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Some encouraging Scriptures about the rapture


Mary8

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The rabbis say that the last Messiah’s end time redemption will be like the first Moses exodus redemption. Just as Moses released prophetic decree on Pharaoh, so will the prophetic church released prophetic decree in partnership with Jesus on the Antichrist kingdom.

 

Just as the plagues in Egypt destroyed Pharaoh’s resources and hindered his oppression of God’s people, so will the Judgments in Revelation destroy the Antichrist resources, hindered his persecution of the saints and will keep the spread of evil in check. 

 

The response of the Antichrist to these judgement will be similar that that of Pharaoh. It will harden their hearts. They are both embedded in pride, they do not repent. God is just even to the wicked. He gives them a clear warning of judgment coming to them even though they have no intention to repent.

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There are 8 direct passages about the rapture in the NT. In every single one of them, there is a time reference of the rapture occurring after the tribulation, after the appearance of the man of sin, after the resurrection of the dead. Go and check it out for yourself.

 

 

Mathew 24 (two references)

Mark 13

Luke 17

1 Corinthians 15:51-52

2 Thessalonians2:1

1 Thessalonians 4:16

2 Thessalonians 2:3

 

2 Thessalonians2:1

 

Now we beseech you, brothers, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together to him,

 

It speaks about the coming of the lord (second coming) and our gathering together unto him (rapture) as one event taking place together. The second coming and the rapture occurs at the same time.

 

 

1 Corinthians 15:52

 

In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

 

Here we have the timing of the rapture. It occurs at the last trumpets. The last trumpet is the 7th trumpets. Revelation 11:15, the 7th angel sounds the 7th trumpet to announce the second coming.” And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.” The second coming and the rapture occurs at the sounding of the last trumpet.

 

1 Thessalonians 4:16

 

 

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

 

The lord descend from heaven with a shout with the voice of an archangel and with the trumpet call of God (second coming), the dead in Christ rise first (the dead has to be resurrected first, it’s a bodily resurrection), then we which are alive are caught up together with them to meet the lord in the air (the rapture when we are changed: our mortal body will put on immortality)

 

 

2 Thessalonians 2:3

 

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there comes a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 

The second coming and the rapture cannot happen until the man of sin must first appear in the temple claiming to be God.

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/237877-unlocking-every-66-books-of-the-bible/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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It is important to differentiate between two types of judgment:

 

 

God’s judgment upon the wicked because of their wickedness.

Scripture tells us plainly that God put a difference between the righteous and the unrighteous, that the judgment due to the wicked will not fall on the righteous. God will either remove the righteous as in the case of Lot, before destroying Sodom and Gomorrah or He will protect the righteous as in the case of Israel in the land of Goshen. Israel was protected from all the plagues judgement that fell on Egypt.  God has not appointed us to wrath (1Thes 5:19)

 

The second type of judgement is persecution from the ungodly upon the godly that arises because of their righteousness.

 

All those that live godly shall suffer persecution (2 Tim 3:12). Jesus speaking to the generation in which He will return said you shall be hated of all men for My name’s sake …….( Mat 10:22 )….fear not them which kill the body but are not able to kill the soul but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell ( Matt 10:28)

 

In Revelation, the saints are sealed and protected from God’s judgments falling on the wicked. The Goshen principle will apply. The miracles of the exodus will operate: supernatural supply of food and water, the supernatural direction for the saints, the miracles of signs and wonders and the anointing to release prophetic decrees

 

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/237877-unlocking-every-66-books-of-the-bible/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Kristen,

I certainly will. Just a note, even though we all `teach` to some degree as we post, on the general threads, we are just giving our thoughts for discussion.

regards, Marilyn. 

Yes. I may pipe in. I know what you mean tho. Thanks. 

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24 minutes ago, Worship Warriors said:

It is important to differentiate between two types of judgment:

 

 

 

 

 

God’s judgment upon the wicked because of their wickedness.

 

 

 

Scripture tells us plainly that God put a difference between the righteous and the unrighteous, that the judgment due to the wicked will not fall on the righteous. God will either remove the righteous as in the case of Lot, before destroying Sodom and Gomorrah or He will protect the righteous as in the case of Israel in the land of Goshen. Israel was protected from all the plagues judgement that fell on Egypt.  God has not appointed us to wrath (1Thes 5:19)

 

 

 

The second type of judgement is persecution from the ungodly upon the godly that arises because of their righteousness.

