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scriptural support for free will belief

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55 minutes ago, Butero said:

He can do anything he wants to. 

He can't sin, neither is He the author of sin.

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On 6/4/2018 at 8:34 PM, Butero said:

Those scriptures prove free will is just an illusion.  You can only come to God if the Father reveals his Son to you.  Unless God chooses to do that, you will never be saved.  The fact some do not come to the faith proves this isn't speaking of everyone ever born.

Then I guess that a number of scripture verses are wrong. How many did Jesus die for? Everyone. How many does God desire to be saved? Everyone. Is God a respecter of persons? No.

The person that doesn't get saved, doesn't because they make their choice not to. Why? Because the god of this world blinds them. But even their eyes can be opened as evidenced by the number of atheists that have accepted and received Jesus as their Savior.

It's unfortunate that the Calvinist doctrine uses scripture to make a choice against sinners, to make God the reason why certain people.. loved ones don't get saved. That doctrine is saying that God's unconditional love is conditional. It makes God's grace not able to abound against sin. And it furthers an attitude of hatred against God who (according to Calvinist doctrine) chooses to accept some but not all. However, that doctrine is in direct contrast with the bible which puts the blame where it belongs, on the devil who has been deceiving since the garden of Eden.

The Calvinist doctrine is a man's explanation, it's not God's truth.

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14 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

God cannot do anything that violates his sinless nature.   God cannot sin.

No, none of it was scripted.   That is just your false doctrine. 

There is false doctrine being spread, but not from me.  God is not limited in any way.  He can do anything he wants.  Do you want to be the one to tell God he can't do something?  Who is going to enforce it, you?  Do you even have a clue what scripted means?  Anyone can go back to the Old Testament and read about all Judas Iscariot will do.  He does it.  When a movie is produced, there is this thing called paper with writing on it telling what the actors will do.  When they follow it, that is called following the script.  

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14 hours ago, Yowm said:

He can't sin, neither is He the author of sin.

Perhaps you want to be the one to tell God there are things he just cannot do?  We weren't even discussing sin.  I was saying that what Judas Iscariot did was scripted, and Shiloh denies that, even though I can pull the script right out of the Old Testament and show that Judas Iscariot followed it.  Any 3rd grader should be able to understand it after I take the time to show them the script and read it to them, followed by his actions.  Do any of you even understand what a script is?  I am beginning to wonder.  

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6 hours ago, Joulre2abba said:

Then I guess that a number of scripture verses are wrong. How many did Jesus die for? Everyone. How many does God desire to be saved? Everyone. Is God a respecter of persons? No.

The person that doesn't get saved, doesn't because they make their choice not to. Why? Because the god of this world blinds them. But even their eyes can be opened as evidenced by the number of atheists that have accepted and received Jesus as their Savior.

It's unfortunate that the Calvinist doctrine uses scripture to make a choice against sinners, to make God the reason why certain people.. loved ones don't get saved. That doctrine is saying that God's unconditional love is conditional. It makes God's grace not able to abound against sin. And it furthers an attitude of hatred against God who (according to Calvinist doctrine) chooses to accept some but not all. However, that doctrine is in direct contrast with the bible which puts the blame where it belongs, on the devil who has been deceiving since the garden of Eden.

The Calvinist doctrine is a man's explanation, it's not God's truth.

The Bible states that nobody can come to the Son unless the Father reveals him to that person.  Jesus said he spoke in parables that certain individuals would not understand what he was saying and be converted and saved.  When Jesus died on the cross, that was sufficient to save everyone, yet everyone is not saved because God doesn't reveal his Son to everyone.  

It is unfortunate that people that have no understanding of scripture come in here and try to teach.  All they have is a general idea of things they believe in their own mind, but the fruit of knowledge is lacking in them.  I am not speaking of myself. 

I am not a follower of Calvin or any other man.  This doctrine is found right in the pages of the Bible.  I would suggest that unconditional eternal security is a perverted type of Calvinism.  They just took the perseverance of the saints message and perverted it to take the power away from God and make it about a decision they made, making them their own saviors.  

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7 minutes ago, Butero said:

There is false doctrine being spread, but not from me.  God is not limited in any way.  He can do anything he wants. 

