Do you really believe Revelations will unfold in our lifetime? Or do you "hedge the bet"?

[missmuffet]

50 minutes ago, Pudgenik said:

The rider of the white horse is not a person. 

When we look at the 4 horsemen of Revelation, the first thing that has to be established is thier starting point. They come from somewhere and go east north south and west. 

You can read about the "chariots" in Zechariah, chapter 6.

The starting point is Jerusalem. The Apple of God's eye.

The black horse goes north. Europe's economy is near chaotic. 

The dappled horse goes south. I read somewhere 90% of modern disease starts is Africa.

The red horse to the East. The enemies of Israel, Iran, Syria and so on. Terrorism.

So we have the White horse. And what is it conquering. It is Peace! The white horse represents peace. 

I always thought it interesting that all the nation's involved with the peace treaty between Egypt and Israel all had bow and arrows in thier nations emblem.

Another thing with the horsemen, especially with the black, dappled and red. People are not represented with them, just concepts* (there is a better word for it I just can't think of it). War, death/plague, economy.

First seal (6:1-2)  White horse: Antichrist

Second seal (6:3-4) Red horse: War

Third seal (6:5-6) Black horse: Famine

Fourth seal (6:7-8) Pale horse: Death and hell

Fifth seal ( 6:9-11) Martyrs in Heaven

Sixth seal ( 6:12-17) Universal Upheaval and Devastation

Seventh seal ( 8: 1-2) The Seven Trumpets

In the first seal there is a white horse which a man is sitting. He is carrying a bow, has been given a crown, and his purpose is to conquer. This is a Antichrist. He has a bow but no arrows.

[angels4u]

1 hour ago, Pudgenik said:

The rider of the white horse is not a person. 

When we look at the 4 horsemen of Revelation, the first thing that has to be established is thier starting point. They come from somewhere and go east north south and west. 

You can read about the "chariots" in Zechariah, chapter 6.

The starting point is Jerusalem. The Apple of God's eye.

The black horse goes north. Europe's economy is near chaotic. 

The dappled horse goes south. I read somewhere 90% of modern disease starts is Africa.

The red horse to the East. The enemies of Israel, Iran, Syria and so on. Terrorism.

So we have the White horse. And what is it conquering. It is Peace! The white horse represents peace. 

I always thought it interesting that all the nation's involved with the peace treaty between Egypt and Israel all had bow and arrows in thier nations emblem.

Another thing with the horsemen, especially with the black, dappled and red. People are not represented with them, just concepts* (there is a better word for it I just can't think of it). War, death/plague, economy.

Don't agree with your interpretation.

[Couppy]

7 hours ago, Sojourner414 said:

The thing is: the Tribulation is a time of such trouble that it hasn't been on the planet before, and a similar time will never happen again after it. As bad as things may be now, this is nothing compared to what the Tribulation will be like. An example is the "Black Death": at one point, Bubonic Plague ravaged nearly the entire planet, killing 30–60% of Europe's population, and reducing the world population from 450 million down to 350–375 million in the 14th century. It wasn't until the 17th century that the world population returned to pre-plague levels.

That was bad,  and WWI and II took millions of lives, but even those pale in comparison to the Tribulation. In Isaiah 13, we read a description about "The Day of the Lord":

"Behold, the day of the LORD is coming,  Cruel, with fury and burning anger,  To make the land a desolation; And He will exterminate its sinners from it. For the stars of heaven and their constellations  Will not flash forth their light;  The sun will be dark when it rises  And the moon will not shed its light. Thus I will punish the world for its evil  And the wicked for their iniquity; I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless. I will make mortal man scarcer than pure gold And mankind than the gold of Ophir. Therefore I will make the heavens tremble, And the earth will be shaken from its place  At the fury of the LORD of hosts  In the day of His burning anger." (Isaiah 13: 9-13, NASB, emphasis mine)

While there has been tremendous amounts of people killed in wars, famines, plagues and such, man is hardly "scarcer than pure gold"; last tally on the population of the planet (as of Oct. 2017): 7.6 Billion  people.

