brakelite Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 977 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 641 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/15/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2018 We are told in Isaiah 14 :13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. We see here that Lucifer aka Satan aka great red dragon aka accuser of brethren...wanted to be like God. So what is God like? "Gracious, merciful, longsuffering, full of goodness and truth"...we know God to be a God of love, integrity, compassion, grace and mercy. So when we read that Lucifer wanted to be like the Most High, is there any reason to believe that Lucifer wanted to be evil, malicious, vindictive, wicked and selfish in the manner we know he turned out? I think not. I think he wanted to be just like God. So.....what went wrong?????? When these thoughts of self exaltation came to him, where was he and what was he doing? Ezekiel 28:11 ¶ Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, 12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. 13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. 14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. 15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. Lucifer was a "Covering Cherub". Hebrews 8:5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount. We see here that the sanctuary or tabernacle in the wilderness was a copy or a small scale model of things in heaven. In that sanctuary in the wilderness that Moses built there were a number of items of furniture each one representative of a spiritual reality in heaven. I will go further into this as we progress, but in the case of the ‘cherub that covers’ we will go to Exodus 25:18 And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them, in the two ends of the mercy seat. 19 And make one cherub on the one end, and the other cherub on the other end: even of the mercy seat shall ye make the cherubims on the two ends thereof. 20 And the cherubims shall stretch forth their wings on high, covering the mercy seat with their wings, and their faces shall look one to another; toward the mercy seat shall the faces of the cherubims be. 21 And thou shalt put the mercy seat above upon the ark; and in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee. 22 And there I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubims which are upon the ark of the testimony, of all things which I will give thee in commandment unto the children of Israel. Note that the cherubs on either side of the ark of the covenant had their wings spread out over the ark, ‘covering’ the mercy seat. It was upon the mercy seat between the cherubim that God rested and communed with Moses. And it was under the mercy seat within the ark that resided the two tables of the ten commandments. The ark itself represented the throne of God, and His law, the ten commandments, the foundation of His government in heaven. The heavenly law of course was a law of love, which the earthly Ten Commandments were a detailed exposition.The two cherubs were comissioned to guard the throne, to protect God’s laws. This was Lucifer’s exalted position, “until iniquity was found in thee”. Iniquity is sin…sin is transgression against God’s law. (1 John 3:4). Therefore Lucifer rebelled against the very law he was created to protect. Therefore Lucifer sought to "be like God" through selfish ambition and self-exaltation. He sought to be "like God" without reference to the laws of love upon which heaven is founded. Is the church today doing the same thing? Attempting to be "conformed into the image of the Son of God " without reference to the laws of love upon which the kingdom of God is founded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplejeff Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2018 10 minutes ago, brakelite said: Is the church today doing the same thing? Attempting to be "conformed into the image of the Son of God " without reference to the laws of love upon which the kingdom of God is founded? Haven't seen many doing that . None in the general public eye/ broadcasting/ are even close to conformed to the image of the Son of God, are they ? There are only a few who are conforming to Jesus' Life, whose members abide in Christ, His Way, including sacrificial agape love and obedient to His Word by faith in Jesus. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.11 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2018 Satan wanted to be like God but not for all of God's wonderful qualities....he wanted to be like God so he could be worshipped, IMO. You have to delineate here; satan didn't want to be like God except for that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brakelite Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 977 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 641 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/15/2011 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 4, 2018 3 hours ago, MorningGlory said: 4 hours ago, brakelite said: "Gracious, merciful, longsuffering, full of goodness and truth"...we know God to be a God of love, integrity, compassion, grace and mercy. So when we read that Lucifer wanted to be like the Most High, is there any reason to believe that Lucifer wanted to be evil, malicious, vindictive, wicked and selfish in the manner we know he turned out? Satan wanted to be like God but not for all of God's wonderful qualities....he wanted to be like God so he could be worshipped, IMO. You have to delineate here; satan didn't want to be like God except for that. When Lucifer began his rebellion, there must have been long politicking and a process by which he managed to convince the other angels as to the 'rightness' of his suggestions. He didn't come to them saying, "let us be evil". No, he must have been more subtle than that, and in the beginning (maybe even today in a warped twisted sort of way) he would have genuinely thought he could do a better job, just like any opposition party to the governing power, they believe they can do better. I know its difficult to comprehend that the devil could have at some stage in his ambitious career change, been even remotely altruistic and well meaning, but why not? Despite his obvious pride and self-exaltation, which could well have developed over a prolonged period of time, there is no reason to believe that his desire to replace Christ in the celestial order of things began with good intentions. However, cherishing his pride, and resisting what I am sure must have been some very serious pleadings by the faithful angels and God Himself, (as we know God