 

 

 

All those that live godly shall suffer persecution (2 Tim 3:12). Jesus speaking to the generation in which He will return said you shall be hated of all men for My name’s sake …….( Mat 10:22 )….fear not them which kill the body but are not able to kill the soul but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell ( Matt 10:28)

 

 

 

In Revelation, the saints are sealed and protected from God’s judgments falling on the wicked. The Goshen principle will apply. The miracles of the exodus will operate: supernatural supply of food and water, the supernatural direction for the saints, the miracles of signs and wonders and the anointing to release prophetic decrees

 

 

 

https://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic/237877-unlocking-every-66-books-of-the-bible/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The righteous just believe. Right?  I ask because I think we try so hard to be righteous. But we either are or are not. It’s a matter of belief in Jesus Christ. 

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7 hours ago, Kristin said:

I’m trying to understand all this. I do understand that God is “legal” and deals with Satan in a legal manner. I also have heard that the scroll is the title deed to Earth. It’s a lot to take in. Thanks. The timing of it all doesn’t seem overly clear. 

yes, the scroll is the title deed to the earth

Leviticus 25:23-24 law of redemption for the land

 

'The land must not be sold permanently, because the land is mine and you reside in my land as foreigners and strangers. Throughout the land that you hold as a possession, you must provide for the redemption of the land. (NIV)

“If your brother becomes poor and sells part of his property, then his nearest redeemer shall come and redeem what his brother has sold. (ESV)

 

God gave the earth to Adam but Adam forfeited it to Satan. The year of jubilee has now come when the earth is to be redeemed. A kinsman redeemer is needed to redeem the forfeited property. If a kinsman redeemer cannot be found, the earth would remain forever under the rule of Satan and the antichrist evil regime.

 

The Father holds the scroll in his hand. The scroll is the title deed of the earth, the destiny of the whole earth is in this scroll. A strong angel proclaims with a loud voice: who is worthy to open the book and to loose the seal thereof? Taking the scroll implies being found worthy to execute the action plans that are in it.

 

John wept much (Greek: to wail aloud with strong crying, to convulse) because no man was found worthy to take the scroll, to execute the battle plans that are in it and redeem the forfeited property. Leviticus 25:23-25 three conditions must be met to act as a kinsman redeemer:

 

The person redeeming the forfeited property has to be a near relative, a next of kin

He must be willing to act as a redeemer

He must be able to pay the price of redemption.

 

Jesus was the ONLY ONE found worthy to act as a kinsman redeemer. The word was made flesh and came to dwell among us. He took on the seed of Abraham and became a relative of the one who had loss possession of the earth. He is willing to act as a redeemer. He is able to pay the price of redemption through His blood because he is both the son of Man and the Son of God.

Jesus is seen as a lamb that had been slain and having 7 horns. It speaks of the depths of his suffering and of the heights of his victory. And He came and took the scroll out of the right hand of Him that sat on the throne (5:6-7)

 

Jesus accepts the responsibility to cleanse the earth, make war with the antichrist and remove Satan off this planet. He accepts this responsibility as a man, as a kinsman redeemer anointed with the fullness of the 7 spirit of God. The prophecy of Isaiah 61:1-2, the spirit of the LORD is upon me because he has anointed me. There was a partial fulfilment of this prophecy at the first coming. Jesus lived in dependence of the anointing of the Holy Spirit at his first coming, and he will be dependent on the anointing of the Holy Spirit at his second coming.

 

https://worshipwarriorsministry.com.au/

 

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, Worship Warriors said:

There are 8 direct passages about the rapture in the NT. In every single one of them, there is a time reference of the rapture occurring after the tribulation, after the appearance of the man of sin, after the resurrection of the dead. Go and check it out for yourself.

SPOCK REBUTTAL:  I did....I’m going to share my perspective on these passages if you don’t mind. I don’t want Kristen to not be aware of the other side of the coin.  I noticed you failed to mention the many passages that PROMISE THE CHURCH will not experience God’s WRATH, yet it appears you dismiss that promise. Don’t you think that is pretty important too? 

Mathew 24 (two references), Luke 17, Mark 13 (all the same): 

SPOCK REBUTTAL: I believe The  Matt 24:29-31 passage that is often referenced to support a late rapture is talking about the second coming, not the rapture. It says “AFTER THE TRIBULATION”.....THAT TELLS ME AT THE END OF THE 70th week Jesus will return with his angels and the church saints who were previously raptured and resurrected. This appears to be talking about his second coming to earth, not the rapture. 

