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Mary8

Psalm 50 I believe is thrilling about pre-trib rapture

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 I believe in past weeks the Lord has given me new insights from Psalm 50, on the imminent rapture of those believe in Jesus Christ as their Savior.  See Scripture references at end hereof.
Psalm 50, with my comments in brackets:
1 (A Psalm of Asaph.)  The mighty God, even the LORD, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof.
Out of Zion, the perfection of beauty, God hath shined.
Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence:  a fire shall devour before Him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about Him.  [note by Mary:  These words remind me of the fire when Elijah was taken up into heaven, II Kings 2:11 ("there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder").  The following verses then tell who it is that He is coming for.  Christians are told to "wait for His Son"  I Thess. 10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.   Jesus promised He will come for us, John 14:18, and this is our blessed hope, and our comfort.
4  He shall call to the heavens above, and to the earth, that He may judge His people.  [I Thess. 4:18 states that He shall descend from heaven "with a shout" and that the "dead in Christ" and "we which are alive" shall be separated  from others and brought before Him for judgment.  This indicates that the time is when God calls out.  Judgement of His people is specifically referred to, and a separating of His people is implied and points to to the timing of rewards or lack thereof to Christians (I Cor. 3:11-15, regarding judgment for rewards or loss to believers.]
Gather my saints together unto me; those that have made a covenant with me by sacrifice.  [This again echoes the words of I Thess. 4:18:  "caught up together" and the verses indicate who He will gather.  Believers accept Christ's death as their sacrifice.]
6  And the heavens shall declare his righteousness:  for God is judge himself.  Selah  [This emphasizes that the heavens will testify that God keeps His promises and the rapture of Christians through the heavens will reveal this to the world in a marvelous way.   Judgment is again referred to.]
7  Hear, O my people, and I will speak; O Israel, and I will testify against thee:  I am God, even thy God.  [Then we come to the point where the Psalm reveals that there is a message to Israel, to Jews who had not accepted Christ.]
8  I will not reprove thee for thy sacrifices or thy burnt offerings, to have been continually before me.  [This possibly suggests that the animal sacrifices are occurring at the time of the rapture.]
9  I will take no bullock out of thy house, nor he goats out of thy folds.
10  For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills.
11  I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are mine.
12  If I were hungry, I would not tell thee: for the world is mine, and the fulness thereof.
13  Will I eat the flesh of bulls, or drink the blood of goats?
14  Offer unto God thanksgiving: and pay thy vows unto the most High:  [This is advice to Israel, and indicates that some will realize that Jesus was their Messiah and that they can be thankful for this knowledge, and make a vow to Him.   It points to the need of Israel to accept the sacrificial death of the Lord Jesus.   I believe many will immediately do so.]
15  And call upon me in the day of trouble: I will deliver thee, and thou shalt glorify me.  [The Lord tells Israel what to do, gives His promise that He will deliver them too, and gives the outcome, that Israel shall glorify their Savior.]
16  But unto the wicked God saith, What hast thou to do to declare my statutes, or that thou shouldest take my covenant in thy mouth?  [Beginning with this verse, the Lord speaks to the wicked, and tells them they should take His covenant and declare His statutes, and that they have rejected Him and come under the law of sin.  Sinners must start with realizing this and that they are in the time of trouble when His wrath is poured out.  (Those who deny the imminent pre-tribulation rapture would change the word "wrath" to "wrath after death" when the Scripture indicates that we will be delivered from wrath.]  
17  Seeing thou hatest instruction, and castest my words behind thee.  
18  When thou sawest a thief, then thou consentedst with him, and has been partaker with adulterers.  
19  Thou givest thy mouth to evil, and thy tongue frameth deceit.  
20  Thou sittest and speakest against thy brother; thou slanderest thine own mother's son.  
21  These things has thou done, and I kept silence; thou thoughtest that I was altogether such an one as thyself: but I will reprove thee, and set them in order before thine eyes.  
22  Now consider this ye that forget God, lest I tear you in pieces, and there be none to deliver.
23 Whoso offereth praise glorifieth me: and to him that ordereth his conversation aright will I shew the salvation of God.

So the Lord then promises salvation to the one who orders his conversation right, and offers praise, glorifying God.  Jesus' Name means salvation, and some of those left behind, not among the gathered people, will receive Him and be saved during the tribulation.
 ***
Scripture references: 

II Kings 2:11  And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.   In Ezekiel chapter 1, " Ezekiel 1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself,

I Thess. 1:10 (wait for His Son from heaven....) 

