Discovering the Second Half of the Gospel

[angels4u]

37 minutes ago, Gideon said:

Thank you for your kind reply. The last thing I want are wars with people here, even if we disagree. When I get a post like this one  from someone who has withstood my posts a bit, it sets the stage for fellowship to grow, so I really appreciate it. 

As to witnessing to drug addicts, there was a reason for my inquiry.  let me share a bit of my story.  

Between my wife and I, we have six children, eleven grandchildren and five great grandchildren. I am 68, almost 69, my wife is 65. My kids have pretty much avoided the drug scene, but Terry’s two younger daughters have not. Both got involved with opiates first, and then shooting up heroin or morphine. 

Both walked with the Lord at one time, and both have repeatedly tried to get back to the Lord and to get off the drugs. We have witnessed to them, prayed with them, brought them in for detoxing, taken them to church, but they still struggled.... and failed. Both of their husbands were addicted as well. Again, both of them had once walked close to God, and Kevin told me the happiest he had ever been when he was serving the Lord.

We adopted Jack when he was three, and who now 8 because Amanda and Jeremy simply did not want to raise him. Two weeks before the adoption went through, we got a call early one Saturday morning that Jeremy had died of an overdose during the night. 

We were devastated, and Jack lost his dad. But at the funeral, one of his close friends who was a Christian, came up to us and told us that he had run into Jeremy about nine that night he OD’ed and Jeremy asked for him to pray for him  because he said he had never been as bad off as he was doing at that time. My hope and prayer is that he was saved. 

Then, two years ago, another late night all. Terry’s middle daughter, Laurie, had died of an overdose  and it absolutely crushed Terry. Laurie was 35 and had a six year old son. Not finished yet. Laurie also has an older son, Alex who had a boy with his girlfriend. More drugs, but not as bad. Still, they were ill prepared to be parents, emotionally, financially, or spiritually, so early last year, we adopted Gavin, who is now 22 months old. If my calculations are correct, I will be 85 when he graduates high school. LOL. Last year, Terry was diagnosed with stage four cancer in both lungs (never smoked) and one kidney. And yet in all this, God has blessed us beyond measure. I would change nothing. 

I brought all that up to say this. I have witnessed first hand the power of addictive drugs. I was a sex and porn addict for four plus decades, 38 of those years as a Christian. But addictive sins like drugs are a different breed, sins on steroids, so to speak. Shooting up drugs are an especially formidable stronghold unlike any  others.

And for every one soul that gets freed from satan’s clutches, I bet there are 100 or more sincere people, and here I am being conservative, who once walked with God, who cannot get back, no matter how hard they try. They can go to rehab, even Christian rehab, they can be prayed for, they can read their Bibles, they can never miss a service at church and in the end, they simply are too bound to escape. I have witnessed it again and again. 

And why is this? They are trying like we do to change our behavior without changing our nature. And so, when Satan comes accusing, or tempting, with no shield of faith to protect them, they need only one slip to slide all the way back to the bottom. 

I believe there is enough power in the salvation of our Lord to set any man or woman free, totally and completely...... including those that are the worst bound.  And what  I am sharing is the answer they need. Until they break identity with themselves as addicts, they cannot walk free. That is why I share as I do. What God offers each of us is real, and it works. But up till now, many think they are just fine and have need of nothing. 

I am a carpenter and landscaper by trade and although I have had a call to minister since I was about 36, there never was a “right time”. Bills had to be paid, kids had to be cared for,  (and still do, lol) and life got in the way. So here I am now in this  situation I find myself, with my quiver tearing at the seams, and about three weeks ago,God finally tells me  “It’s time”. Don’t tell me our God does not have a sense of humor. LOL.

  As you have witnessed here, I do not think at present people are going to be beating down my door to have me come and share. They may be beating down my door with tar boiling and the sqwauk of chickens, but not to share. So what will I do? The Lord actually told me today. I have a neat little wood shop up on a slight hill along a somewhat busy road. I am having signs made up advertising a new weekly Bible study  for addicts and others struggling with sin. On Sundays, my road is jammed around  12:30 with cars coming back from church so as the Lord blesses, and leads, I hope to awaken those who know they need more than a nice church service where they feel God’s presence. They need to take His presence with them... in them.

You are actually the first person I have told. We shall see as to the results. I am believing for miracles. The proof is in the pudding, amen? I would appreciate prayers from any so led. My ministry is not to hack people off, LOL, despite what many here may think. I simply want us to again see a Christian walk where the devil retreats, and not where we have to make excuses for why the promises are not working. I want to see the hungry come and walk away with victory.