 

2 Thessalonians2:1

Now we beseech you, brothers, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together to him,

SPOCK Rebuttal: this passage can say a few things here so you can’t be precise just based on these you quoted. They may be talking about the same event....his coming to get us and our going up.....from two perspectives ( his and ours). 

 

It speaks about the coming of the lord (second coming) and our gathering together unto him (rapture) as one event taking place together. The second coming and the rapture occurs at the same time.

 

1 Corinthians 15:52

In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Here we have the timing of the rapture. It occurs at the last trumpets. The last trumpet is the 7th trumpets. Revelation 11:15, the 7th angel sounds the 7th trumpet to announce the second coming.” And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.” The second coming and the rapture occurs at the sounding of the last trumpet.

SPOCK REBUTTAL:  There are many trumpets blown throughout the Bible and for different reasons. Do a search for “trumpets” to see. For example, have you heard of the Feast of Trumpets (Jewish feast)?  Here a shofar is blown 100 times so there is a last trumpet blast there, number 100. Many believe the rapture will occur on......the Feast of Trumpets.  If so, you can bet, the last trumpet will be the number 100 blast at that time, not the 7th trumpet of Rev.  It is  merely an assumption to say the rapture has to occur at the 7th trumpet of Revelation. I believe a very bad assumption too. 

 

1 Thessalonians 4:16

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

The lord descend from heaven with a shout with the voice of an archangel and with the trumpet call of God (second coming), the dead in Christ rise first (the dead has to be resurrected first, it’s a bodily resurrection), then we which are alive are caught up together with them to meet the lord in the air (the rapture when we are changed: our mortal body will put on immortality)

SPOCK REBUTTAL: The dead in Christ get their immortal bodies just before the raptured saints in Christ do. This passage has nothing to do with the second coming. At the second coming the faithful Jews and 70th week Martyrs will be resurrected with glorified bodies (Daniel 12:1-2 and Rev 20:4).

 

2 Thessalonians 2:3

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there comes a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 

The second coming and the rapture cannot happen until the man of sin must first appear in the temple claiming to be God.

SPOCK REBUTTAL: “Falling away” in this passage is the Greek word apostacia, which is translated DEPARTURE....which could very well mean departure of the Saints (rapture) especially because it is preceded by the article “the”.  THE DEPARTURE=Rapture!  

Spock conclusion: Anyhow, there are always two sides to every coin.  I know this can be confusing but always keep this one thought in mind......God DID NOT APPOINT US (the church) to experience His wrath.  The extent of His wrath has been debated, but I think most people would agree, this includes all the 7 trumpet and 7 bowl judgments. Some believe this includes the 7 seal Judgments as well.   I am 100% convinced we will not experience any of the trumpet judgments so no one could ever convince me the last trumpet means rapture after trumpet 7. God would be a liar then because he promised we would not experience his wrath.

Happy hunting, Kristen. 

Spock

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, iamlamad said:

No, you are just missing the entire purpose of chapters 4 & 5. Until you understand His intent there, you will never under the first seals.

You still don't get it. Satan is the god of this world. God had to deal with him about the earth lease. Satan wants to hold onto it forever. But God's plan was that at the 7th trumpet Satan would lose and God would win. Satan then wanted every possible road block in the way, to make it impossible for God to get the book opened.  He never, ever, thought a MAN would be able to defeat death. No man in 4000 years did. But Jesus prevailed over death and became worthy to open the seals.

Since Satan is the god of this present world, God would have NO LEGAL way to send out the church with the gospel. That is, not until a man was found worthy to open the seals. Jesus then opened the first seal, and they God could LEGALLY send out the church into Satan's world.  As soon as Jesus opened seals 2 through 4, then Satan could legally do war, famine and pestilence to stop the gospel.

Jesus HAD to open them, because to get Satan dethroned all 7 seals must be opened.

You do understand, there is WAR going on between Satan and God?

Is it that hard to believe that Satan was in God's face, demanding that if God could send out the church into his (Satan's) world, then he must have options to stop the church?  it makes perfect sense. From day one, Satan has tried to stop the church. He has failed. However, during the dark ages, it certainly looked like Satan was winning this war.