I Thess. 4:18 (For the Lord himself shall descend with a shout ....);

John 14:3 (I will come again, and receive you unto myself);

John 14:18 (... will not leave you comfortless, I will come for you);

Titus 2:13 (Looking for that blessed hope);

Psalm 27:10 (In the secret of His tabernacle shall He hide me.); 

I Thess. 5:9 (God hath not appointed us to wrath);

Romans 5:9 (justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him);

Rev. 3:10 (I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation);

Heb. 10:19 (come into the holy place through the blood of Jesus); 

I Cor. 3:11-15 (gold, ... hay, stubble, ... reward ... loss)  Psalm 91 (the dragon shalt thou trample under feet);

Psalm 34:7 (the angel of the LORD encampeth round about them that fear Him).  

Luke 12:32 (Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.)

Edited by Mary8
insert about Elijah taken up; add I Thess 1:10
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Without one pre-trib rapture verse that has the rapture before the tribulation.

Then has the gall to quote post trib verses and then CLAIM they are pre-trib, for the disconnect!

1 Thess is clearly post trib and at the last day.

We shall NOT prevent them which are asleep.

And we all know that the resurrection is at the last day, not seven years before the last day.

*******

Even Jesus shows resurrection first and then the rapture with it in John eleven :25,26.

*******

PeterAV

Every word of God is pure:

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The Lord will extract His own first .... then the tribulation period will begin [Revelation 3:10; 6:12-17]

Some who become believers during the tribulation will die and some will not

Those who are killed will be resurrected at the end of the tribulation and those who are still alive will enter and populate His millennial kingdom as mortals [Israel: Matthew 24:30-31; Revelation 20:4] [Gentiles: Matthew 25:31-33]

Read your Bible

 

 

Edited by Daniel 11:36
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8 hours ago, PeterAV said:

Without one pre-trib rapture verse that has the rapture before the tribulation.

Did you try reading the OP first?

 

8 hours ago, PeterAV said:

Then has the gall to quote post trib verses and then CLAIM they are pre-trib, for the disconnect!

One of the verse she posted is John 14:3. This is clearly not a post trib verse as the highest your rapture view can go up is to the air follow by a U-turn in the sky. 

John 14:3 New King James Version (NKJV)

And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also.

 

8 hours ago, PeterAV said:

And we all know that the resurrection is at the last day, not seven years before the last day.

If that's so, how did Martha knew when the last day would occur if bible prophecies in the NT was not written till sometime after Christ passed away?

Christ revealed the Olivet Discourse only to His disciples privately and no one else.

John 11:24 New King James Version (NKJV)

24 Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

 

 

 

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On 12/2/2017 at 8:11 PM, Mary8 said:

 I believe in past weeks the Lord has given me new insights from Psalm 50, on the imminent rapture of those believe in Jesus Christ as their Savior.  See Scripture references at end hereof.
Psalm 50, with my comments in brackets:
1 (A Psalm of Asaph.)  The mighty God, even the LORD, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof.
2  Out of Zion, the perfection of beauty, God hath shined.
Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence:  a fire shall devour before Him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about Him.  [note by Mary:  These words remind me of the fire when Elijah was taken up into heaven, II Kings 2:11 ("there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder").  The following verses tell who it is that He is coming for.  Christians are told to "wait for His Son"  I Thess. 10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.   Jesus promised He will come for us, John 14:18, and this is our blessed hope, and our comfort.
4  He shall call to the heavens above, and to the earth, that He may judge His people.  [I Thess. 4:18 states that He shall descend from heaven "with a shout" and that the "dead in Christ" and "we which are alive" shall be separated  from others and brought before Him for judgment.  This indicates that the time is when God calls out.  Judgement of His people is specifically referred to, and a separating of His people is implied and points to to the timing of rewards or lack thereof to Christians (I Cor. 3:11-15, regarding judgment for rewards or loss to believers.]
Gather my saints together unto me; those that have made a covenant with me by sacrifice.  [This again echoes the words of I Thess. 4:18:  "caught up together" and the verses indicate who He will gather.  Believers accept Christ's death as their sacrifice.]
6  And the heavens shall declare his righteousness:  for God is judge himself.  Selah  [This emphasizes that the heavens will testify that God keeps His promises and the rapture of Christians through the heavens will reveal this to the world in a marvelous way.   Judgment is again referred to.]
7  Hear, O my people, and I will speak; O Israel, and I will testify against thee:  I am God, even thy God.  [Then we come to the point where the Psalm reveals that there is a message to Israel, to Jews who had not accepted Christ.]
8  I will not reprove thee for thy sacrifices or thy burnt offerings, to have been continually before me.  [This possibly suggests that the animal sacrifices are occurring at the time of the rapture.]
9  I will take no bullock out of thy house, nor he goats out of thy folds.
10  For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills.
11  I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are mine.
12  If I were hungry, I would not tell thee: for the world is mine, and the fulness thereof.
13  Will I eat the flesh of bulls, or drink the blood of goats?
14  Offer unto God thanksgiving: and pay thy vows unto the most High:  [This is advice to Israel, and indicates that some will realize that Jesus was their Messiah and that they can be thankful for this knowledge, and make a vow to Him.   It points to the need of Israel to accept the sacrificial death of the Lord Jesus.   I believe many will immediately do so.]
15  And call upon me in the day of trouble: I will deliver thee, and thou shalt glorify me.  [The Lord tells Israel what to do, gives His promise that He will deliver them too, and gives the outcome, that Israel shall glorify their Savior.]
16  But unto the wicked God saith, What hast thou to do to declare my statutes, or that thou shouldest take my covenant in thy mouth?  [Beginning with this verse, the Lord speaks to the wicked, and tells them they should take His covenant and declare His statutes, and that they have rejected Him and come under the law of sin.  Sinners must start with realizing this and that they are in the time of trouble when His wrath is poured out.  (Those who deny the imminent pre-tribulation rapture would change the word "wrath" to "wrath after death" when the Scripture indicates that we will be delivered from wrath.]  
17  Seeing thou hatest instruction, and castest my words behind thee.  
18  When thou sawest a thief, then thou consentedst with him, and has been partaker with adulterers.  
19  Thou givest thy mouth to evil, and thy tongue frameth deceit.  
20  Thou sittest and speakest against thy brother; thou slanderest thine own mother's son.  
21  These things has thou done, and I kept silence; thou thoughtest that I was altogether such an one as thyself: but I will reprove thee, and set them in order before thine eyes.  
22  Now consider this ye that forget God, lest I tear you in pieces, and there be none to deliver.
Verse 23 Whoso offereth praise glorifieth me: and to him that ordereth his conversation aright will I shew the salvation of God.

So the Lord then promises salvation to the one who orders his conversation right, and offers praise, glorifying God.  Jesus' Name means salvation, and some of those left behind, not among the gathered people, will receive Him and be saved during the tribulation.
 ***
Scripture references: 

II Kings 2:11  And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.   In Ezekiel chapter 1, " Ezekiel 1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself,

I Thess. 1:10 (wait for His Son from heaven....) 

I Thess. 4:18 (For the Lord himself shall descend with a shout ....);

John 14:3 (I will come again, and receive you unto myself);

John 14:18 (... will not leave you comfortless, I will come for you);

Titus 2:13 (Looking for that blessed hope);

Psalm 27:10 (In the secret of His tabernacle shall He hide me.); 

I Thess. 5:9 (God hath not appointed us to wrath);

Romans 5:9 (justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him);

Rev. 3:10 (I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation);

Heb. 10:19 (come into the holy place through the blood of Jesus); 

I Cor. 3:11-15 (gold, ... hay, stubble, ... reward ... loss)  Psalm 91 (the dragon shalt thou trample under feet);

Psalm 34:7 (the angel of the LORD encampeth round about them that fear Him).  

Luke 12:32 (Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.)

I think this is good stuff Mary8. Thank you for sharing.

 

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Psalms 37:4,   I enjoyed your comment about post-trib claim of part way up then followed by a "U turn in the sky."    I have been picturing the post-trib timing as they claim believers going up, clothed in white garments, being instantly catapulted onto the white horses and down again.    Praise the Lord, He will deliver us from wrath!

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9 hours ago, Mary8 said:

Psalms 37:4,   I enjoyed your comment about post-trib claim of part way up then followed by a "U turn in the sky."    I have been picturing the post-trib timing as they claim believers going up, clothed in white garments, being instantly catapulted onto the white horses and down again.    Praise the Lord, He will deliver us from wrath!

Amen Mary8! Great will be that day when He comes to deliver us from wrath.

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One thing I find curious as well as interesting. A number of places in the Bible, the mode of transportation is white horses. One example that peaks my interest, is the Saints and Jesus coming back to earth on white horse's spoken of in Revelation. 

Think of the implications if these white horses are literal? 

(1) Think of the speed that they are traveling at, or it's possibly dimensional travel?

(2) If they are literal horses, that implies to me we are given our own horse and mode of transportation to explore anywhere we may be allowed to go?