The lost  need what we have been given, but if it is not working for us for our small sins, tied with soft velvet restraints to our ankles,  but restraints none the less, what hope can we give those with balls and chains of iron bolted tight around their ankles? My simple prayer is that we see God ‘s willingness to do for us what we cannot do, ‘cause us’ to walk as overcomers, and beseech Him to do it for us, Lord! Is this scriptural? You be the judge:

Thus saith the Lord God; I will yet for this be enquired of by the house of Israel, to do it for them; I will increase them with men like a flock.
                                                                   Ezekiel 36:37

Blessings to you. 

Gids

Amen to all you said and I'm very sorry to hear about all the addictions in your family,as a parent (I've learned this in my Christian life) we have to pray for our children for them to get serious with God, I've been there and I'm still waiting for God to answer prayers. God promised that if we raise our children in the Lord, they will return to Him. I have seen that already happen with 1 of our children and I'm praying for all of them to get close to God, I know the Holy Spirit will soften their heart and bring them back to Him. But they also have a free will and I pray that God will blind them with the truth as He did to Peter on his way to Damaskus. I have learned to pray and to wait for God to answer as I not worry about it anymore,He knows my heart and how much we love our chlidren and He knows how much I would like to spend eternity with them.I completely trust in Him.

I believe very much that as a Christian we have to be very discerned of the days we live in as they are so evil,our job is to be the light of the lost ,all I desire is that when I'm gone someday, people will remember how much I love the Lord and that He's always nr 1 in my life. I'm not ashamed of Jesus who saved me for eternity  My life of worrying is over as I completely trust in Him for all things to happen.

If a person really loves the Lord, they do not want to sin but strive to do the will of God and if they sin, we confess our sins and God will forgive us. I'm running the race until the end

I believe that by awakening you mean that people's eyes will opened for the truth someday? In that I do believe too ,but it will not before the end of the Tribulation that  all people really can see who Jesus really is,that is when He comes back to earth.

I love Jesus deeply and I desire to do His will , I live by every word what is in the Bible,He is my everything.

I admire for all you're doing for your family,they have a great Dad and Grandfather, I did understand that God had set you free from your addictions! Amen,what a great God we serve. 

The only thing is do not really understand is when you talked about your visitation from God, are you sure is was God? I know a person who is very dear to me who had a visitation also and it was a call to accept Jesus in his heart,it was not God who got his attention but the enemy ,he got so scared that he had no other option than to turn to God,he felt is was the last change God would give him. He became a Christian but it was not God who he experienced but God had let it happen to get His attention.

Did you ever read the books from Niel Anderson?

 

[Gideon]

46 minutes ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

I did not say YOU.    Even when its identified , they always come and cover tracks .   People always plant ideals IF they have an agenda .  then when its questoined

they always try and cover up .    Staying alive worries me .   I seen several of his repsonses and it sounds like man wise wisdom on some things .

I aint said anything about you.    When anyone , and I don't care how well meaning they are and how much truth they can say,

WHEN they come saying things that don't add up with WHAT JESUS said about the end or nigh the end ,  that worries me .

Not saying you.    But you have to KNOW by now this is how many take captive souls , they come on preaching a good message they know the audience

they desire to reach will relate too.   THEN they just keep throwing in things little by little .    You don't know me ,   nor I you , I don't know staying alive ,  But that is some scary

stuff he has said .  and not just their .   Now something is off .  maybe you cant see it in him .  But something is OFF brother .   I don't say this to be mean

BUT its my duty or anyones to expose error .    You just ponder on that for a bit .    

Brother, you are in denial of the facts. Several times over the past month or so, you have warned others about me and in essence called me a false teacher. I could quote you if you like but you know it to be true as do I. 

You may be walking in correct doctrine, but not in love. You can  make excuses for it, or avoid it, or admit it. It is is your choice. You may have zeal but God does not need enforcers. He needs us to walk like Jesus.

blessings, 

Gideon

[Not me]

11 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

Doesn't matter.  It is the same thing as in I JOhn 3:4-10.   It is not saying that those who are born again don't commit a single sin.  It is still carries the connotation in the Greek of not sinning habitually.   So the point still stands.   The Bible NEVER assumes that we will never sin again after we are born again.  The expectation is that we will commit sins after we are saved.   That is why Jesus continues to pray for us and why He continues to plead our case as our advocate before the Father.  

