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Some encouraging Scriptures about the rapture


Mary8

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23 hours ago, Last Daze said:

Which essentially makes it meaningless.

OF COURSE it is not meaningless: God sent the church out with the gospel - to a world ruled by Satan. His plan was to stop the gospel in any way possible to prove God a liar. (That has always been one of His goals.) God LIMITED Satan in his efforts to stop the gospel: Satan would be allowed to use war, famine, pestilence and wild beasts. And he would be LIMITED to only one forth of the earth to use these things to stop the gospel. If the gospel ever got OUT Of that 1/4, Satan could not use these methods to stop the gospel.

We can be sure, Satan was convinced he could stop the gospel and never allow it OUT of Europe, the Middle East, and Africa - the 1/4 in question. He FAILED: The gospel got into Asia! It got into the West. It is now in every nation of the world.

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3 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

OF COURSE it is not meaningless: God sent the church out with the gospel - to a world ruled by Satan. His plan was to stop the gospel in any way possible to prove God a liar. (That has always been one of His goals.) God LIMITED Satan in his efforts to stop the gospel: Satan would be allowed to use war, famine, pestilence and wild beasts. And he would be LIMITED to only one forth of the earth to use these things to stop the gospel. If the gospel ever got OUT Of that 1/4, Satan could not use these methods to stop the gospel.

We can be sure, Satan was convinced he could stop the gospel and never allow it OUT of Europe, the Middle East, and Africa - the 1/4 in question. He FAILED: The gospel got into Asia! It got into the West. It is now in every nation of the world.

That's your presumption.  There's nothing in the text to indicate that Jesus opened the seals for the purpose of stopping the gospel from going forth.  The idea seems ludicrous to me.

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3 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Did you ever notice how similar these methods are to what Ezekiel wrote?

Ezekiel 6:11  Thus saith the Lord God; Smite with thine hand, and stamp with thy foot, and say, Alas for all the evil abominations of the house of Israel! for they shall fall by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence.  This is the very purpose of these three riders.

Doesn't fit your narrative

In Christ

Montana Marv

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3 hours ago, iamlamad said:

You are STILL missing it! in chapter 9 it is very clear how many will be killed. In chapter 6, it is clear that they are limited in WHERE they can operate to only 1/4th of the earth. There is NO MENTION as to how many they will kill: it could be 1% or it could be 100%. That information is simply NOT GIVEN.

However, looking back over the church age: just one: a pestilence: the black plague: hit Europe I think at least three times! Each time it killed about 1/3 of the people. Then where was two world wars. I have never read what percentage of the people of Europe and Africa were killed by these two words. But the truth is, there has hardly been a ten year stretch in Europe where there was not war going on somewhere where people were being killed. War does that.

How many have died over the age of the church, in Europe and Africa through famines? It is unknown, but millions, for sure.

Yet your numbers are not valid. A specific number over a static period of time is reality. Not a number spread across many decades as you suggest.

In Christ

Montana Marv

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4 hours ago, iamlamad said:

 I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

They were given authority and power over a fourth part of the earth (Amp)
 
there was given unto them authority over the fourth part of the earth  (ASV)
 
A quarter of the earth was put into their power  (Phillips)
 
They all basically say the same thing: notice carefully what it does NOT say: that 1/4 of the earth would be killed. What it DOES say is that God would LIMIT them in their theater of operation to only 1/4 of the earth. In other words, the Red Horse and rider to start wars ONLY in this 1/4th of the earth.  The black horse and rider could not bring famine in any other part of the world: ONLY in this 1/4th.
 
The purpose of the Red horse and rider, the Black horse and rider, and the Pale horse and rider was to STOP the advance of the Gospel by starting wars and causing famines and pestilences such as the Black Plague that hit Europe twice - each time killing almost 1/3 of the population.
 
Note carefully, these riders have nothing to do with the wars and famines during the church age in other parts of the world. Here have certainly been wars, famines and pestilences in Asia, but they have nothing to do with these riders - nor have these riders had anything to do with wars, famines, and pestilences in other parts of the world. The gospel BEGAN in Jerusalem so we can be sure this 1/4 of the world would be centered in Jerusalem. What it DOES say is that God would LIMIT them in their theater of operation to only 1/4 of the earth. In other words, the Red Horse and rider to start wars ONLY in this 1/4th of the earth.  The black horse and rider could not bring famine in any other part of the world: ONLY in this 1/4th. - the very place where wars and famines have been endless, and where pestilences have hit over and over again.

Hi iamlamad,

Well, things just don't add up.

Europe.....Middle East.....Africa.......

The total land mass of these areas are...Europe 10,180,000 sq km...Middle East 9,000,000 sq km..Africa 29,648,000 sq km...... approx 49 million sq km

Total sq km of land on earth is......148,326,000 sq km. 

So the areas you propose are 1/3.....not 1/4.

Your words...."That would be Europe, Middle East and Africa"

"What it DOES say is that God would LIMIT them in their theater of operation to only 1/4 of the earth. In other words, the Red Horse and rider to start wars ONLY in this 1/4th of the earth.  The black horse and rider could not bring famine in any other part of the world: ONLY in this 1/4th.

