Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
n2thelight

Last Trump vs The Seventh

Recommended Posts

15 hours ago, seeking the lost said:

The thousand year reign of Christ is characterized as a thousand years of peace. 

No, there will eventually be peace but not in the beginning. It will take time for His kingdom to spread and His influence to affect every city in every nation.


Isaiah 9:7  There will be no end to the increase of His government
or of peace

In other words Christ government and peace will increase until it penetrates every institution.

Isaiah 2:4
And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people

Ps 2:9; 72:9-11

2:9 You will break them with an iron scepter; you will smash them like a potter’s jar!’” 72:9 Before him the coastlands will bow down,and his enemies will lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and the coastlands will offer gifts;the kings of Sheba and Seba will bring tribute.11 All kings will bow down to him;all nations will serve him.

Isaiah 11:4

11:4 He will treat the poor fairly, and make right decisions for the downtrodden of the earth. He will strike the earth with the rod of his mouth, and order the wicked to be executed.


Zechariah 14:17

And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain

Rev 2:27

And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father

All this ties up with Christ very words in Luke 19:11-27 of the returning king, rewarding his servants and shattering his enemies in order to usher peace, it is a process to yield humanity to its knees to worship Christ.
 

If the tribulation ended at the seventh trumpet and there were a resurrection there then it could be that the seventh trumpet is the last in a series of seven trumpets

I don't see any other series of 7 trumpets in Revelation, that John and Paul would of refered to?

The first resurrection is at the beginning of the thousand years not somewhere in the last third of the tribulation. 


In order to bring the resurrection to the seventh trumpet as you suggest it will be necessary to move the time of this resurrection from the end of the tribulation to the midst of the tribulation

Rev 11 makes no mention of a midst/ middle of the tribulation

  You do understand that a proclamation is different than the actual event.  Revelation 11:18 is a proclamation of what is to take place.

Rev 11:18 is a fulfilment of proclamations.

Rev 10:7

But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets

Citing John 1:29 won't really strengthen your position:  who takes away the sin of the world.

"Takes away" is a Present Participle; Christ from that time of John's utterance all the way through to Christ crucifixion, Christ being in action of taking away the sins of the world.

In other words taking away the sins of the world was a process that eventually climaxed at the crucifixion

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/16/2018 at 7:45 AM, inchrist said:

No, there will eventually be peace but not in the beginning. It will take time for His kingdom to spread and His influence to affect every city in every nation.


Isaiah 9:7  There will be no end to the increase of His government
or of peace

In other words Christ government and peace will increase until it penetrates every institution.

Isaiah 2:4
And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people

Ps 2:9; 72:9-11

2:9 You will break them with an iron scepter; you will smash them like a potter’s jar!’” 72:9 Before him the coastlands will bow down,and his enemies will lick the dust. 10 The kings of Tarshish and the coastlands will offer gifts;the kings of Sheba and Seba will bring tribute.11 All kings will bow down to him;all nations will serve him.

Isaiah 11:4

11:4 He will treat the poor fairly, and make right decisions for the downtrodden of the earth. He will strike the earth with the rod of his mouth, and order the wicked to be executed.


Zechariah 14:17

And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain

Rev 2:27

And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father

All this ties up with Christ very words in Luke 19:11-27 of the returning king, rewarding his servants and shattering his enemies in order to usher peace, it is a process to yield humanity to its knees to worship Christ.
 

 

 

I don't see any other series of 7 trumpets in Revelation, that John and Paul would of refered to?

 

 

Rev 11 makes no mention of a midst/ middle of the tribulation

 

 

Rev 11:18 is a fulfilment of proclamations.

Rev 10:7

But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets

Citing John 1:29 won't really strengthen your position:  who takes away the sin of the world.

"Takes away" is a Present Participle; Christ from that time of John's utterance all the way through to Christ crucifixion, Christ being in action of taking away the sins of the world.

In other words taking away the sins of the world was a process that eventually climaxed at the crucifixion

 

Greetings inchrist;

As I read the account of the first resurrection I see some words that you might consider.