Any Christian who thinks they don't sin occasionally after they have been saved, is only lying to themselves.

I hope you had a great day and all things went well for you.

The two scriptures in question; 1 John 3: 3-10 and 1 John 5:18 are talking about different subjects, 1 John  3: 3:10 is, like you said, is talking about someone who sometimes “practices sins”. While 1 john 5:18 is talking about that part of the believer which is “born of God”, in the words “he that is born of God sins not”. One is talking about the “believer himself” the other about the “new life that is in the believer”. It is very possible for a person who has the new creation birthed in them to sin. But it’s not the new creation that sins. It is the believer himself that yields himself to the nature that sins. We see in; 

Romans 6:16 (KJV)
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

The believer is never asked to overcome sin. Only to yield himself to one master or the other. One, the New Creation (or Christ in the believer) which sins not. For it cannot,  for it is controlled by the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus and cannot sin. Or the believer can yield himself to the old creation (fallen nature) which is controlled by the Law of Sin and Death, and sin. It is quite common for a believer to vacillate between the two natures, but it is not the New Nature that sins, it is the believer that yields to the fallen nature whereby producing sin(s). What is being brought forth by the teaching “reckon yourself dead onto sin but alive unto God” is how a believer can “always” yield to the New Creation and never to the old. And it is simply to take God at his word, when He said “when Christ died you died”. This is the only way to have a continuing victroy over the fallen nature.  

But I might add; 

If you think that all God has for you is a life that is being controlled by the “old creation”. You will be happy to hear God has much more for you. He has a victorious life ready for you. Full on victory over the fallen  nature. Which will produce such a peace and joy in your heart, you won’t be able to stop smiling. It is the “how” of appropriating this victorious life that is being explained. But like all Spiritual truths at has to be seen inwardly. No man can make a person see this truth. But like the lady from Lydia God must do the opening. 

Acts 16:14 (NKJV)
Now a certain woman named Lydia heard [us]. She was a seller of purple from the city of Thyatira, who worshiped God. The Lord opened her heart to heed the things spoken by Paul.

So a person needs to pray and search for God to open their heart(s). But a believer can desire it, and desire he must, or it  will never be opened to him. For God will only be found, by those that “search for him with all their hearts.” But first a believer must be convinced that the truth itself exists. I testify that it does exist. 

Much love in Christ, Not me 

Edited May 4, 2018 by Not me

[frienduff thaylorde]

1 hour ago, Gideon said:

Brother, you are in denial of the facts. Several times over the past month or so, you have warned others about me and in essence called me a false teacher. I could quote you if you like but you know it to be true as do I. 

You may be walking in correct doctrine, but not in love. You can  make excuses for it, or avoid it, or admit it. It is is your choice. You may have zeal but God does not need enforcers. He needs us to walk like Jesus.

blessings, 

Gideon

Gideon this approach can cut the legs off one who is trying to ensure sound doctrine only and correct pattern only is taught .  If you cant expose me as false

then stop trying to say other things like I don't know love or etc.   Gideon , whether we like or it not ,  either expose my falsehoods by my doctrine .

Or cease .    This must be examined day by day till our last and final breath .   Meaning when the heat gets turned up ,  if we speaking nothing but truth ,

the heat runs none off.   I am far used to this .    Buckle up ,  I have no problems with my doctrine getting tested and fought against

nor should you .   The term dogmatic is way overused .    Its a way to try and sway the direction if we cant prove the one wrong .   I have no  problems

with any one challenging anything I do or say .   Prove them wrong through doctrine .    not through how one thinks their approach ought to be .

Wait,  you already said you don't see me as false .     Well,  then at least understand this ,  if I trust not even in me,  but ONLY GOD

you better know I am going to keep on both testing and watching anyone who brings any concept .   Now you came after me , WHICH is fine ,

but your pard staying alive is wee bit off , wouldn't you say .    TRY exposing him a lil now .    MY POINT on that was ,  WE seen error in that one

yet I did not see you say a word to him,   but man  you came after me and tried to exose me as having no love .    SEE the point yet .

Being grave ,  is not nearly as bad as being OFF .    You just ponder on that a bit .   

[FinallyAlive]

1 hour ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Gideon this approach can cut the legs off one who is trying to ensure sound doctrine only and correct pattern only is taught .  If you cant expose me as false

then stop trying to say other things like I don't know love or etc.   Gideon , whether we like or it not ,  either expose my falsehoods by my doctrine .