There is a big difference between 1/4 and 1/3.

God knows the difference between 1/4 and 1/3.

I don't think you do.

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1 hour ago, JoeCanada said:

Hi iamlamad,

Well, things just don't add up.

Europe.....Middle East.....Africa.......

The total land mass of these areas are...Europe 10,180,000 sq km...Middle East 9,000,000 sq km..Africa 29,648,000 sq km...... approx 49 million sq km

Total sq km of land on earth is......148,326,000 sq km. 

So the areas you propose are 1/3.....not 1/4.

Your words...."That would be Europe, Middle East and Africa"

"What it DOES say is that God would LIMIT them in their theater of operation to only 1/4 of the earth. In other words, the Red Horse and rider to start wars ONLY in this 1/4th of the earth.  The black horse and rider could not bring famine in any other part of the world: ONLY in this 1/4th.

There is a big difference between 1/4 and 1/3.

God knows the difference between 1/4 and 1/3.

I don't think you do.

If you are going to be that particular, them MOST of Europe, MOST of Africa and then the Middle East.  God did not draw us a map! And we can only guess it would be like an apple with 1/4 marked off. We don't know if it was 1/4 from pole to pole or if was across the 10/40 window.  Since both world wars started in Europe, I think it is 1/4 from pole to pole.

You don't think I know? Given the choice, I would ALWAYS take 1/3 of a pie versus 1/4 of a pie!!

You disagree over the most amazing things!

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1 hour ago, Montana Marv said:

Yet your numbers are not valid. A specific number over a static period of time is reality. Not a number spread across many decades as you suggest.

In Christ

Montana Marv

WRONG! I am not suggesting ANY specific number or percentage because the scripture doesn't. A specific number or percentage is your side of this discussion.

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1 hour ago, Montana Marv said:

Doesn't fit your narrative

In Christ

Montana Marv

Of course it does: their purpose is to kill with the sword, kill with famine and kill with pestilence: but why? I would suggest, to stop the advance of the gospel. Since the first seal is the church taking the gospel to a world under the leadership of Satan, it makes sense. The purpose of the church age is to take the gospel to the entire world. Jesus only started; He left it up to the church to finish.

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5 hours ago, Last Daze said:

That's your presumption.  There's nothing in the text to indicate that Jesus opened the seals for the purpose of stopping the gospel from going forth.  The idea seems ludicrous to me.

You are still staring at a tree, and trying to understand a forest. God's goal is to get the 7th trumpet sounded so that Satan will be DETHRONED and Jesus get His planet back. How is God going to get to the 7th trumpet? He must first get the BOOK opened - and to do that, He must open all the seals. I have always suspected that Satan had something to do with seals 2 - 4.

OF COURSE God wanted to send the church out with the gospel. That goes without saying. But Satan is the prince of this world.  God had to come to an agreement with Satan. Our God does everything LEGALLY.  This book is a legal document created in heaven. I am convinced it is the lease document between Adam and God.. But since Satan usurped Adam's lease, it became between God and Satan.

I am further convinced the book contains the entire 70th week of Daniel. God would have NO legal right to bring the 70th week upon Satan's world, unless it could be done legally. We can be assured that it will be.  First God had to find someone worthy to open the seals. CHECK! Then Jesus began opening the seals. CHECK!

The book will have to get opened and the 70th week completed before Jesus can come an take possession of His planet.

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12 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

You are still staring at a tree, and trying to understand a forest. God's goal is to get the 7th trumpet sounded so that Satan will be DETHRONED and Jesus get His planet back. How is God going to get to the 7th trumpet? He must first get the BOOK opened - and to do that, He must open all the seals. I have always suspected that Satan had something to do with seals 2 - 4.

OF COURSE God wanted to send the church out with the gospel. That goes without saying. But Satan is the prince of this world.  God had to come to an agreement with Satan. Our God does everything LEGALLY.  This book is a legal document created in heaven. I am convinced it is the lease document between Adam and God.. But since Satan usurped Adam's lease, it became between God and Satan.

I am further convinced the book contains the entire 70th week of Daniel. God would have NO legal right to bring the 70th week upon Satan's world, unless it could be done legally. We can be assured that it will be.  First God had to find someone worthy to open the seals. CHECK! Then Jesus began opening the seals. CHECK!

The book will have to get opened and the 70th week completed before Jesus can come an take possession of His planet.

You say that when Jesus opens the first seal that the gospel goes forth.  You say this happened ~ 32AD.  The "forest" says that the opening of the seals takes place AFTER the letters are written  to the seven gentile churches in Asia Minor.  It requires some kind of time travel contortion to believe your chronology.

And you say that when Jesus opens the next four seals, also ~ 32AD, that they are opposition to the gospel.  Why would Jesus send the gospel forth only to turn around and oppose it's going forth?  Doesn't that sound a little double-minded to you?

Sorry iamlamad.  Spin it however you want but I can't seriously consider your notion of a time-traveling, double-minded Jesus eschatology.  It may be time to quit spinning and start over.

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