Jump to content
IGNORED

Is wearing jewellery with the cross or crucifix a form of idolatry?


Recommended Posts


  • Group:  Worthy Ministers
  • Followers:  18
  • Topic Count:  940
  • Topics Per Day:  0.35
  • Content Count:  13,412
  • Content Per Day:  5.02
  • Reputation:   8,957
  • Days Won:  6
  • Joined:  12/04/2016
  • Status:  Offline
  • Birthday:  03/03/1885

29 minutes ago, Paradigm said:

I think my questions shine the light on the answer.

Ah, I don't think so.

  • Well Said! 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Advanced Member
  • Followers:  5
  • Topic Count:  1
  • Topics Per Day:  0.00
  • Content Count:  142
  • Content Per Day:  0.05
  • Reputation:   165
  • Days Won:  0
  • Joined:  03/26/2016
  • Status:  Offline

2 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

Ah don't think so. Seems to me to be more like a work of the ministers of distraction; guides straining at gnats.

It is a most tortured simile, so tortured as to be unrecognizable, but that is just my opinion and response to the "question" as posed.

It seems that you have chosen to respond ad hominem rather than substantively address my comments. You have not explained how my examples are erroneous. I don't think that I am likely to get a thoughtful and objective answer. I suspect the future responses will continue to avoid making  logical arguments or quoting scriptures on the topic of images or idols. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Royal Member
  • Followers:  44
  • Topic Count:  229
  • Topics Per Day:  0.06
  • Content Count:  10,900
  • Content Per Day:  2.95
  • Reputation:   12,145
  • Days Won:  68
  • Joined:  02/13/2014
  • Status:  Offline
  • Birthday:  08/14/1954

36 minutes ago, Paradigm said:

I think my questions shine the light on the answer. Can any reasonable argument be made that my scenario of wearing a gun or singing about them would be wrong  while at the same time justifying current practices related to the cross?

okie :rolleyes: dokie 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Royal Member
  • Followers:  16
  • Topic Count:  104
  • Topics Per Day:  0.04
  • Content Count:  3,776
  • Content Per Day:  1.29
  • Reputation:   4,746
  • Days Won:  2
  • Joined:  03/31/2016
  • Status:  Offline

1 hour ago, Paradigm said:

I have often wondered how things may have unfolded if Messiah lived, died and was resurrected in our current time. 

If it turned out that he was executed in a different way such as a gun for example, would people wear gun symbols around their necks? Would they sings songs in their places of worship such as "How I love that old gun?" 

Would must every church have a gun symbol in a prominent place in their sanctuary? 

A few years ago the fad WWJD was everywhere. What if we were to ask ourselves questions such as what would Peter, John or Paul do? That could be a good starting point.

For example, would those guys be wearing crosses? What holidays would they be celebrating? What would be their rest day?

These questions can actually be answered pretty easily. Most people are more attached to their inherited customs and invested in their current cultural thinking than they are truly interested in truly finding out WWJD. For when we consider what he and his followers celebrated, ate, etc. most of what he would observe today would be unrecognizable? Not necessarily unrecognizable to the pagans though. Food for thought....

You are comparing apples and oranges.  There's SO much more to the cross than a death.

The cross was simply and only an instrument of political and criminal execution.  Guns have a variety of purposes.

The Bible gives the cross of Christ much symbolic representation to the point of glory.  Guns are merely a tool.

Here's some of what the Bible says about the cross of Christ.

  •  Luke 9:23 - "And he said to all, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow Me."  Jesus would not say, "Take up your gun, your knife, your sword, your baseball bat and follow Me."
  •  Luke 14:27 - "Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple."
  • 1 Corinthians 1:17 - "For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power."  Symbolically speaking, the cross of Christ is has power - so says Paul.
  •  Galatians 6:12 - "It is those who want to make a good showing in the flesh who would force you to be circumcised, and only in order that they may not be persecuted for the cross of Christ.
  • Galatians 6:14 - "But far be it from me to boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world."
  • Ephesians 2:16 - "...and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.

The Bible teaches that the cross has much symbolism.  Glory, personal death to self, power of Christ to save, and more.

If the Bible teaches that, then there is nothing wrong with wearing a cross as a symbol of one's faith and devotion to God.