Or cease .    This must be examined day by day till our last and final breath .   Meaning when the heat gets turned up ,  if we speaking nothing but truth ,

the heat runs none off.   I am far used to this .    Buckle up ,  I have no problems with my doctrine getting tested and fought against

nor should you .   The term dogmatic is way overused .    Its a way to try and sway the direction if we cant prove the one wrong .   I have no  problems

with any one challenging anything I do or say .   Prove them wrong through doctrine .    not through how one thinks their approach ought to be .

Wait,  you already said you don't see me as false .     Well,  then at least understand this ,  if I trust not even in me,  but ONLY GOD

you better know I am going to keep on both testing and watching anyone who brings any concept .   Now you came after me , WHICH is fine ,

but your pard staying alive is wee bit off , wouldn't you say .    TRY exposing him a lil now .    MY POINT on that was ,  WE seen error in that one

yet I did not see you say a word to him,   but man  you came after me and tried to exose me as having no love .    SEE the point yet .

Being grave ,  is not nearly as bad as being OFF .    You just ponder on that a bit .   

Hey frienduff... is there a possibility you’re confusing Staying Alive with me?

I’m the one who is buddies with Gideon. I don’t post too often, but I do try to read these threads, even when sometimes they are a little more heated than I would like.

I know that if our hearts are in the right place, we truly seek to please our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ... we want that in our own lives as well as ALL the brothers and sisters that are true believers.

1 Thessalonians 5. It’s a great chapter. It walks the full gamut of relative discussion to this and most threads on the forum. From admonishion of those who are in need, to loving and building up and encouraging each other, to not scoffing at prophecy, but testing all things.

I think that there are a few on these forums who have been a little more anxious to find fault in others than to encourage, love and uplift those in need.

We are all on the same team, though most of us probably were brought up in different denominations. But if you strip away all of the differences between those denominations, what are we left with? We all share in the Word of God. The words in the Bible. The Truth. Our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, who died for our sins and was resurrected for our benefit. So that we who believe and trust in Him fully are no longer bound to death, no longer slaves to sins, but blessed with His Holy Spirit, able to walk free, having been born again, finally truly alive. Total victory. What an awesome, amazing glorious gift we have been given.

[Blood Bought 1953]

16 hours ago, Gideon said:

Would you please explain to me God’s words to the Laodecians in light of what your understanding is of our perfection? Thanks. 

Gids

 

I am familiar with the problems of the Laodecians.......please elaborate as to what you are getting at.Thank you.

[Gideon]

4 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Gideon this approach can cut the legs off one who is trying to ensure sound doctrine only and correct pattern only is taught .  If you cant expose me as false

then stop trying to say other things like I don't know love or etc.   Gideon , whether we like or it not ,  either expose my falsehoods by my doctrine .

Or cease .    This must be examined day by day till our last and final breath .   Meaning when the heat gets turned up ,  if we speaking nothing but truth ,

the heat runs none off.   I am far used to this .    Buckle up ,  I have no problems with my doctrine getting tested and fought against

nor should you .   The term dogmatic is way overused .    Its a way to try and sway the direction if we cant prove the one wrong .   I have no  problems

with any one challenging anything I do or say .   Prove them wrong through doctrine .    not through how one thinks their approach ought to be .

Wait,  you already said you don't see me as false .     Well,  then at least understand this ,  if I trust not even in me,  but ONLY GOD

you better know I am going to keep on both testing and watching anyone who brings any concept .   Now you came after me , WHICH is fine ,

but your pard staying alive is wee bit off , wouldn't you say .    TRY exposing him a lil now .    MY POINT on that was ,  WE seen error in that one

yet I did not see you say a word to him,   but man  you came after me and tried to exose me as having no love .    SEE the point yet .

Being grave ,  is not nearly as bad as being OFF .    You just ponder on that a bit .   

Brother, I think as was pointed out to you above, you are confusing two different people. If you see it as your duty to correct every single issue that you do not think meets your standard of doctrinal correctness, go for it. I have no issue with that. 

What I do take issue with is that instead of thinking the best and giving the benefit of the doubt, which is what love does, until proven otherwise, you start making accusations. They may be true, but in this particular case, they are false. Even after I clarified that I did not know him and he was not my “pard”, you simply assumed I was lying and proceeded on again. 

