Mike 2 Posted March 7, 2018 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 499 Content Per Day: 0.19 Reputation: 277 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/06/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 7, 2018 10 hours ago, da_man1974 said: I wonder why the serpent was allowed in the garden. If everything was perfect before the fall, why was the serpent able to be there. Here's my thought: It wasn't perfect. A perfect relationship with God requires that we choose to have it. In order to have a choice there must be options, so God introduced an option. We always had and always will have a free will to choose, but if the option is not there we are not able to choose something else. Something to think about when we consider the devil being put away during the millennial reign (only to be released and offer an "option" again later) Something to think about when we consider the devil being destroyed.......we'll still have our free will after choosing to accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, but that temptation that we first see giving an "option" in the garden.....will not exist. It will have served its purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Mclees Posted March 7, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 158 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 1,915 Content Per Day: 0.80 Reputation: 910 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/15/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted March 7, 2018 (edited) 22 hours ago, wingnut- said: I think everyone gets so focused on the legs part, the rest is overlooked. Genesis 3:14 The Lord God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this, cursed are you above all livestock and above all beasts of the field; on your belly you shall go, and dust you shall eat all the days of your life. 15 I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel.” Could it be that the phrase on your belly you shall go is figurative, and not literal? For example, the expression, cut the legs out from under you. The reason I bring this to attention is the part I bolded and underlined. What snake eats dust? All the ones I know of eat insects, mice, or larger living things based on their size and capability. Verse 15 is interesting, enmity between the serpent and the woman. And in regards to her offspring, "He shall bruise your head." I don't believe this is meant literally. I also think it is important to note what else is said in scripture specifically in regards to satan. II Corinthians 11:14 And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. He has to disguise himself as an angel of light, which indicates that is not what his actual physical appearance is. God bless Just for the record Satan is a spiritual being capable of almost anything. He beguiles the whole world. He hates the church yet he can even work in our mist. He is the prince of this world and the master of all deception. If you could sit where Jesus sits where will He find His Bride. They will be purified in the refiners fire and will stand on a sea of fiery glass having the Harps of God. Rev 15 Edited March 7, 2018 by Mike Mclees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jostler Posted July 16, 2019 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 25 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,679 Content Per Day: 1.39 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 16 Joined: 01/19/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2019 satan could not have remained in the garden if Adam had not allowed it. He had been given the authority and the responsibility to "keep" the Garden. He chose not to exercise it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 596 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,098 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,834 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, Jostler said: satan could not have remained in the garden if Adam had not allowed it. He had been given the authority and the responsibility to "keep" the Garden. He chose not to exercise it. Satan was/is about the most perfect thing that the Lord created.... and Adam didn't even know good from evil (right from wrong) I don't think I would put too much on Adam.... he was really out classed at the time.... Actually teaching us a lesson about messing with the devil on our own.... if you don't have the Lord behind you just leave him alone.... if you do he will not be a problem..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Adams Posted July 16, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 25 Topic Count: 61 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 9,605 Content Per Day: 3.97 Reputation: 7,795 Days Won: 21 Joined: 09/11/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2019 He appeared AS a shining one, a disembodied spirit taking on the FORM of a serpent. Three attributes are here and Nachash is the form ha-Satan (the deceiver) took in this event. It is a complex issue and worth much study. Eden is described as the garden of God and also the mountain of God. It was His holy place. God gives ALL His created being freedom. Yes even bad spirits. There is much about God's holy ones and sons of God in the Tanach. Some of these Elohim were obedient and some were not. Some were given charge over the nations and fell down miserably on the job. But that is another story... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jostler Posted July 16, 2019 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 25 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,679 Content Per Day: 1.39 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 16 Joined: 01/19/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, other one said: Satan was/is about the most perfect thing that the Lord created.... and Adam didn't even know good from evil (right from wrong) I don't think I would put too much on Adam.... he was really out classed at the time.... Actually teaching us a lesson about messing with the devil on our own.... if you don't have the Lord behind you just leave him alone.... if you do he will not be a problem..... Adam failed in his responsibilities before he fell into sin. He'd been given a command to keep the Garden and that word is not the same as "dress" ("tend" in the translation below): Quote Gen 2:15 ¶ Then the LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it. I am confident that if God gave him a commandment to protect and defend the Garden He would have also let Adam know it needed defending from something. The command alone implies he at least had a heads up, however specific God was in identifying the threat. Instead he chose to stand by while his wife was deceived and instead of correcting the deception with the Word he'd been given, he WILLFULLY followed Eve into sin. There were several failures that led up to the fall...failing to faithfully wash his wife in the water of the Word is what led to her deception. Mankind did not fall until Adam ate. After that there was no remedy but blood....and pure blood at that, which neither Adam nor Eve now had. It's all right there in the account. ___________________________ shamar (keep in Hebrew) Outline of Biblical Usage [?] to keep, guard, observe, give heed (Qal) to keep, have charge of to keep, guard, keep watch and ward, protect, save life watch, watchman (participle) to watch for, wait for to watch, observe to keep, retain, treasure up (in memory) to keep (within bounds), restrain to observe, celebrate, keep (sabbath or covenant or commands), perform (vow) to keep, preserve, protect to keep, reserve (Niphal) to be on one's guard, take heed, take care, beware to keep oneself, refrain, abstain to be kept, be guarded (Piel) to keep, pay heed (Hithpael) to keep oneself from 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2019 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 596 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,098 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,834 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, Jostler said: Adam failed in his responsibilities before he fell into sin. He'd been given a command to keep the Garden and that word is not the same as "dress" ("tend" in the translation below): I am confident that if God gave him a commandment to protect and defend the Garden He would have also let Adam know it needed defending from something. The command alone implies he at least had a heads up, however specific God was in identifying the threat. Instead he chose to stand by while his wife was deceived and instead of correcting the deception with the Word he'd been given, he WILLFULLY followed Eve into sin. There were several failures that led up to the fall...failing to faithfully wash his wife in the water of the Word is what led to her deception. Mankind did not fall until Adam ate. After that there was no remedy but blood....and pure blood at that, which neither Adam nor Eve now had. It's all right there in the account. ___________________________ shamar (keep in Hebrew) Outline of Biblical Usage [?] to keep, guard, observe, give heed (Qal) to keep, have charge of to keep, guard, keep watch and ward, protect, save life watch, watchman (participle) to watch for, wait for to watch, observe to keep, retain, treasure up (in memory) to keep (within bounds), restrain to observe, celebrate, keep (sabbath or covenant or commands), perform (vow) to keep, preserve, protect to keep, reserve (Niphal) to be on one's guard, take heed, take care, beware to keep oneself, refrain, abstain to be kept, be guarded (Piel) to keep, pay heed (Hithpael) to keep oneself from you are adding much more to it that I can accept 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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