When is the Sabbath?

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

1 minute ago, inchrist said:

Ok, let me address why I view lunar sabbath in error.

 

 

When we dont need to assume we can go straight to the talmud. (these comments are during temple period)

R. Zera replied: The New Moon is different from a festival - Since its mention is included in the benediction on the sanctity of the day in the morning and evening prayers it is also included in that of the additional prayer. But do Beth Shammai uphold the view that the mention of the New Moon is to be included? Was it not in fact taught: If a New Moon falls on a Sabbath,Beth Shammai ruled: One recites in his additional prayer eight benedictions and Beth Hillel ruled: Seven? This is indeed a difficulty." Talmud - Mas. Eiruvin 40b

The New Moon never falls on a Sabbath because the Lunar Sabbath is never on the first day of the month.

Of they were keping the Lunar Sabbath, they wouldnt be having this discussion. 

Mishnah. The bones, and the sinews, and the nothar of the paschal lamb are to be burnt on the sixteenth. If the sixteenth falls on the Sabbath, they are to be burnt on the seventeenth, because they do not override either the Sabbath or the festival." Talmud - Pesachim 83a

If the 16th day falls on the sabbath? Lunar sabbath you dont have a 16th day.

 

 

Josephus states the following:

"The masses have long since shown a keen desire to adopt our religious observances; and there is not one city, Greek or barbarian, nor a single nation, to which our custom of abstaining from work on the seventh day has not spread and where our fasts and the lighting of lamps and many of our prohibitions in the matter of food are not observed. Apion 2:282-283

 

 

 

 

In Christ you have the wrong understanding of the lunar Sabbath. Please look here and this explains it:  https://guidetothebible.wordpress.com/sabbath-isnt-on-sun-or-sat/

[inchrist]

6 minutes ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

You cant tell me not to post here. And I WAS addressing the OP. 

He is the OP

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

7 minutes ago, TheMatrixHasU71 said:

You cant tell me not to post here. And I WAS addressing the OP. 

Please stop trying to derail this thread, I have reported you. 

[Steve_S]

4 hours ago, When Is Jesus Coming? said:

If you have a question regarding the OP then ask it otherwise please don't post any more cryptic and possibly insulting messages on my thread. Thank you. 

Just to be clear. This is not your thread, this is a discussion thread on the forums. We do at times allow members who start threads to ask that they be closed, but that is not because they possess the "rights" to them or whatever. Ultimately we make those calls based on whether or not the thread has ran its course and the stated reason for closing it. Otherwise, people are indeed allowed to take topics in different directions. I have seen no evidence here of thread derailing or anything such as that. If you post a topic such as this, it is reasonable to expect people to discuss it and even debate it. We don't allow OPs to decide who or what can be discussed in any given thread.

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

6 minutes ago, Steve_S said:

Just to be clear. This is not your thread, this is a discussion thread on the forums. We do at times allow members who start threads to ask that they be closed, but that is not because they possess the "rights" to them or whatever. Ultimately we make those calls based on whether or not the thread has ran its course and the stated reason for closing it. Otherwise, people are indeed allowed to take topics in different directions. I have seen no evidence here of thread derailing or anything such as that. If you post a topic such as this, it is reasonable to expect people to discuss it and even debate it. We don't allow OPs to decide who or what can be discussed in any given thread.

If anything can be discussed in any thread then what's the point of having threads with different titles? And listed into different topics. Please show me where this is allowed in the rules.  

And BTW by OP I mean Original Post not Original Poster. I was asking others to address the topic in the Original Post. 

[Steve_S]

3 minutes ago, When Is Jesus Coming? said:

If anything can be discussed in any thread then what's the point of having threads with different titles? And listed into different topics. Please show me where this is allowed in the rules.  

And BTW by OP I mean Original Post not Original Poster. I was asking others to address the topic in the Original Post. 

We make decisions based on whether a thread is wildly being taken off course or not. For instance, if someone came in this thread and attempted to start a discussion about vladimir putin or perhaps the chicago bears, that would constitute derailing. Exploring different aspects that are related to the topic, even if indirectly, is totally allowed. If you do not wish to engage people doing that, then that is your prerogative as a member here. Simply put, if you don't like what people are discussing in the thread, then don't discuss it with them. Only engage on the specific parts that you wish to engage on.

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

6 minutes ago, Steve_S said:

We make decisions based on whether a thread is wildly being taken off course or not. For instance, if someone came in this thread and attempted to start a discussion about vladimir putin or perhaps the chicago bears, that would constitute derailing. Exploring different aspects that are related to the topic, even if indirectly, is totally allowed. If you do not wish to engage people doing that, then that is your prerogative as a member here. Simply put, if you don't like what people are discussing in the thread, then don't discuss it with them. Only engage on the specific parts that you wish to engage on.

