle of Christ, chosen to be a messenger of his word.  

Think i am done here with this topic as it has been discussed here many times over and my few replies is enough. Thanks for the dialogue. 

Romans 6  King James Version (KJV)

13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Jesus will return real soon and reward us all according to our works (Revelation 22:12). Throughout the bible we find that in order to receive eternal salvation we must keep God's commandments to the end. If we make a mistake we must not give up, but continue to strive for the prize (Philippians 3:13-14). The last chapter in the whole bible reminds us of this one last time. "Blessed are they that do his commandments that they may have right to the tree of life." (Revelation 22:14). After this we find only seven more verses in the bible, and none of them does away with God's commandments. The commandments of God are not hard to keep (I John 5:3) and furthermore, they teach us love in the highest degree. If you love Jesus you will keep his commandments (St. John 14:15). You will not displease the Lord by: Worshipping other gods, having graven images, taking his name in vain, breaking his Sabbath day (which is Saturday not Sunday), or dishonoring your parents. On the other hand, if you love your neighbor as yourself you will not kill him, commit adultery with his spouse, steal from him, falsely accuse him, or covet anything of his. This is true love, and if obeyed how much better would our world be? This is why Jesus said that the two greatest commandments are loving the Lord with all your heart, soul, and mind; and loving your neighbor as yourself (Matthew 22:35-40). These two commandments are the foundation of the entire law. Many reject the law, but it is HOLY, JUST AND GOOD (Romans 7:12) even today.  

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

But that's the thing.....anybody who received knowledge of Christ and rejected it doesnt 'become' an unbeliever, they were never saved to begin with. They were always unbelievers

Let's take a look at this the way Jesus said in Matthew 13: 18 ¶ Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;

21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

 

 

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14 hours ago, Bro.Tan said:

In the scriptures its written in Proverbs 15: 2 The tongue of the wise useth knowledge aright: but the mouth of fools poureth out foolishness.

Bro, Rom 8:35, 38-39 are for those that are born again.

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9 hours ago, Heb 13:8 said:

Bro, Rom 8:35, 38-39 are for those that are born again.

Born again is a change in the body not the mind, but those who don't really read the Bible will not understand. 

Lets go into John 3:1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: 2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him. 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Notice verse 3, except a man is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. We have just learned something here. If you are not born again you can not see the kingdom of God. As we go further you will understand this. Remember there is a time for everything.

Nicodemus asked a very good question. Take a look at the next set of verses.

John 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? 5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

In verse 5, born of the water in this case is the Word of God. Notice the Lord mentions the kingdom of God again, but He adds a little more information. He says "Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. When he mentions spirit He means exactly that. Watch how the Lord gives something physical to describe exactly what He means.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Notice He made a difference between flesh and spirit.

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Notice He compared the wind to a spirit. Can you see the wind? No! We have seen things being blown around by the wind, but we have never seen the wind. If you are born of the spirit you are like the wind. This is when you are truly born again, when you are born of the spirit.

  

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11 minutes ago, Bro.Tan said:

Born again is a change in the body not the mind

This is not true, nor is it indicatd in anything else in your post(s) of Scripture .....

12 minutes ago, Bro.Tan said:

but those who don't really read the Bible will not understand. 

Yahweh grants the understanding of Scripture to infants,  of Salvation to Whom He Pleases,   and hides everything about Salvation from the educated,  (scholars)....

as Jesus Says,  because this is Yahweh's GOOD PLEASURE SO TO DO.

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