No, it is time for you to take off your preconceptions and read the text as it is written. I am going by what is written: Jesus NOT seen, Jesus NOT found worthy, the Holy Spirit NOT YET sent down, and then after time passes, Jesus FOUND worthy, then Jesus ascends and sends the Holy Spirit down. This is exactly what is written. We just read these verses differently.

Perhaps you don't understand that Satan usurped Adam's great authority and dominion. Adam was placed as the spiritual leader of this planet, with the authority to subdue Satan and all demons. Instead, he turned the world over to Satan. The entire human race then came into Satan's possession. That is why the human race had to be REDEEMED, or bought back.

Ever wonder why God asked Abraham to sacrifice His only Son? It was because God wanted to sacrifice HIS only Son - but it would have been illegal until God could get a MAN to enter into a blood covenant with Him, and sacrifice his son. That made it legal for God to sacrifice His son.

God does everything legally. Abraham was very  important to our gospel.

In the same way God had to make it legal to send out the church into Satan's world.

Ever since Satan was cast as profane from the mountain (kingdom) of God (Ezekiel 28:16) he has been opposing God at every turn.  He doesn't need Jesus to open any seals to cause him to do so, as you suggest.  That is his M.O. and it will be until he is cast into the lake of fire.

THIS is what Jesus did after He ascended.  Read it carefully.  It sounds nothing like what you suggest.

  • But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift.  Therefore it says,When He ascended on high, He led captive a host of captives, And He gave gifts to men.”  Now this expression, “He ascended,” what does it mean except that He also had descended into the lower parts of the earth?  He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.  And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ; until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.  Ephesians 4:7-13

What did Jesus do?  He gave gifts to the church.  For what purpose?  To equip the saints for the building up of the body of Christ.  NOWHERE does it say that He opened seals to oppose the spreading of the gospel.  You've gotten so far from the truth that you are saying things that contradict scripture.  Jesus is not double-minded.  He does not give gifts to further the gospel on one hand and then open seals to oppose the gospel on the other.  Absurd.

 

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1 hour ago, Spock said:

Two sides of every coin

Very good, Spock!

Edited by iamlamad
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5 minutes ago, Last Daze said:

Ever since Satan was cast as profane from the mountain (kingdom) of God (Ezekiel 28:16) he has been opposing God at every turn.  He doesn't need Jesus to open any seals to cause him to do so, as you suggest.  That is his M.O. and it will be until he is cast into the lake of fire.

THIS is what Jesus did after He ascended.  Read it carefully.  It sounds nothing like what you suggest.

  • But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift.  Therefore it says,When He ascended on high, He led captive a host of captives, And He gave gifts to men.”  Now this expression, “He ascended,” what does it mean except that He also had descended into the lower parts of the earth?  He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.  And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ; until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.  Ephesians 4:7-13

What did Jesus do?  He gave gifts to the church.  For what purpose?  To equip the saints for the building up of the body of Christ.  NOWHERE does it say that He opened seals to oppose the spreading of the gospel.  You've gotten so far from the truth that you are saying things that contradict scripture.  Jesus is not double-minded.  He does not give gifts to further the gospel on one hand and then open seals to oppose the gospel on the other.  Absurd.

 

Why do you say "nowhere" when you know Jesus is seen in Revelation opening seals?  Nothing I say contradicts scripture. It may well contradict your theory of scripture. You said it yourself, from a different scripture: Jesus ASCENDED. From John we know that He said when He ascends He would send the Holy Spirit down. Revelation chapter 5, (after the fact) show Jesus ascending and sending the Holy Spirit down.

By the way, there are things written in Revelation simply not written anywhere else in the bible - such as this book sealed with 7 seals. God did not include everything there is to know in the Bible: John tells us this at the end of His gospel. For example, John does not come out and tell us that this book is the lease document of earth; but we can deduce that from the fact that Satan gets cast out and loses his place as the god of this world when the book gets opened.

Just do you know, Satan has never been able to do what He wants to do: destroy the human race. God has set LIMITS on Satan. However, for 42 months, most of those limits will be removed.

It is OK if you don't understand God's intent in chapters 4 and 5, and if you don't understand the first 5 seals. You can still live a full and active Christian life.

For the readers: we are discussing what God's intent was in the first five seals in Rev. 6.

I say the first seal is the church sent out with the Gospel, and seals 2 through 4 are Satan's attempts to stop the gospel. Seal 5 is the martyrs of the church age. Seal 6 is after the rapture and the start of judgment.  Last Daze seems to disagree on every point.

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