(3) If these are literal horses, it implies to me there are animals in Heaven to be enjoyed, and possibly on earth after the recreation? 

Just some pondering...

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7 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

One thing I find curious as well as interesting. A number of places in the Bible, the mode of transportation is white horses. One example that peaks my interest, is the Saints and Jesus coming back to earth on white horse's spoken of in Revelation. 

Think of the implications if these white horses are literal? 

(1) Think of the speed that they are traveling at, or it's possibly dimensional travel?

(2) If they are literal horses, that implies to me we are given our own horse and mode of transportation to explore anywhere we may be allowed to go?

(3) If these are literal horses, it implies to me there are animals in Heaven to be enjoyed, and possibly on earth after the recreation? 

Just some pondering...

Good pondering.   The saints will be on white horses, (in the air), and now I'm realizing that the horse is indicated to be taken away.   And all of God's beautiful animals to be enjoyed is delightful and spelled out in Isaiah 11:6: The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.     And again in Isaiah 65:25 : The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.   So the list begins with  wolves, lambs, leopards, goat kids, calves, lions, cows, serpents, and little children!  

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7 hours ago, Mary8 said:

Good pondering.   The saints will be on white horses, (in the air), and now I'm realizing that the horse is indicated to be taken away.   And all of God's beautiful animals to be enjoyed is delightful and spelled out in Isaiah 11:6: The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.     And again in Isaiah 65:25 : The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.   So the list begins with  wolves, lambs, leopards, goat kids, calves, lions, cows, serpents, and little children!  

Carefully consider those verses and where it says that will take place (Isaiah 11: 6 - 9 and 65: 25). I interpret it to mean it's not all the Earth, just the Lord's Holy Mountain, which I suspect covers Mt. Sinai, Jerusalem or possibly all the land of Israel. I don't see the wording to pertain to all of the Earth. Could be wrong though?