A gun has none of that.  So yes, I DO love the "old rugged cross".

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Advanced Member
  • Followers:  5
  • Topic Count:  1
  • Topics Per Day:  0.00
  • Content Count:  142
  • Content Per Day:  0.05
  • Reputation:   165
  • Days Won:  0
  • Joined:  03/26/2016
  • Status:  Offline

22 hours ago, Jayne said:

You are comparing apples and oranges.  There's SO much more to the cross than a death.

The cross was simply and only an instrument of political and criminal execution.  Guns have a variety of purposes.

The Bible gives the cross of Christ much symbolic representation to the point of glory.  Guns are merely a tool.

Here's some of what the Bible says about the cross of Christ.

  •  Luke 9:23 - "And he said to all, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow Me."  Jesus would not say, "Take up your gun, your knife, your sword, your baseball bat and follow Me."
  •  Luke 14:27 - "Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple."
  • 1 Corinthians 1:17 - "For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power."  Symbolically speaking, the cross of Christ is has power - so says Paul.
  •  Galatians 6:12 - "It is those who want to make a good showing in the flesh who would force you to be circumcised, and only in order that they may not be persecuted for the cross of Christ.
  • Galatians 6:14 - "But far be it from me to boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world."
  • Ephesians 2:16 - "...and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.

The Bible teaches that the cross has much symbolism.  Glory, personal death to self, power of Christ to save, and more.

If the Bible teaches that, then there is nothing wrong with wearing a cross as a symbol of one's faith and devotion to God.

A gun has none of that.  So yes, I DO love the "old rugged cross".

 

To jump from how you interpret various symbolic meanings of the cross to saying there is nothing  wrong with wearing a cross is a pretty big step in logic. Using that logic I could make the argument that any symbol in the Bible that may have positive meaning could be used in religious worship. 

The cross is also directly related to a curse in its symbolism. 

Galatians 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

However, most of the comments that I've seen thus far do not substantively have much to do with the subject of this thread. The thread asked if certain practices related to use of the cross is idolatry. The cross as a religious symbol is certainly found in many religions that predate Christianity. It was used in religious worship long before Christianity arrived on the seen in various pagan cultures. 

Would bowing down to a cross be acceptable to God, while bowing to a Buddha or another statue be idolatry? Can we bow to a Jesus statue, but not a Mary statue? That is the point I was showing with the gun. When we do the same behavior, yet replace the image with something else people suddenly see it as a practice opposed by the teachings of the Bible. 

Maybe some would be interested in defining idolatry from a Biblical viewpoint.  

Leviticus 26:1 Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the Lord your God.

cross.jpg

Edited by Paradigm
Picture
Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Worthy Ministers
  • Followers:  9
  • Topic Count:  40
  • Topics Per Day:  0.01
  • Content Count:  6,536
  • Content Per Day:  1.07
  • Reputation:   2,426
  • Days Won:  1
  • Joined:  06/28/2007
  • Status:  Offline
  • Birthday:  10/28/1957

22 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Ah, I don't think so.

Shalom, Neighbor.

To my post, ...

Quote

 

Shalom, Alison_P.

If one is trusting in that cross or crucifix at all for anything, then sure it is. What is ironic is that it was a Roman form of EXECUTION! Would you wear an electric chair as an emblem around your neck?

 

You reacted with, "Huh? I don't get it."

First, I was commenting on the fact that one cannot take a cross or crucifix as a TALISMAN! If one is wearing it to "ward off evil," then that person is using it as one would use a good-luck charm! That's superstitious NONSENSE! It won't work, and I believe, God might just do the OPPOSITE out of anger!

THIS is what the third Commandment of the Ten Commandments is all about! Don't treat the Name (haShem), YHWH, like a talisman, either! Don't think of His Name as a "MAGIC WORD!" The power is not in the Name; it's in the INFINITE, ALL-POWERFUL GOD Who gave us that Name!

Second, I was noting that the cross was an instrument used for a Roman execution! A "crucifix" is defined as...

"a representation of a cross with a figure of Jesus Christ on it: a large silver crucifix on a chain.

ORIGIN 

Middle English: via Old French from ecclesiastical Latin crucifixus, from Latin cruci fixus ‘fixed to a cross’. Compare with crucify."