Yeah okay but what about when they repeatedly keep posting about something that may seem related to the OP but in reality is not and even when told several times to read the OP they carry on regardless. How can that be stopped? 

[inchrist]

4 minutes ago, When Is Jesus Coming? said:

In Christ you have the wrong understanding of the lunar Sabbath. Please look here and this explains it:  https://guidetothebible.wordpress.com/sabbath-isnt-on-sun-or-sat/

This is not addressing the discussion of the rabbis in the talmud.

Look here

If a New Moon falls on a Sabbath, (…) one recites in his prayer (…) eight benedictions (…).

If the new moon, if clearly shows the sabbath is not dependent on the new moon days

A lunar sabbath does not fall on the 16th nor does a lunar sabbath fall on the first day of the month, which the rabbis are discussing

Further the Roman History, book 37: http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/e/roman/texts/cassius_dio/37*.html

After this he more easily overcame the rest, but had trouble in besieging Jerusalem. Most of the city, to be sure, he took without any trouble, as he was received by the party of Hyrcanus; but the temple itself, which the other party had occupied, he captured only with difficulty. For it was on high ground and was fortified by a wall of its own, and if they had continued defending it on all days alike, he could not have got possession of it. As it was, they made an excavation of what are called the days of Saturn, and by doing no work at all on those days afforded the Romans an opportunity in this interval to batter down the wall. The latter, on learning of this superstitious awe of theirs, made no serious attempts the rest of the time, but on those days, when they came round in succession, assaulted most vigorously. Thus the defenders were captured on the day of Saturn, without making any defence, and all the wealth was plundered. The kingdom was given to Hyrcanus, and Aristobulus was carried away.

This was in 63 BC we have the enemies telling us the Jews were observing the sabbath on the day of saturn (saturday)

Volume II of The Works of Philo Judaeus

Hellenistic Jewish philosopher  from 25 BC to 50 AD

But after this continued and uninterrupted festival which lasts through all time, there is another celebrated, namely, that of the sacred seventh day after each recurring interval of six days

In another book by Philo The Decalogue, XX, 96, ://www.earlychristianwritings.com/yonge/book26.html

The fourth commandment has reference to the sacred seventh day, that it may be passed in a sacred and holy manner. Now some states keep the holy festival only once in the month, counting from the new moon, as a day sacred to the Almighty; but the nation of the Jews keeps every seventh day regularly, after each interval of six days

 

More from the talmud

The following discussion tskes place when Christ was still a child

On a festival which coinsides with the eve of the Sabbath [Friday]- a person should not do cooking to begin with the festival day [Friday] for the purpose of the Sabbath.
But he prepares food for the festival day, and he leaves something over, he has lefts it over for use on the Sabbath.
And he prepares a cooked dish on the eve of the festival day [Thursday] and relies on it [to prepare food on Friday] for the Sabbath as well.
The House of Shammai says, "Two dishes."
And the House of Hillel says, "A single dish."
But they concur in the case of fish and the egg [cooked] on it, that they constitute two dishes.
[If] one ate [the dish intended for the Sabbath] or it was lost, one should not cook another in its stead in the first instance.
But if he left over any amount at all of it, he relies on it for the Sabbath.
2:2 [If the festival day] coincided with the day after the Sabbath [Sunday],
The House of Shammai says, "The immerse everything before the Sabbath."
The House of Hillel says, "Utensils [are to be immersed] before the Sabbath.
But man [may immerse] on the Sabbath [itself]."
(m.Besa 2:1-2)

.................

On the 9th of Av, ( lunar sabbath doesnt fall on the 9th of AV)

If the Ninth of Av fell on a Sabbath and, similarly, if the eve of the Ninth of Av fell on a Sabbath a man may eat and drink as much as he requires and lay on his table a meal as big as that of Solomon in his time. If the Ninth of Av fell on the Sabbath eve [food] of the size of an egg must be brought and eaten [before the conclusion of the day] so that one does not approach the Sabbath in a state of affliction’.
(b.Eruvin 41a)

......

Which does not fit with what your article claims.

 Sabbaths fall on day’s 8, 15, 22 and 29 each lunar month

 

 

[Steve_S]

2 minutes ago, When Is Jesus Coming? said:

Yeah okay but what about when they repeatedly keep posting about something that may seem related to the OP but in reality is not and even when told several times to read the OP they carry on regardless. How can that be stopped? 