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      The context of Deuteronomy 3:5 is applied to Israel's conquer of Og, the King of Bashan. Having destroyed Og's fortified cities they were never rebuilt by Israel. It also demonstrates that cities were typically fortresses; this is not what you see in Israel today.
      Deuteronomy 3:3-6 NASB "All these were cities fortified with high walls, gates, and bars, besides a great many unwalled towns.
      Zechariah 2:4 NASB and said to him, "Run, speak to that young man, saying, 'Jerusalem will be inhabited without walls because of the multitude of men and cattle within it.
      I like the way the ISV version translates Ezekiel 38:12, “the people … who live at the center of the world's attention.” Currently, all the world seems to be looking at Israel, once again. Whether Israel is at the center of the world or not is debatable, but God is making that nation the center of attention.
      And, although we have not covered the verse yet, it sums up the reason behind all this tumult.
      Ezekiel 38:16 ERV...I will bring you to fight against my land. Then, Gog, the nations will learn how powerful I am! They will learn to respect me and know that I am holy.
    • By omharris
      I was asked by my pastor why I study eschatology (end times events.) Ignoring the negativity of a challenge like this, I find that "end times events" are tied in with almost everything I read in scripture. Ezekiel 38 and 39 is such an event, as it speaks of a horrific situation that may happen at any minute.
      Try opening a conversation about what you find in Ezekiel 38 and 39 and the eyes of your audience will glaze over and you can watch them begin to look at their watches, wondering if there isn't somewhere else they need to go. There are reasons behind this lack of interest, and they stem from confusion; a lack of understanding; the inability of the speaker to put flesh and blood on the characters; and, the worst part is that there is a veil over the eyes and ears of the hearer so that they cannot comprehend. Along with those factors, there is a multitude of answers as to who the players are and when this event will take place. Ambiguity plays a role in the disinterest because an honest dissertation of an end-times scenario will typically put you in the ballpark, perhaps even provide the audience with the team name, but at this point, I am not sure we specifically say who the main characters are. Furthermore, two simple sentences can inspire books of commentary. I am going to try and condense but still give you an understanding of this prophecy.
      An introduction to Ezekiel:
      He was a priest, the son of a priest, and he was taken captive into Babylon. Already, you should be thinking, odds are not in his favor. Ezekiel was one of the few that give us precise dates.
      According to Dr. John Gill's commentary, chapter 38 gives an account of "an enemy of the Jews, under the name of Gog, that shall invade their land, and disturb their peace after they are settled in it;"
      J. Vernon McGee, in his commentary, demonstrates some classic old-school thinking as he tells us the theme of Ezekiel 38 is Russia's invasion of Israel. McGee is making his case for Gog to be Russia.
      I happen to think McGee's assessment is wrong and we should not be focused on the Russian President Putin. You have to keep in mind what was going on in the world that would have inspired the McGee's particular emphasis on Russia in his commentary. For example, The United States was deeply entrenched in the Korean war; the Vietnam conflict, with the cold war with Russia waiting just around the corner. I too assumed that Russia would be one of the major players (and no doubt they are, but we are trying to think biblically while paying attention to the context.) as we lived with the verified threat of Russian missiles 90 miles off our coast in Cuba - a Russian ally, as children.
      The Summarized Bible commentary conveys that “God does not only see those who are now the enemies of His people, but foresees those who will be so in the last days, and lets them know by His Word that He is against them, and will make their movements to serve His own purposes.”
      I know, every generation has had those that have said, "we are in the last days," and I would tell you that they were right.
      Now how would I come to the understanding that every generation comprehended that we are in the last days?
      Daniel chapter 9, spells out a seventy-week decree against Israel. Sixty-nine of those weeks have been fulfilled. The seventieth week of years (7years) has been on hold for over 2000 years. Therefore, we, the church, have been in the last days for over 2000 years. 
      Peter, on the day of Pentecost, filled with Holy Spirit, preached to the thousands milling about the streets of Jerusalem that day. An aspect of what Peter said came from Joel chapter 2 which speaks about the time of God's wrath which the seventieth year portrays. However, within that period, people are acting out in the power of the Holy Spirit as the prophets of old did. Peter said this part of Joel's prophecy had been fulfilled in your hearing.
      What did he say? We are living in the last days.
      Since the last days seems to be very focused on the seven-years of wrath, are we, at the moment, living in the seventieth week? No, and that will not come until the church is removed from the earth. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-8
      The NASB opens our look into Ezekiel 38 with:
      Prophecy Against Gog
      Ezekiel 38:1-2 NASB And the word of the LORD came to me saying, 2) "Son of man, set your face toward Gog of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal, and prophesy against him
      Note how the passage provided has no appropriate punctuation at the end. That is because the thought continues and we will pursue that shortly. But for the moment let's dissect the verses.
      “Son of man,” Is there any question as to whom the Lord is talking? The answer is Ezekiel.
