Christian's going to hell

[Blood Bought 1953]

2 hours ago, vlad said:

I did not say that only being righteous was the way to heaven. I mean that trying hard to be righteous and making efforts to withstand sin is indispensable for a Christian. I am sure you are trying to be just and good and righteous. May be it is easy and natural for you. As for me it takes efforts.  

 

God does not want you to live a life of effort and striving.He desires that you REST in the finished work of His Son.You need to trust in HIM—— not your pitiful efforts to save yourself or keep yourself saved  by living a “good” life.We can’t live the Christian life, despite all of our striving.It must be lived THROUGH us..Trust Jesus , get out of the way, and let The Holy Spirit do His Job.If you are a Believer,your sins are forgiven, God imputed the righteousness of His Son to your Heavenly account and you obey God from a sense of gratitude and love,not from a fear that any misstep will cast you into the flames of Hell.Realax a little, take advantage of the joy of Christianity that is available to all Believers because of what Jesus accomplished at the cross.

[vlad]

6 hours ago, Yowm said:

When you said this, "Yes, the judgement. That will tell where we go exactly...", which judgment did you mean then?

Of course not the judgement of the people. 

[vlad]

5 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

God does not want you to live a life of effort and striving.He desires that you REST in the finished work of His Son.You need to trust in HIM—— not your pitiful efforts to save yourself or keep yourself saved  by living a “good” life.We can’t live the Christian life, despite all of our striving.It must be lived THROUGH us..Trust Jesus , get out of the way, and let The Holy Spirit do His Job.If you are a Believer,your sins are forgiven, God imputed the righteousness of His Son to your Heavenly account and you obey God from a sense of gratitude and love,not from a fear that any misstep will cast you into the flames of Hell.Realax a little, take advantage of the joy of Christianity that is available to all Believers because of what Jesus accomplished at the cross.

It is all right with me. But there are some people who premeditate a sin and the following repentance in one package. Some criminals think they are Christians and they plan a crime of robbery or murder (say on Friday) and a sincere repentance on the next Sunday. This is not a rare practice and some criminals do believe that a premeditated sin is forgiven if they pray and sincerely ask for forgiveness every time. They believe they can even murder people every week like that. They misunderstand the message of forgiveness, right?

[Blood Bought 1953]

3 hours ago, vlad said:

It is all right with me. But there are some people who premeditate a sin and the following repentance in one package. Some criminals think they are Christians and they plan a crime of robbery or murder (say on Friday) and a sincere repentance on the next Sunday. This is not a rare practice and some criminals do believe that a premeditated sin is forgiven if they pray and sincerely ask for forgiveness every time. They believe they can even murder people every week like that. They misunderstand the message of forgiveness, right?

 

 

Poor God.These sly murderers sure got God over a barrel.He must be wringing His hands trying to do something to get Himself out of this mess that He Himself created by this repentance thingy.” Thinking” you are a Christian does not make you one.” Sincere Repentance” is a lie if you are planning to commit the same sin that you are supposedly repenting of.A true Christian is not sitting around conjuring up ways to sin and get away with it.A true Christian has a pierced heart, made contrite by the Holy Spirit.These types of people wouldn’t know contrition if it jumped up and bit them in the butt.God knows their hearts—— the joke is on them—-they are not  Christians, they are lost fools.

[Adstar]

19 hours ago, vlad said:

May be Christians are many but those who are born again (true Christians) are not so many. The world would have been a different place if all those millions of Christians had really been born again. Or may be they think that the  cleaning process can be conveniently stretched?

Matthew 25:41-46 

⁴¹ Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

⁴² For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

⁴³ I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

⁴⁴ Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

⁴⁵ Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

⁴⁶ And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

My question to you is this: Is it easy to be righteous? It is difficult for me. Does it not take efforts? What about temptations of this world? My impression is still that some people are already very clean (unlike me). Would you advise me to change my ways and now that I am a Christian take things easy. And what if I fall into temptation? Can I be sure  in advance  that it would be enough to repent and repeat this again and repent and so on? Will I not be  lead into temptation and sin with this mindset?

 

We should do our best to resist sin as much as we can. We should ask God for His help to enable us to be more loving towards our neighbors.. But no one ever achieves perfect sinlessness while living in these faulty flesh bodies.. The Standard of God is perfection.. So automatically every human who has the knowledge of Good and Evil has sinned and thus they have all fallen short of the standard of perfection and none of them can justify their own entry into Gods perfect existence.. So the only Way left for us to make it is to be justified by the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ..  We need to be Deemed worthy, because we cannot be worthy.. 

It is impossible to be righteous up to the standard of God by our own efforts.. It is only possible to be deemed righteous by having our unrighteousness covered and thus hidden by the atoning Blood of Jesus..

Some people are good at putting on a show of being good and they hide their sins well.. But God see's all and knows all, So all men need His Atonement..

We should never resist the conviction of the Holy Spirit and we should immediately acknowledge our sins as sins and thank the LORD for His Atonement that He secured on the cross that covers us for each sin we sin..  Conviction is not a pleasant experience and those who truly believe Jesus ( His teachings ) will do their best to avoid being convicted as much as they can..

 

[vlad]

2 hours ago, Yowm said:

There is more than one judgment of God, so I’m still wondering which judgment of God you were referring to.