The Thousand Years

20 And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. 2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. 3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God.They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

Notice that before the first resurrection Satan is bound.  The order is Satan is bound then those who have been beheaded will be raised.

The last trumpet is not just that it is the last in a series such as the seventh of a series of seven but the very last trumpet of all human existence as we know it.   I acknowledge that there is not a trumpet listed for the first resurrection or the one to follow at the end of the thousand years.  The time and the inclusion of the resurrections are fixed and non movable.  Last is that there will be no more trumpets after not that there were six before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/15/2018 at 3:15 AM, n2thelight said:

Paul says we gather to Christ at the last trump,how can the 7th of Rev,not be the last?

In the temple days, there is a "last trump" and it's blown on 1 Tishri. 4 different tones and the last one is called Takia HaGadol (the great trumpet). That is the last trump Paul is talking about. Here's the link to one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jR20-0sy1Y

youtube.com/watch?v=0jR20-0sy1Y

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again, the last trumpet is the 8th trumpet blown for Israel after the end of the tribulation period .... all of the 7 judgment trumpets will be blown before the 8th trumpet is blown

This trumpet will be for Israel .... 1/3 of all Israelite believers who will inhabit the Lord's millennial kingdom as mortals [Zechariah 13:8-9; Matthew 24:29-31]

All who disagree with this setting are wrong .... most of these are the post tribulation proponents on this website

Post tribulation thinking is in error and held by many .... most of them are also false teachers who are purposely projecting falsehood 

Edited by Daniel 11:36

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Daniel 11:36 said:

Again, the last trumpet is the 8th trumpet blown for Israel after the end of the tribulation period .... all of the 7 judgment trumpets will be blown before the 8th trumpet is blown

This trumpet will be for Israel .... 1/3 of all Israelite believers who will inhabit the Lord's millennial kingdom as mortals [Zechariah 13:8-9; Matthew 24:29-31]

All who disagree with this setting are wrong .... most of these are the post tribulation proponents on this website

Post tribulation thinking is in error and held by many .... most of them are also false teachers who are purposely projecting falsehood 

Hi Daniel 11:36.....

"Again, the last trumpet is the 8th trumpet blown for Israel after the end of the tribulation period .... all of the 7 judgment trumpets will be blown before the 8th trumpet is blown......."

Where in scripture is this 8th trumpet you refer to?.....

I would like to read that scripture.

And no......No, I'm not a "post tribulationist"................ I agree with you that post-trib thinking is in error

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 18/05/2018 at 3:38 PM, seeking the lost said:

Greetings inchrist;

As I read the account of the first resurrection I see some words that you might consider.

The Thousand Years

20 And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. 2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. 3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God.They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.6 Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

Notice that before the first resurrection Satan is bound.  The order is Satan is bound then those who have been beheaded will be raised.

 

Whixh all fits at the 7th trumpet and than Daniel 7 also goes on to state:

Daniel 7:25 "And he shall speak [great] words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time."

Daniel 7:26 "But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy [it] unto the end."

The judgment is taken away from the Antichrist  by Christ, and by His saints - Rev 20:4  He I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge . Which is what the entire point of the 7 bowls of wrath are all about

The antichrist has been judged, and found guilty. God will remove the Antichrist’s rule and destroy him and his empire in hell.

Quote

 The last trumpet is not just that it is the last in a series such as the seventh of a series of seven but the very last trumpet of all human existence as we know it. 

Where does it state that in the bible?

 

Are we to honestly believe that Paul's last trumpet 1 Corinthians 15:52 who by the way was schooled in the Jewish Torah, it was his profession, who was an export, in fact on the same level as Daniel had no concept of the Gods ordained symbolism of Jewish feasts association with trumpets being 7 series trumpets and not anointed by God as  a prophet associated to the 7 trumpets of Revelation?

But in the days when the seventh angel is about to sound his trumpet, the mystery of God will be accomplished, just as he announced to his servants the prophets.”

you have got to come up with some water tight evidence that Paul was not a prophet that God associated with in Rev 10 and we have two completely different last trumpets, one of those last trumpets being in your case completely missing from the picture all together....

Edited by inchrist

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

×