Another issue is that the Restrainer has not been taken from the Earth yet, not has the Antichrist entered into a covenant with "the many" just yet. The temple in Israel has not been rebuilt either; in fact, the "man of lawlessness" has not been revealed (re: the restrainer has not been removed so he can appear).

BTW: the only one given a sword was the second horseman, not the people:

" When He broke the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, “Come.” And another, a red horse, went out; and to him who sat on it, it was granted to take peace from the earth, and that men would slay one another; and a great sword was given to him. " (Revelation 6:3-4, NASB, emphasis mine)

The sword was given to him,  not them.

So in short: while I believe we are in the last days, we are not in the Tribulation.

You have just stated the End.  The End times will be a period in time.  It would be a gradual process but then as in the days of Noah, everything would be explained away and people will be getting on with their lives. 

As for the sword, it was given to him to take peace from the earth and men would slay one another.  Is that not already happening?  People are at war, there are rumours of war, and people being slayed to death unnecessarily.  We are not going to see this rider physically on a red horse taking peace from the earth.  The rider is going to operate in the spirit realm and all we would see is the manifestation of it on earth.

[Couppy]

6 hours ago, ayin jade said:

Times will get worse before the end times, I know that. But we are not in the tribulation yet. If you think we are, then please explain where the seals were met. 

The end times is not going to happen within a day.  There is no way we are going to be able to pinpoint the start of the end times.  People will keep explaining the tribulation away until the very end is upon us. 

It is a gradual process and the seals are not complete.  There are already souls slaughtered for their testimony and many more countries are persecuting Christians.  By the way, even families are killing their members who become Christians to protect the family honour.  Does this not look like the fifth seal has started?  

People are being killed by war, famine, beasts, and pestilence.  Does that not look like the fourth seal?  Despite all our medical research and charity, famine is getting worse even among the developed countries of the world.  

I am not sure how cheap food is where you live but from what I can see food is becoming more expensive every day, and increasingly out of the reach of many.  Does this not look like third seal has started?

As for the second seal, there is no longer peace on earth.  All I can see is fear from country to country.  I have not heard of a country that is not affected by fear of terror and all the inhabitants are at peace.  

Things are only going to get worse at each stage.  The Scientists, philosophers, and the wise of the world will also try to explain the situation away so that we can continue to eat, drink, be merry until it is the very end.

 

 

 

 

[Neighbor]

Deleted

Never mind, wasn't important even to me.

Edited October 29, 2017 by Neighbor

[Neighbor]

On 10/27/2017 at 9:17 PM, missmuffet said:

I know but His timing is perfect. Not our timing.

Why that's what John Calvin also concluded. Amazing isn't it? 

[Neighbor]

On 10/27/2017 at 4:46 PM, Pudgenik said:

Yesterday the company I work for introduced a new 401k plan. I just laughed about it. In my lifetime I have never gotten life insurance, nor the 401k because of what the Lord had revealed to me of my life.

I know that Revelations will indeed unfold in my lifetime.

What say you? Where do you stand with things like life insurance?

Oh I'm going to state it after all.  At age 74 I am engaged in the process of providing for my new bride's potential needs and comforts should I pre-decease her. An insurance policy even at my age is one way to do that. Fortunately at this point I also have  other choices. BUT  I must do the hard work of planning. I cannot responsibly ignore doing that  using my Lord's soon return as my excuse not to plan. Many did that in 0072. It is now 2017. Lots of water under the bridge and many a hungry widow since  the first time men first used God as reason to stop working and stop planning.

Thing in life is, it never goes quite the way we image it will. So  the question really is, if married, if one has children to care for, or even a dependent parent, how best to try to provide for their need? 

Cash, savings on hand, insurance policy, 401 k, Ira's , income property, all have their merit. 