is merciful and long-suffering) he would have distanced himself further and further away from those loving principles upon which the government was founded upon, and to which he was set up to protect. The church today rejects those same laws as having been "nailed to the cross" and are seeking glory without them. An impossibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brakelite Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 977 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 641 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/15/2011 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 4, 2018 Upon his appearance on earth, Satan, after possibly millenia developing a mindset that said "I can be like the Most High without being subject to the laws of the Most High", immediately continued on the campaign trail to bring as many as possible onto his side by suggesting to Eve, "you can be like God" without being subject to the law of the Most High, that law being "don't eat of this tree". (Many other laws were broken by Eve on that occasion though, not just that specific commandment). The church is following Eve's example, even to the point of believing that while in a state of disobedience, they shall not die. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brakelite Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 977 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 641 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/15/2011 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 4, 2018 7 hours ago, simplejeff said: Haven't seen many doing that . None in the general public eye/ broadcasting/ are even close to conformed to the image of the Son of God, are they ? There are only a few who are conforming to Jesus' Life, whose members abide in Christ, His Way, including sacrificial agape love and obedient to His Word by faith in Jesus. I fully agree that very few are 'conforming to the image of Christ', and being 'transformed by the renewing of their minds', but many are claiming to be by default in their pretensions to holiness and righteousness while not in obedience to His Word. Some extricate themselves from this seeming paradox through a false humility claiming that because they are so corrupt, they cannot possibly obey God's commandments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 25 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,605 Content Per Day: 3.97 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted March 4, 2018 8 hours ago, MorningGlory said: Satan wanted to be like God but not for all of God's wonderful qualities....he wanted to be like God so he could be worshipped, IMO. You have to delineate here; satan didn't want to be like God except for that. Exactly. We are in God's likeness, His Image. From the first cell of our person to the last thought, we have been given the characteristics of the Lord. IF you take sin and missing the mark from us, then we are truly in the image of God. However, while we do strive for the reinstatement to Eden (Yahweh's wonderful country) we cannot accomplish this. HaSatan, on the other hand does not want to be anything like Yahweh - he just wants His power, like the guy in acts that wanted Holy Spirit power to wield for his own selfish goals. Because we have God's characteristics, we have freedom of choice. We also have many other attributes that we rarely use or understand. As Yeshua said, if you have faith as big as a mustard seed, then you could move mountains... I feel I am often more concerned with my own salvation that my neighbor's. I have to really work hard at engaging the stranger and meeting those I do not know. But somebody told me recently: if you want God in your life, approach the ones He would welcome and become their friend. Embrace a stranger and by doing so, be a light in their darkness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted March 4, 2018 Share Posted March 4, 2018 5 hours ago, brakelite said: Upon his appearance on earth, Satan, after possibly millenia developing a mindset that said "I can be like the Most High without being subject to the laws of the Most High", immediately continued on the campaign trail to bring as many as possible onto his side by suggesting to Eve, "you can be like God" without being subject to the law of the Most High, that law being "don't eat of this tree". (Many other laws were broken by Eve on that occasion though, not just that specific commandment). The church is following Eve's example, even to the point of believing that while in a state of disobedience, they shall not die. Which is a subtle way of saying that Christians who don't keep "the law" (the Sabbath, the dietary laws) will go to Hell. Essentially, you are trying to push salvation by works. You are using all of the subtly of the "father of lies." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted March 4, 2018 Share Posted March 4, 2018 11 hours ago, brakelite said: We are told in Isaiah 14 :13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. We see here that Lucifer aka Satan aka great red dragon aka accuser of brethren...wanted to be like God. So what is God like? He didn't want to be like God in terms of God's character. Satan was full of pride and He decided He would usurp God's authority and sovereignty and that is why He was thrown out. He wanted God's place, not God's character. Quote Therefore Lucifer sought to "be like God" through selfish ambition and self-exaltation. He sought to be "like God" without reference to the laws of love upon which heaven is founded. Is the church today doing the same thing? Attempting to be "conformed into the image of the Son of God " without reference to the laws of love upon which the kingdom of God is founded? So as far as you are concerned, Christians who don't keep the Sabbath and eat pork are like Satan... Yep, more SDA false teaching and heresy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted March 4, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,157 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,444 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted March 4, 2018 It is not a difficult thing to understand the plight of satan... he wanted to be worshipped for something He himself did not possess on his own merit; he literally stole what God had given him to be used to heighten the understanding of the other angels and himself 'God's magnificent glory' and it is magnificent as all things created are of His Persons formed what a wonder Our God 'IS'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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