HAZARD Posted January 16, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 320 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 6,830 Content Per Day: 0.84 Reputation: 3,570 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/16/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 24 minutes ago, missmuffet said: No,that does not tell you what the disorder was that Paul suffered. There was no disorder to speak of that's why none is mentioned. Check all the Scriptures where buffet and buffeted are mentioned. buf'-et (kolaphizo, "to beat with the fist"): Refers to bodily maltreatment and violence, not an illness or disease: "Then did they spit in his face and buffet him" Matt. 26:67, Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands, Mark 14:65, And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands. 1 Cor. 4:11, Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace; 1 Peter 2:20, For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.). Paul speaks of "a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to buffet me" (2 Cor. 12:7). Used figuratively of self-control: "I buffet (the King James Version keep under, the Revised Version, margin "bruise") my body, and bring it into bondage" 1 Cor. 9:27, But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. The Greek in this passage reads hupopiazo, literally "to give a blow beneath the eye." In Luke 18:5 the same word is rendered "wear out": "Lest she wear roe out by her continual coming" (the King James Version "weary me" the Revised Version, margin "bruise me") Pauls thorn in the flesh was the "messenger, and angel of Satan." This angel followed Paul and buffeted him when he was tempted to become exalted. Paul lists in 11:23-27 some of the things that this angel caused him to go through to keep him humble. There is not one disease in the whole list. 2 Cor. 11: 23, Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft. 24, Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one. 25, Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep; 26, In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; 27, In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted January 16, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,990 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,688 Content Per Day: 11.83 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 16, 2018 13 minutes ago, HAZARD said: There was no disorder to speak of that's why none is mentioned. Check all the Scriptures where buffet and buffeted are mentioned. buf'-et (kolaphizo, "to beat with the fist"): Refers to bodily maltreatment and violence, not an illness or disease: "Then did they spit in his face and buffet him" Matt. 26:67, Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands, Mark 14:65, And some began to spit on him, and to cover his face, and to buffet him, and to say unto him, Prophesy: and the servants did strike him with the palms of their hands. 1 Cor. 4:11, Even unto this present hour we both hunger, and thirst, and are naked, and are buffeted, and have no certain dwellingplace; 1 Peter 2:20, For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.). Paul speaks of "a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to buffet me" (2 Cor. 12:7). Used figuratively of self-control: "I buffet (the King James Version keep under, the Revised Version, margin "bruise") my body, and bring it into bondage" 1 Cor. 9:27, But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. The Greek in this passage reads hupopiazo, literally "to give a blow beneath the eye." In Luke 18:5 the same word is rendered "wear out": "Lest she wear roe out by her continual coming" (the King James Version "weary me" the Revised Version, margin "bruise me") Pauls thorn in the flesh was the "messenger, and angel of Satan." This angel followed Paul and buffeted him when he was tempted to become exalted. Paul lists in 11:23-27 some of the things that this angel caused him to go through to keep him humble. There is not one disease in the whole list. 2 Cor. 11: 23, Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft. 24, Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one. 25, Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep; 26, In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; 27, In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness. You are giving the word of God your own meaning. That is a dangerous thing to do. No God does not give us the information of exactly what the ailment was of Paul and the thorn in the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAZARD Posted January 17, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 320 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 6,830 Content Per Day: 0.84 Reputation: 3,570 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/16/2002 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 2 hours ago, missmuffet said: You are giving the word of God your own meaning. That is a dangerous thing to do. No God does not give us the information of exactly what the ailment was of Paul and the thorn in the side. Because he never had an ailment How am I giving the Word of God my own meaning. When they began to spit on Jesus and buffet Him, was He or did He come down with some illness, Mark 14:65? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted January 17, 2018 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 17, 2018 unfortunately some people have not realized the fact that the true God cannot afford to use the services of the wicked one - they have always been in absolute struggle between each other - neither has the activity of the true One ever had a negative effect on any person/soul or provoked a negative reaction to anybody's detriment - the nature of the "Light" is entirely good also, the wicked one has never helped the true God make or keep humans righteous Blessings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiwiChristian Posted January 18, 2018 Group: Members * Followers: 8 Topic Count: 176 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 870 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/23/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/22/1968 Share Posted January 18, 2018 simple. It is not always in Gods' will to heal us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 On 1/16/2018 at 6:18 PM, HAZARD said: Because he never had an ailment How am I giving the Word of God my own meaning. When they began to spit on Jesus and buffet Him, was He or did He come down with some illness, Mark 14:65? You do not know that Paul never had an ailment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytLiJC Posted January 18, 2018 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 357 Content Per Day: 0.15 Reputation: 65 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/21/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted January 18, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, KiwiChristian said: simple. It is not always in Gods' will to heal us. if we mean the divine as a whole, not only the true God, then, yes, God is not only good, but the wicked one is not a system Administrator and Provider of life; so it is not right to call satan "God" - or can you call what only brings you eternal death a Provider of life?! Blessings Edited January 18, 2018 by ytLiJC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted January 18, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,445 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,363 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 18, 2018 (edited) On 1/16/2018 at 4:16 PM, HAZARD said: Pauls thorn in the flesh had nothing to do with sickness or disease, it was A THORN IN THE FLESH, THE MESSENGER OF SATAN to buffet me, LEST I SHOULD BE EXAULTED ABOVE MEASURE. 2 Cor. 12:6-7, v. 6, For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me. v. 7, And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given me A THORN IN THE FLESH, THE MESSENGER OF SATAN to buffet me, LEST I SHOULD BE EXAULTED ABOVE MEASURE. Yep, I agree. I get the sense from reading 2 Corinthians 12: that the thorn in the flesh constituted some sort of reminder? But we're not expressly given that information. We know for certain demon's inflict problems on believers and the work of the Lord. Several possibilities I've pondered are: [1] Paul was constantly tempted of the devil to sin. [2] Paul was performing great miracles and even seen heaven. Was Satan lifting up his pride? [3] Was Satan hindering his spirit and work? [4] His poor vision and eye trouble that Luke appears to have constantly treated? I'm sort of leaning on #2, Satan was buffeting Paul's pride as Satan referred to himself with the five "I will's". Then again, Paul tells us about the whole armor of God in Eph 6: to thwart off the devil. If Paul had on the whole armor of God, why was it a life long problem I asked myself? The thoughts of what Job went through and why has crossed my mind. Edited January 18, 2018 by Dennis1209 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted January 18, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,990 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,688 Content Per Day: 11.83 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted January 18, 2018 Paul was given this thorn because he was blessed with a vision of heaven that God gave him 2 Corinthians 12:1-6. Because God gave him this very rare experience He did not want him to boast or be conceited. There can be many speculations but no one knows what the ailment was. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted January 18, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,445 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,363 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 18, 2018 On 1/16/2018 at 5:34 PM, MorningGlory said: IMO, speculating as to the nature of Paul's 'thorn in the side' is futile. If God wanted us to know He would have let us know. To me it seems as though the Lord wanted us to consider that Paul DID have this affliction and ministered to others in spite of it rather than focus on the affliction itself. Do you see any similarities between Job of the Old Covenant and Paul of the New Covenant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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