They can carry on with the discussion as they see fit and, as I said earlier, I have seen nothing here that would qualify as derailing this thread. There is no reason for you to attempt to make people discuss exactly what you want them to discuss. That is not the intent of the forums here. If you see something that you believe to be derailing, then feel free to report it and we will look at it, however, if it is along the lines of what you have been concerned with thus far, it does not fit in with what we would typically act upon as derailing a thread. In fact, it is not even close.

[When Is Jesus Coming?]

1 minute ago, inchrist said:

This is not addressing the discussion of the rabbis in the talmud.

Look here

If a New Moon falls on a Sabbath, (…) one recites in his prayer (…) eight benedictions (…).

If the new moon, if clearly shows the sabbath is not dependent on the new moon days

A lunar sabbath does not fall on the 16th nor does a lunar sabbath fall on the first day of the month, which the rabbis are discussing

Further the Roman History, book 37: http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/e/roman/texts/cassius_dio/37*.html

After this he more easily overcame the rest, but had trouble in besieging Jerusalem. Most of the city, to be sure, he took without any trouble, as he was received by the party of Hyrcanus; but the temple itself, which the other party had occupied, he captured only with difficulty. For it was on high ground and was fortified by a wall of its own, and if they had continued defending it on all days alike, he could not have got possession of it. As it was, they made an excavation of what are called the days of Saturn, and by doing no work at all on those days afforded the Romans an opportunity in this interval to batter down the wall. The latter, on learning of this superstitious awe of theirs, made no serious attempts the rest of the time, but on those days, when they came round in succession, assaulted most vigorously. Thus the defenders were captured on the day of Saturn, without making any defence, and all the wealth was plundered. The kingdom was given to Hyrcanus, and Aristobulus was carried away.

This was in 63 BC we have the enemies telling us the Jews were observing the sabbath on the day of saturn (saturday)

Volume II of The Works of Philo Judaeus

Hellenistic Jewish philosopher  from 25 BC to 50 AD

But after this continued and uninterrupted festival which lasts through all time, there is another celebrated, namely, that of the sacred seventh day after each recurring interval of six days

In another book by Philo The Decalogue, XX, 96, ://www.earlychristianwritings.com/yonge/book26.html

The fourth commandment has reference to the sacred seventh day, that it may be passed in a sacred and holy manner. Now some states keep the holy festival only once in the month, counting from the new moon, as a day sacred to the Almighty; but the nation of the Jews keeps every seventh day regularly, after each interval of six days

 

More from the talmud

The following discussion tskes place when Christ was still a child

On a festival which coinsides with the eve of the Sabbath [Friday]- a person should not do cooking to begin with the festival day [Friday] for the purpose of the Sabbath.
But he prepares food for the festival day, and he leaves something over, he has lefts it over for use on the Sabbath.
And he prepares a cooked dish on the eve of the festival day [Thursday] and relies on it [to prepare food on Friday] for the Sabbath as well.
The House of Shammai says, "Two dishes."
And the House of Hillel says, "A single dish."
But they concur in the case of fish and the egg [cooked] on it, that they constitute two dishes.
[If] one ate [the dish intended for the Sabbath] or it was lost, one should not cook another in its stead in the first instance.
But if he left over any amount at all of it, he relies on it for the Sabbath.
2:2 [If the festival day] coincided with the day after the Sabbath [Sunday],
The House of Shammai says, "The immerse everything before the Sabbath."
The House of Hillel says, "Utensils [are to be immersed] before the Sabbath.
But man [may immerse] on the Sabbath [itself]."
(m.Besa 2:1-2)

.................

On the 9th of Av, ( lunar sabbath doesnt fall on the 9th of AV)

If the Ninth of Av fell on a Sabbath and, similarly, if the eve of the Ninth of Av fell on a Sabbath a man may eat and drink as much as he requires and lay on his table a meal as big as that of Solomon in his time. If the Ninth of Av fell on the Sabbath eve [food] of the size of an egg must be brought and eaten [before the conclusion of the day] so that one does not approach the Sabbath in a state of affliction’.
(b.Eruvin 41a)

......

Which does not fit with what your article claims.

 Sabbaths fall on day’s 8, 15, 22 and 29 each lunar month

 

 

Unless you read/watch what I sent you, you will not understand your error. The way your describing the ancient Hebrew lunar Sabbath calendar is totally wrong. Forget about the Tulmud the ancient Hebrew lunar Sabbath calendar is described in the bible itself. You don't need to believe me it is in the Bible.