Walking with the Lord is more than correct doctrine. The Pharisees were sticklers for correct doctrine, but Jesus told them they were overlooking the more important parts of the law. Mercy was one of them. 

Gids 

[Gideon]

2 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

I am familiar with the problems of the Laodecians.......please elaborate as to what you are getting at.Thank you.

The Laodecians were His children, but they were off..... way off. You seem to believe as some do that God sees us through His “ Jesus spectacles” as perfect, no matter how we are actually living. As evidenced by the Lord’s comment that they made Him sick and if they did not repent, He was going to spew them out of His mouth, that assumption is not true. He especially did not like their contentment to have reached a certain place, then planted their feet and decided they needed nothing else. 

Blessings, 

Gideon

[Not me]

I read this on another forum and thought it was very well done so I thought I cut and paste it here;

”Very true. I learned all this years ago reading Watchman Nee's book "The Normal Christian Life" It's really about how the Lord wants us to see ourselves identified with him. What happened when Jesus went to the cross? Well many things are said to have happened. Jesus was our substitute for sin and his precious blood blotted out our sins BUT not only that....when Christ died we died...that is our old man died. 

The old man isn't dying....he's dead and our spirits were raised with Christ with eternal life now in on the inside. We're new creatures now created in Christ Jesus with the life of God within. Thanking God for that daily actually releases the power of God to cause us to walk free from sin. Some wonder are we free from sin or not ? I'd put it this way in a question. 

Is an airplane FREE from the law of gravity if it's putting into motion the law of lift and thrust etc? Yes, every time and all the time. God doesn't tell us to just don't walk after the flesh. He tells us to walk in the Spirit and you won't fulfill the lusts of the flesh. Just like the airplane. 

As long as it's using the principle of flight it walks free from gravity. As we utilize the walking in the Spirit with the power and life of God we've cancelled out the flesh but of course only as long as we do and only as long as we walk by faith. It's of course a daily thing BUT if we fail Jesus will forgive us and cleanse us and we get a fresh new page to walk it out again.”

Hat tip to “Bobber” who wrote it. Well said my brother in Christ. 

Much love in Christ, Not me

Edited May 4, 2018 by Not me

[brakelite]

Regarding the 'falling away' and the 'awakening' spoken of previously in this thread.We are all familiar with the parable of the wheat and the tares. The gardeners wanted to tear out the tares straight away, but the owner said no, wait until the harvest. Why? Because the fruit would be more discernible, and therefore identification certain. In the church today we are witnessing a widening chasm between the wheat and the tares, in a church now being prepared by the Bridegroom for His appearing. This gap is being brought about by God Himself. It isn't about doctrinal accuracy. It isn't about church or denominational affiliation.

It's about character. It's about the difference between those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, and are thus filled, and those who like the Laodiceans are content with their nakedness. It's about the difference between those who have accepted the wedding garment granted as a gift by faith, and those who devise their own fashions and set their own standards. It's about the difference between those who like their Master, loathe sin in all its insidious and odious forms, would rather die and burn than compromise, and those who refuse to call sin by its right name, and reduce Christ and His sacrifice at Calvary to a convenient sacrificial lamb grazing in the back paddock to be brought out only on occasions of selfish need. 

As I said, that gap is widening. There are many who today profess faith in Christ, but through love of the world and selfish pleasure are falling further and further away from HIm. These ones do not like to be reminded that God requires, expects, a return on His investment. They have many great gifts and means by which they could accomplish wonderful things on behalf of the gospel, but they have chosen to use these gifts/talents for themselves. They are lovers of themselves rather than lovers of God. And when this fault is revealed, they think it refers to others, not themselves. To them is Jesus's admonishment given, "buy of Me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see." Revelation 3:18. When someone comes along with a little fire in their belly, exalting righteousness and upholding holiness, such a message is an offense to them. They would rather put out that fire, and have that person ejected from their company. 

There are others however who welcome such a one in their midst. Who welcome his message, and see only good coming from it, if heeded. These ones seek only to grow nearer to their Savior. They understand that even in their own hearts, may lie depths of depravity yet to be exposed and dealt with. They welcome the encouragement that the word of God gives, reminding them that there is a power from above, and a God who loves them, which if they believe, will bring them freedom and hope. They long to be in that position where the promise of Romans 8:1 becomes an experiential reality, where they cleave to the promise of 2 Peter 1 and are willing and eager to partake of and take every advantage of the divine nature that guarantees an abundant life filled with the glorious fruits of righteousness which inform all of which side they are on.