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The serpent


da_man1974

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10 hours ago, da_man1974 said:

I wonder why the serpent was allowed in the garden. If everything was perfect before the fall, why was the serpent able to be there.

Here's my thought:

It wasn't perfect.

A perfect relationship with God requires that we choose to have it.

In order to have a choice there must be options, so God introduced an option.

We always had and always will have a free will to choose, but if the option is not there we are not able to choose something else.

Something to think about when we consider the devil being put away during the millennial reign (only to be released and offer an "option" again later) 

Something to think about when we consider the devil being destroyed.......we'll still have our free will after choosing to accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, but that temptation that we first see giving an "option" in the garden.....will not exist. It will have served its purpose. 

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22 hours ago, wingnut- said:

 

I think everyone gets so focused on the legs part, the rest is overlooked.

 

Genesis 3:14 The Lord God said to the serpent,

“Because you have done this,
    cursed are you above all livestock
    and above all beasts of the field;
on your belly you shall go,
    and dust you shall eat
    all the days of your life
.
15 I will put enmity between you and the woman,
    and between your offspring and her offspring;
he shall bruise your head,
    and you shall bruise his heel.”

 

Could it be that the phrase on your belly you shall go is figurative, and not literal?  For example, the expression, cut the legs out from under you.  The reason I bring this to attention is the part I bolded and underlined.  What snake eats dust?  All the ones I know of eat insects, mice, or larger living things based on their size and capability.

Verse 15 is interesting, enmity between the serpent and the woman.  And in regards to her offspring, "He shall bruise your head."  I don't believe this is meant literally.  I also think it is important to note what else is said in scripture specifically in regards to satan.

 

II Corinthians 11:14  And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.

 

He has to disguise himself as an angel of light, which indicates that is not what his actual physical appearance is.  

God bless

 

 

Just for the record Satan is a spiritual being capable of almost anything. He beguiles the whole world. He hates the church yet he can even work in our mist. He is the prince of this world and the master of all deception. If you could sit where Jesus sits where will He find His Bride. They will be purified in the refiners fire and will stand on a sea of fiery glass having the Harps of God.  Rev 15

Edited by Mike Mclees
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satan could not  have remained in the  garden if Adam had not allowed it.  He had been given the authority and the responsibility  to "keep" the Garden.  He chose not to  exercise it.  

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7 minutes ago, Jostler said:

satan could not  have remained in the  garden if Adam had not allowed it.  He had been given the authority and the responsibility  to "keep" the Garden.  He chose not to  exercise it.  

Satan was/is about the most perfect thing that the Lord created....   and Adam didn't even know good from evil (right from wrong)    I don't think I would put too much on Adam....   he  was really out classed at the time....

Actually teaching us a lesson about messing with the devil on our own....   if you don't have the Lord behind you just leave him alone....   if you do he will not be a problem.....

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He appeared AS a shining one, a disembodied spirit taking on the FORM of a serpent. Three attributes are here and Nachash is the form ha-Satan (the deceiver) took in this event. It is a complex issue and worth much study. Eden is described as the garden of God and also the mountain of God. It was His holy place.

God gives ALL His created being freedom. Yes even bad spirits. There is much about God's holy ones and sons of God in the Tanach. Some of these Elohim were obedient and some were not. Some were given charge over the nations and fell down miserably on the job.

But that is another story...

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2 minutes ago, other one said:

Satan was/is about the most perfect thing that the Lord created....   and Adam didn't even know good from evil (right from wrong)    I don't think I would put too much on Adam....   he  was really out classed at the time....

Actually teaching us a lesson about messing with the devil on our own....   if you don't have the Lord behind you just leave him alone....   if you do he will not be a problem.....

 

Adam failed in his  responsibilities before he  fell into sin.  He'd been given a command to keep the Garden and that word is not the same as "dress" ("tend" in the translation below):

Quote
Then the LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it.

 

I  am confident that if God gave him a commandment to protect  and defend the  Garden He would have also  let Adam know it needed defending  from something.  The command alone implies he at least had a heads up, however specific God was in identifying the  threat.  Instead he chose to stand by while his wife was deceived and instead  of correcting the  deception with the Word he'd been given, he  WILLFULLY followed Eve into sin.

There were several failures that  led up to the fall...failing to faithfully  wash his wife in the water of the Word is  what led to her  deception.  Mankind did  not fall until Adam ate.  After that there was no remedy but blood....and pure  blood at that, which neither Adam nor Eve now had.  It's all right  there in the account.

___________________________

shamar  (keep in Hebrew)

Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. to keep, guard, observe, give heed

    1. (Qal)

      1. to keep, have charge of

      2. to keep, guard, keep watch and ward, protect, save life

        1. watch, watchman (participle)

      3. to watch for, wait for

      4. to watch, observe

      5. to keep, retain, treasure up (in memory)

      6. to keep (within bounds), restrain

      7. to observe, celebrate, keep (sabbath or covenant or commands), perform (vow)

      8. to keep, preserve, protect

      9. to keep, reserve

    2. (Niphal)

      1. to be on one's guard, take heed, take care, beware

      2. to keep oneself, refrain, abstain

      3. to be kept, be guarded

    3. (Piel) to keep, pay heed

    4. (Hithpael) to keep oneself from

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Jostler said:

 

Adam failed in his  responsibilities before he  fell into sin.  He'd been given a command to keep the Garden and that word is not the same as "dress" ("tend" in the translation below):

 

I  am confident that if God gave him a commandment to protect  and defend the  Garden He would have also  let Adam know it needed defending  from something.  The command alone implies he at least had a heads up, however specific God was in identifying the  threat.  Instead he chose to stand by while his wife was deceived and instead  of correcting the  deception with the Word he'd been given, he  WILLFULLY followed Eve into sin.

There were several failures that  led up to the fall...failing to faithfully  wash his wife in the water of the Word is  what led to her  deception.  Mankind did  not fall until Adam ate.  After that there was no remedy but blood....and pure  blood at that, which neither Adam nor Eve now had.  It's all right  there in the account.

___________________________

shamar  (keep in Hebrew)

Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. to keep, guard, observe, give heed

    1. (Qal)

      1. to keep, have charge of

      2. to keep, guard, keep watch and ward, protect, save life

        1. watch, watchman (participle)

      3. to watch for, wait for

      4. to watch, observe

      5. to keep, retain, treasure up (in memory)

      6. to keep (within bounds), restrain

      7. to observe, celebrate, keep (sabbath or covenant or commands), perform (vow)

      8. to keep, preserve, protect

      9. to keep, reserve

    2. (Niphal)

      1. to be on one's guard, take heed, take care, beware

      2. to keep oneself, refrain, abstain

      3. to be kept, be guarded

    3. (Piel) to keep, pay heed

    4. (Hithpael) to keep oneself from

 

 

 

you are adding much more to it that I can accept

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