To hang such an emblem around one's neck is like hanging an emblem of an electric chair or a hangman's noose or a syringe of lethal drugs around one's neck. My point in bringing this up is that, again, it's not in the cross, but in the MESSIAH, the CHRIST, on the cross, in whom we should trust! It was HIS sacrifice UPON the cross that gave us the means for God, His Father, to justify anyone who comes to Him humbly, asking for God's mercy.

The bottom line is this: It is NOT a form of idolatry to wear a cross, UNLESS one is actually worshipping that symbol! On the other hand, one might also be tempted to think that the wearing of the cross itself is some good luck charm. That is also against God's will.

HOWEVER, if one is simply wearing a cross to be a memory aid to jog that person's attention back to God in the hard times or wearing it to identify himself or herself as a believer in God and His Son, Yeshua` the Messiah ("Jesus the Christ"), to others, there's absolutely NOTHING wrong with wearing the cross. Just remember: THE CROSS IS EMPTY NOW! The Sacrifice was made, and God brought the Messiah back to life in the Resurrection, and the Messiah Yeshua` is now our Mediator between God and men.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Group:  Worthy Ministers
  • Followers:  17
  • Topic Count:  344
  • Topics Per Day:  0.13
  • Content Count:  7,393
  • Content Per Day:  2.70
  • Reputation:   5,320
  • Days Won:  1
  • Joined:  09/27/2016
  • Status:  Offline

This is a very good question, and a few responses are spot on. I'm not criticizing anyone whom wears a Cross, because I could be wrong in my thinking, but these are my thoughts:

We Christians are the salt and light of this world. Our conduct and fruits for Christ should need no introduction to anyone. We should be immediately recognized by our demeanor, actions, conduct and difference as Christ imagers. We shouldn't need a sign or symbol to announce whom we are and whom we follow, it should be self evident.

I have read my Bible from cover to cover. I have a solid foundation of what the early church and early church fathers thought and believed in their writings.

Up to the fourth century and the establishment of the  Roman Catholic church - state. No Apostle or early church father mentioned wearing a symbolic Crucifixion or Cross, or a painting of Jesus or the Cross. It seems man-made traditions stemming from the ROMAN Catholic Church invented the wearing of medallions of Jesus, mother of Jesus Mary and a bunch of the saints. I would consider the wearing of the preceding medallions a form of idolatry, as I do with praying to Mary and the saints for intercession to our Father.

Does anyone have an example of the Apostles or early church fathers wearing, implying or addressing this question and issue? If there's silence on the issue, I propose it's a man-made tradition and not biblical. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 6 months later...

  • Group:  Diamond Member
  • Followers:  1
  • Topic Count:  1
  • Topics Per Day:  0.00
  • Content Count:  1,176
  • Content Per Day:  0.87
  • Reputation:   126
  • Days Won:  0
  • Joined:  07/07/2020
  • Status:  Offline
  • Birthday:  04/29/1987

On 5/21/2018 at 5:56 AM, Alison_P said:
I havn't read the whole Bible throughly yet but I know that it states throughout The Bible including verse Leviticus 26:1 which says "You shall make you no idols nor graven image neither rear you up a standing image neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land to bow down unto it: for I am the LORD your God". Leviticus 26:1 
 
I believe that making graven images of things in Heaven & on Earth is also one of the 10 commandments. I think it was the second commandment.
 
Is wearing jewellery with the cross or crucifix, may it be a necklace, earrings or bracelet etc a form of idolatry? Is doing this going against scripture? I wear a necklace with the cross on it but I am beginning to believe that wearing a cross or owning a statue etc of the cross,  crucifix or even of Jesus alone is committing idolatry. I used to believe that wearing a cross or crucifix around my neck or another form of jewellery was a representation of Jesus dying for our sins but now I am starting to believe that it is the wrong thing to do and I am thinking about removing the cross from my necklace. 
 
If you believe what I am saying is correct, please explain why and if you believe otherwise , why do you believe that wearing the cross or crucifix is not committing idolatry? 

I would say no, but it would be if the necklace had the man on it hanging. Just a cross on its own its symbolic, but don't forget that drug dealers and rappers do this. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...