      “set your face toward Gog of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal, and prophesy against him,” Okay, what just happened? Ezekiel was told to prophesy against two entities:
      Gog; this person also happens to be the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal.
      And, the land of Magog; If Ezekiel is told to prophesy against him, and "him" includes the land, then we should be considering the possibility that this is:
      A nation? A people group? A demonic operation that controls a people group? As I try to understand, I turn my attention to my concordances and look up the word Gog.
      BDB Definition: Gog = “mountain” - A Reubenite, the son of Shemaiah (1 Ch 5:4); The prophetic prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal, and Magog (Read Ezekiel 32)
      Strong's concordance merely adds Gog, the name of an Israelite.
      The KJC keeps us in Ezekiel with one exception: 1 Chronicles 5:1-4 MKJV And the sons of Reuben, the first-born of Israel (for he was the first-born; but since he defiled his father's bed, his birthright was given to the sons of Joseph the son of Israel, and the genealogy is not to be counted according to the birthright; 2) For Judah prevailed among his brothers, and from him came the chief ruler, but the birthright was Joseph's); 3) the sons of Reuben the first-born of Israel: Hanoch, and Pallu, Hezron, and Carmi. 4) The sons of Joel: Shemaiah his son, Gog his son, and Shimei, his son.
      The dishonor carried by the family due to Reuben's indiscretion, which excluded them from any rights of birth, surely plays a role in all of this.
      The Word Study Dictionary tells us this about Gog:
      He is pictured as a great enemy against God's people. Ezekiel 38:9 NASB "You will go up, you will come like a storm; you will be like a cloud covering the land, you and all your troops, and many peoples with you."
      He is from the land of Magog or possibly "from the land of Gog." Gog. i.e., mountain, in reference to the Caucasus mountains, the chief seat of the Scythian people. Note: Rather, "Gog (the prince) of the land of Magog, the prince of Rosh, Meshech, and Tubal." The Ultimate Cross-Reference Treasury
      The Lord sets Himself against Gog (Eze_38:2). Gog will lead a coalition of nations against God's people who are then dwelling securely in the land of Israel (Eze_38:14-16).
      With the addition of the words, God's people who are then dwelling securely in ...Israel. They have turned this so that we are looking at the church and not Israel, which is incorrect.
      But God, in fact, will bring Gog forth and will destroy him and his people. Ezekiel 39:1-2; Ezekiel 38:19-23
      The Lord spoke about this through other prophets (Eze_38:17-18). Ezekiel 38:17 MKJV So says the Lord Jehovah: Are you he of whom I have spoken in former days, by the hand of My servants the prophets of Israel, who prophesied in those days and years that I would bring you against them?
      The multitudes of Gog will be buried in the Valley of Hamon Gog, that is, "multitudes of Gog" (Eze_39:11), Ezekiel 39:11 CJB " 'When that day comes, I will give Gog a place there in Isra'el for graves, the Travelers' Valley, east of the sea; and it will block the travelers' passage. There they will bury Gog and all his horde, and they will rename it the Valley of Hamon-Gog [horde of Gog].
      The Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological and Ecclesiastical Literature informs us that: They are the name of a mixed race dwelling in the extreme north, comprehended by the Greeks under the name of the Scythians; (2.) to the center and representative of their race, i.e. their king (Ezekiel 38:39). Gog comes forth from the distant north (Eze_38:15-23; Eze_39:2), ... And, if you are stickler for history - Interpreters have given very different explanations of the terms Gog and Magog; but they have generally understood them as symbolical expressions for the heathen nations of Asia, or more particularly for the Scythians, a vague knowledge of whom seems to have reached the Jews in Palestine about that period. Thus Josephus (Ant. 1:6, 3) has dropped the Hebrew word Magog, and rendered it by Σκύθαι;
      See attachment - Classic Bible Maps, The World as known to the Hebrews
      Of the maps, I looked at to better understand this ancient classic version shows me more and divergent details than any other map, as it points out Gog and Magog, and where they were located. I have also provided a link to Wikipedia which continues to fill in the blanks in understanding and prophecy with highly detailed information about the Scythians. Because of the quantity of information found there, which all seems important, I am only going to suggest that the interested pursue that there. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scythians]
      As you read the information, consider where Gog might come from. It may help you to understand more clearly how the Turkish "president" Recep Tayyip Erdoğan might best fill the role of Gog.
      Just for the fun of it, I searched the internet to find out if Genghis Khan could have been a Scythian. The Headline read, “Not Just Genghis Khan - Scythians Show Genetic Blending With Europe 2,000 Years Ago.” http://www.science20.com/news_articles/not_just_genghis_khan_scythians_show_genetic_blending_europe_2000_years_ago-96314
      Here is was I gather so far.
      Gog, from the disinherited family line of Reuben, moves North and becomes a nomadic mounted and warring nation known as the Scythians. They ranged into China, Siberia, Egypt, Asia Minor and as far south as the Northern African nations, however, they seem to be centrally located around Turkey and the Caspian Sea. They are heavily influenced and integrated by the surrounding nations such as Persia, Syria, and the Caucasus regions. They conquered Nineveh, the Assyrians, and the Medes. Having relations as violent as Genghis Khan one can assume that slaughter was their general theme. This is the people that God sees as one of Israel's few remaining thorns in the flesh.
       