Jesus is coming soon,  so suck it up till then is not really a responsible response to the issue.  

Edited October 29, 2017 by Neighbor

[frienduff thaylorde]

6 hours ago, Davida said:

We are already in the end times , it began when Israel became a nation in 1948. The end times and the 7 yr Tribulation are not the same thing. We are seeing the beginning of what Jesus described His believers would see happening in the world and we see the confederacy coming into place & tensions taking shape in the middle east which will lead to the fulfillment the Bible prophecies.

For years , decades , centuries and millinia,  the nation lay bared to the ground due to the destruction .  Yet in the book called revelation

does it not say , that in the city where our LORD was crucified the two would be killed.  Jerusalem , such a center piece that every tongue tribe and nation would see

Jerusalme was going to have to not only become again to fulfill this , but would have to be the major center piece of the world.

THE THING IS..............................THIS has been fulfilled.  NOT only is the nation a recognized nation again,   not only is Jerusalem a well established city again.

PARDS.........................ITS THE CENTERPIECE for the entire peace plan FOR THE WORLD.        THIS IS PROPHECY .    And YES we are nigh many of the very things

Revealed in revelations at the time of the beast , false prophet ,   signs in the gosples , n the letters from paul, peter, and others.

the world abounds without natural affection now, honoring it , celebrating it , iniquity through the roof.

and now one who was foretold would come to make a peace convenant.     UM.............tell me what is the entire goal concerning peace .  IS it not to divide jerusalem

lets hear a word from Daniel.    IN the latter times of their kingdom WHEN , YES WHEN the transgressors have reached the full,  woe woe woe its looking mighty full to me

THEN stands a king understanding dark sentences...WHO by...............PEACE shall destroy many.  

All religions and non religions focus has become more and more WORLD PEACE........INIQUITY has risen full

a mark which none can buy or sell, AT THE DOOR

and what is the mission again with Jerusalme...........TO DIVIDE it for world peace.

AND HE SHALL DIVIDE the land for gain................................the same dark one that rises when the transgressors have come to the full.

RIGHT at our doorstep, yet so few can see.  and more and more are being led right into the all inclusive mindset for world peace.  RIGHT to HIM , RIGHT TO HIM .

TIMES running out .

[frienduff thaylorde]

Anyone else notice the same pattern. RIGHT before any judgment , weapon or etc

always the true would warn and the majority would sit under the false ones who said PEACE PEACE

WELL LOOK AT TODAY.................I can warn , and warn , and warn and most just going right under the all inclusive peace peace mindset.

I aint the only one warning either.  but its few .   most would rather sit under those who say THE DAY IS NOT NEAR , we shall HAVE PEACE IN OUR DAY.

VERY same things the false ones were telling the jews , while the true ones warned .   WHICH ONES WERE RIGHT .   SO TOO AGAIN IT COMES.

[frienduff thaylorde]

We shall not see destruction we shall have peace , peace the false ones cry , NOT KNOWING their peace LEADS TO THE VERY WEAPON who comes in BY PEACE

and by peace BURNS THE WORLD.    ITS HAPPENING .       We have got to be exhorting one another , reminding one another , being prepared to lose all and die for the Lord.

A great weapon with threshing teeth is on the rise .     Though judgements have been, the masses wont repent but rather as a whole things get far worse

For all this the weapon will come.    Now arise up and have no fear , our mission is to reach the lost and keep the church sharp by pure sound doctrine.

NO running to hide............ARMOUR UP , the gospel will be forefront , the mission is not over , the sense of urgency only compels us to arise and let the LIGHT shine only more.

NO fear of death, no fear of man, no fear of suffering , only a duty to win souls and warn and encourage.   ONWARD PEOPLES

though many will die in the days ahead, the church will not be destroyed, persecution does not kill the church........IT REFINES HER , ONWARD peoples of the LORD , onward in the LORD.