It is a different thread. I take into account the following: https://www.ucg.org/the-good-news/what-does-the-bible-say-about-gods-judgment Thank you.

[vlad]

On 4/18/2018 at 7:24 PM, Yowm said:

 

It definitely is a different thread especially glaring errors such as this from your link..

Anyways, that link never answered my question.

 

The Final judgement.

When a person knows that he is not perfect it is not an excuse to be idle or not even try be better and to do good deeds by practically defending others by simply openly siding with them. No  one is expected to say: "Oh, I can not be perfect so I will not fight with injustice, I will not try to be better!" That is what I mean. That is unfortunately the policy of some people who are afraid to defend poor people before the authorities by mere siding with them in public, by openly saying it. They say that this world can not be changed so why bother. At the same time some brave unbelievers are not afraid to defend people against injustice. Why? Of course most Christians are doing good deeds and try to be better themselves and fight injustice.

I did not get your answer on Matthew 25:41-46 where I think there is an indication to what is awaiting those who overlook good deeds (good works) however imperfect we are.

[vlad]

5 hours ago, Yowm said:

The good we do or the lack of it and especially our motive will be judged for rewards or loss of rewards at the Bema seat of Christ, a Judgment totally different of the Nations.

Bema seat, judges the Church...

2 Corinthians 5:10 NASBS
[10] For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

 

The Sheep and Goat Judgment judges the nations..

Matthew 25:31-33 NASBS
[31] "But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. [32] All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; [33] and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.

Christians do not appear in this Judgment as it happens at the end of the great tribulation and is a judgment of the nations.

 

 

5 hours ago, Yowm said:

The good we do or the lack of it and especially our motive will be judged for rewards or loss of rewards at the Bema seat of Christ, a Judgment totally different of the Nations.

Bema seat, judges the Church...

2 Corinthians 5:10 NASBS
[10] For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

 

The Sheep and Goat Judgment judges the nations..

Matthew 25:31-33 NASBS
[31] "But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. [32] All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; [33] and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.

Christians do not appear in this Judgment as it happens at the end of the great tribulation and is a judgment of the nations.

 

1).Please comment on  Matthew 25:41-46.

2). If we are already forgiven forever, why do we sincerely ask for forgiveness for our sins, that is also for your own sins, several times every day and every week, and every month, and never stop asking in the Lord's prayer?

[Christine]

Hello there, @shapes

Reading the OP, I thought of the urgent desire of Paul in Colossians 2:1-10, that those to whom he wrote should have COMPLETE ASSURANCE, and he gives the reason why it is so very important to have it, and where it leads:-

‘For I would that ye knew what great conflict I have for you, 
and for them at Laodicea, 
and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh;
That their hearts might be comforted, 
being knit together in love, 
and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, 
to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, 
and of the Father, and of Christ;
In Whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.

And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words.
For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, 
joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ.
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in Him:
Rooted and built up in Him, 
and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, 
abounding therein with thanksgiving.
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, 
after the tradition of men, 
after the rudiments of the world, 
and not after Christ.
For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
And ye are complete in Him, 
Which is the head of all principality and power: ... ‘
(Col 2:1-10 )

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus

Chris

Edited April 20, 2018 by Christine

[Christine]

On 2/24/2018 at 5:40 PM, Yowm said:

Good question, a few possible answers but the root would be unbelief in God's promise to save those who come through the death and resurrection of His Son Jesus Christ. Usually Satan gets the upper hand by his lies and their believing him instead.

 

On 2/24/2018 at 6:37 PM, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

They do not understand the Source of their Salvation.They are trying to trust “their” performance with its ups and downs instead of the Perfect Performance thAt was finished on their behalf by Jesus on the Cross,shedding His Blood .

‘For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) 
dwelleth no good thing: 
for to will is present with me; 
but how to perform that which is good 
I find not.’
(Rom 7:18)  

Hello again, @shapes

The first two responses in this thread hit the nail on the head I believe, as to why believers, both babes and mature, fail to have the assurance that they should have.  

Yowm says that the 'root' is unbelief, and this is true, unpalatable as it is to acknowledge it.  My elder sister, who was bemoaning her inability to understand a point of doctrine to a believing friend, was horrified to hear it said that she simply was failing to believe God in relation to it.  She immediately felt grieved and astounded to feel that this could even be suggested as a reason for her lack of understanding: but on reflection, and by the instrumentality of the Holy Spirit, she saw that it was indeed the case that she had not 'believed' what God had said.  So it is not only when someone initially comes to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that their faith wavers, but at each point of enlightenment there must be a corresponding acknowledgement by faith, in order for that assurance to remain firm and rooted and grounded in the truth that is in Christ Jesus.

Blood Bought 1953, also makes a good, and very relevant point concerning the pit fall of trusting in our own performance, our own experiences, we fail to believe God's estimation of the flesh, which is that in it there is no good thing, and will insist in trying to improve it, when the ongoing work of sanctification within is the work of the Holy Spirit, and no amount of self-effort will accomplish it. The following helps me to remember this:-

Faith, Hope and Experience were walking along a wall, 
and Hope was fine as long as he kept his eyes on Faith, 
but when he turned around to look at Experience, 
he fell off the wall, and so did Experience, 
but Faith went confidently on.

With love in Christ Jesus
Chris

 

 

Edited April 20, 2018 by Christine