       

    • By listener24
      "knock and the door will be opened to you." Imagine this unprecedented event. Christians, from all over the world, united physically in congregations, united virtually through technology, united spiritually in the Holy Ghost, praying together with a clear, unified intention: shortening, hastening the Return of the Lord (Peter 3:12, Revelation 22:20, Matthew 6:5-13, Luke 18:1-8) Wouldn’t the Lord be quick, in fulfilling their holy prayer? “[…] And the Lord said, “Listen to what the unjust judge says. And will not God bring about justice for his chosen ones, who cry out to him day and night? Will he keep putting them off? I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?” This is not happening yet, but we can make it happen. SUMMARY (You can freely download the pdf) 1 - Brief history of the Church 2 – God wants men to cooperate his plans 3 – The importance of prayer and the Lord’s prayer 4 – The Last Day 5 – While in the world 6 – Warnings 7 – Avoid misconceptions 8 – An unprecedented event 9 – SOURCES 1 - Brief history of the Church Along the history, many spiritual leaders did not listen to (Matthew 23:9-10) “And do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah.” Therefore, it comes as no surprise that many false teachings did spread for centuries. Nor it is a surprise that true Christians come to a better understanding of some concepts through centuries, because luckily some of them are able to get rid of the false teachings they have received. Indeed, luckily some listened to Matthew 23:9-10. Moreover, Jesus said (John 16:12): ”I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.” Thus, an increasing understanding, founded on the Gospels and never contradicting them, is to be expected through history. 2 – God wants men to cooperate his plans Even though God could do everything alone, by not waiting his followers to align their will to His will, still he wants men to decide to cooperate with Him, to proceed in His salvation Plan. For those who knows the Scriptures, it’s not needed to quote the countless times in which God waited for men to turn to Him, and adhere His plan, before making things happen. Because being a loving Father, he doesn’t force His will upon men. 3 – The importance of prayer and the Lord’s prayer Point 2 on cooperation between God and men, is one of the reasons why Jesus stressed so much the importance of prayer. To be short, we only quote some passages, but there are countless ones in the Gospels alone: (Matthew 7:7) “Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.” (John 16:24) “Until now you have not asked for anything in my name. Ask and you will receive, and your joy will be complete.” Of course, we need to make prayers aligned with God’s will. But even if something is already in God’s will, it’s really important for us to pray for it, because the Lord don’t want to force his gifts upon us, but want us to desire Him. Otherwise, there wouldn’t be any need for any prayer whatsoever. Now, what’s the only prayer that the Lord directly taught us? The Lord’s prayer. Let’s examine some passages: “your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.” […] “And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.” Now, let’s think about it, by knowing the Scriptures. When and how can the Lord completely fulfill these requests? Could they be fulfilled while we are still on earth? 4 – The Last Day It doesn’t take a leap of imagination, to realize that the Lord’s prayer promises will be fully fulfilled only with the Rapture and His Second Coming. [Even the only apparently not messianic request about the “bread”, is translated somewhere as “the bread of tomorrow”, thus indicating the bread of the Kingdom.] Now, it’s not a purpose of this work to choose which interpretation of the Second Coming is more Scriptural. Whatever it is, pre/post/multi/anti/tribulation,this is not the point here. The point is that only in the Last Day, the Lord will fully fulfill the Lord’s prayer requests. Now, are we aware of this? Are we, most Christians, praying that prayer with full intention and awareness, with the awareness that we are asking the Lord, according to His will, to shorten the days of His coming? It doesn’t seem like this awareness has been fully reached so far, but now the times may be arrived. Now this intention can be shared to Christians all over the earth. And it’s nothing new, it’s something fully Scriptural (Peter 3:12, Revelation 22:20, Matthew 6:13), it’s just a better understanding of the power of our prayer in the name of Jesus. We are not predicting the day or the hour, and we’ll never try to do it. There is no needing of knowing the day nor the our, to ask the Lord to come quick, according to His will. How powerful would be this prayer, shouted by all His elects? What if some wise pastors could be able to share this intention to Christians all over the world, and all together we could pray “Come”, and “Deliver us from evil”, with the full understanding that we are asking for the Rapture, instead of passively waiting for it? This would be an unprecedented event in History, since so far most Christians have passively waited for it 5 – While in the world Asking for the rapture, doesn’t cut off any obligation for a true Christian life. Before Jesus returns, we’ll still have the obligation to love everyone, serve other people, improve the society, improve ourself, spread the Gospel. All of these commandments are in the Gospel and are immutable. At the same time, with this prayer, we clarify our intention to God, we tell Him that we are ready, and it is now time for our plans to align with His plans, and that we fully want and responsibly request His return for the elects. 6 – Warnings Unfortunately, there will always be some Christians who don’t really want the Lord to come soon. They are not excited at all about Heaven. Exactly like in these Parables: (Luke 14:15-20) “When one of those at the table with him heard this, he said to Jesus, “Blessed is the one who will eat at the feast in the kingdom of God.” Jesus replied: “A certain man was preparing a great banquet and invited many guests. At the time of the banquet he sent his servant to tell those who had been invited, ‘Come, for everything is now ready.’ “But they all alike began to make excuses. The first said, ‘I have just bought a field, and I must go and see it. Please excuse me.’ “Another said, ‘I have just bought five yoke of oxen, and I’m on my way to try them out. Please excuse me.’ “Still another said, ‘I just got married, so I can’t come.’ (Luke 19:14) "But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, 'We don't want this man to be our king.' (John 12:43) “For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.” But other Christians who aspire to Heaven, would have no reason to not pray this prayer. In the worst case, it will have no effect. In the best case, how glad we will be, to see the Lord coming quickly for us. 7 – Avoid misconceptions Q: “Does praying the Lord to come quickly mean that we don’t trust His promise that He will come?” A: “Absolutely not. The Lord knew the future. He knew about the prayers from His elects, and that he wouldn’t wait to fulfill them. Exactly as in countless other situations, in which the Lord has waited for men to ask Him for what is good. (Matthew 15:21-28). We are sure that His promise will be fulfilled, but we want to be among the ones that have aligned with His will and asked Him to fulfill it quickly.” Q: “Are we forcing the Lord to do something not in His will? Doesn’t He know the Right Time?” A: “He knows the Right Time, and we don’t know according to which criteria He has decided it. But according to the prayer He taught, when He decided it, part of the weight for the decision, came from considering the prayers of His elects (Peter 3:12, Revelation 22:20, Matthew 6:13, Luke 18:1-8). Exactly as in other situations, He gave importance and weight to the will of his disciples and prophets, when aligned to His will” Q: “Are Christians praying this prayer exempt to contribute to society, and to spend their lives serving others until the Lord come?” A: “Absolutely not. A real Christian will follow all Jesus words,not only ones about prayer,respect the laws of his country, and will spend His life helping other people, so that when the Lord will come, he will find him ready.” (Matthew 24:45-51) “Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” Q: “Will shortening the return of the Lord prevent some people from salvation?” A: “First off, remember that there will never be a moment on earth in which everyone will be Christian, before the rapture. It is not written anywhere. On the contrary, it is written about an increasingly diminishing of faith. Moreover, people who haven’t met Christ but are seeking for the Truth in their hearts, and are loving their brothers, will be likely raptured too. Exactly as some other righteous people like Socrates, will be raised in the last day, while evil people who are not seeking for repentance because they don’t have the seed of repentance in their hearts, will be left. Therefore, there is no such risk in shortening the day. Otherwise, the Lord wouldn’t have taught us this prayer.” Q:”What about theological and philosophical implications of this event Why someone is taken and someone else left?” A: “These are not treated here. They will be treated in other works, and some wise pastors will be able to answer this, by following the Scriptures” 8 – An unprecedented event If most Christian living today will share this intention, and pray together for it, this will be an unprecedented even in the history of the world. If the rapture happened centuries ago, it would have likely remained unexplained and not testified everywhere. But nowadays, thanks to technologies and to the Gospel spread everywhere, it will be testified to people of all nations, and everyone will know what happened. Now, our hope is that some wise Christian, who spent their lifes in the hope of Jesus’ Return, will actively spread this prayer and this intention among other pastors and Christians, so that all of us may be reunited under the Lord’s prayer, and pray together, with full intention and understanding and without the usual countless distractions and desires: Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy Name, thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day the bread of the Day that is coming. And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. Maranatha. Our Lord, come!  
      9 - SOURCES:
      http://learnbibleprophecy.blogspot.it/2010/12/come-lord-jesus-maranatha.html
      https://www.oneplace.com/ministries/love-worth-finding/read/articles/can-we-hasten-the-second-coming-of-christ-15204.html
      http://www.whatsaiththescripture.com/Timeline/Hastening.Lords.Return.html
      http://christianteaching.org.uk/blog/eschatology/hastening-the-return-of-christ/#comment-32538
      http://folkslisten.blogspot.it/2010/06/can-i-speed-up-return-of-jesus.html
      https://nathanaelflock.wordpress.com/2013/06/17/scriptural-conviction-hastening-the-day-of-the-lord/
      http://quailandmanna.com/god-justice/
      https://peteenns.com/why-jesus-hasnt-come-back-yet-according-to-the-new-testament/
      http://ifollowjesusnow.tk/hastening-ready-day-lord/
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIdjGyMTAds
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bM67orv8VkYF
      PDF:
      maranatha.pdf
    • By Brother Duke
      Here is a study I have been working on.
       
      Woe, Woe, woe.

      Revelation uses woes as markers or time stamps. The trumpets, seals and bowls are grouped within the 3 woes. The word Alas is translated from the same word in the Greek that is Woe. I have also noticed the great earthquake is always around the resurrection. There was a great earthquake when Christ was resurrected and there was an earthquake when the two witness were brought back to life.

      Revelation 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!



      1st woe devil is cast out and tribulation starts.

      Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

      Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

      Matthew 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. 

      Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.



      2nd woe resurrection/rapture. Babylon is judged.

      Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

      Revelation 9:12 One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter.

      Revelation 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

      Revelation 11:13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

      Revelation 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.

      Revelation 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 

      Revelation 9:13 And the sixth angel sounded, and I heard a voice from the four horns of the golden altar which is before God,

      Revelation 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

      Revelation 18:10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.

      Revelation 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls! 

      Revelation 18:19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.

      Revelation 14:8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.

      Revelation 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held



      3rd woe God's wrath

      Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 

      Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

      Revelation 6::17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
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