God can do anything He wants.   The false doctrine that is being spread is that God wants to create people in order to destroy them, that God wants or ordain people to reject Jesus, and that God wants people to go to Hell.   It is false teaching to say that God wants to script people  to be sinners and idoators and abortionists and so on.   

The truth is that God can do anything He wants, but God doesn't want any of the garbage you claim He wants. 

Furthermore, you imply that God can sin, which He can't.

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Do you want to be the one to tell God he can't do something?  Who is going to enforce it, you? 

I am not telling God what to do.   I am telling you that God doesn't do the garbage you assign to Him.

 

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Do you even have a clue what scripted means? 

yes, I do and you made it very clear that life is a book that God writes and we are all characters and we have no choice but to do what God has scripted us to do.  More false teaching, by the way.

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Anyone can go back to the Old Testament and read about all Judas Iscariot will do.  He does it.  When a movie is produced, there is this thing called paper with writing on it telling what the actors will do.  When they follow it, that is called following the script.  

It's not following a script the way YOU present it.   Your presentation has always been about God predetermining every action and we have no choice but to do what God what God has predetermined we will do.   That's not in the Bible, but it is what you are trying peddle on here.

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4 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

God can do anything He wants.   The false doctrine that is being spread is that God wants to create people in order to destroy them, that God wants or ordain people to reject Jesus, and that God wants people to go to Hell.   It is false teaching to say that God wants to script people  to be sinners and idoators and abortionists and so on.   

The truth is that God can do anything He wants, but God doesn't want any of the garbage you claim He wants. 

Furthermore, you imply that God can sin, which He can't.

I am not telling God what to do.   I am telling you that God doesn't do the garbage you assign to Him.

 

yes, I do and you made it very clear that life is a book that God writes and we are all characters and we have no choice but to do what God has scripted us to do.  More false teaching, by the way.

It's not following a script the way YOU present it.   Your presentation has always been about God predetermining every action and we have no choice but to do what God what God has predetermined we will do.   That's not in the Bible, but it is what you are trying peddle on here.

I just showed it was in the Bible that Judas Iscariot would betray the Lord, the amount he would betray him for, how he would return the money, it would be used to purchase the Potter's field, and Judas would kill himself.  That is a script.  What do you mean it is not a script the way I present it?  A script is a script.  It is written out what Judas would do, a script, and he followed the script to the letter.  There is nothing complicated here.  It was written in the Bible that Jesus told Peter he would deny him three times.   Peter followed the script and denied the Lord three times.  Again, do you even understand what scripted means?  

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11 minutes ago, Butero said:

I just showed it was in the Bible that Judas Iscariot would betray the Lord, the amount he would betray him for, how he would return the money, it would be used to purchase the Potter's field, and Judas would kill himself.  That is a script. 

No, it is not.  It is a prophecy.   Nothing in the Bible supports any notion that the sovereignty of God involves scripting and predetermining how people act and behave. 

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What do you mean it is not a script the way I present it?  A script is a script.  It is written out what Judas would do, a script, and he followed the script to the letter.  There is nothing complicated here. 

It's not complicated because it is not a "script."   

 

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It was written in the Bible that Jesus told Peter he would deny him three times.   Peter followed the script and denied the Lord three times.  Again, do you even understand what scripted means?  

I know exactly what it means, and the Bible doesn't present prophecy as a "script" and it doesn't present God's sovereignty as having every action and thought and event already predetermined.   The whole "script" thing is something you have subjectively assigned to Scripture.   

 

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1 minute ago, shiloh357 said:

No, it is not.  It is a prophecy.   Nothing in the Bible supports any notion that the sovereignty of God involves scripting and predetermining how people act and behave. 

It's not complicated because it is not a "script."   

 

I know exactly what it means, and the Bible doesn't present prophecy as a "script" and it doesn't present God's sovereignty as having every action and thought and event already predetermined.   The whole "script" thing is something you have subjectively assigned to Scripture.   

 

Are you claiming the words of Christ to Peter was just a prophecy?  Peter did exactly what Jesus said he would do.  Are you claiming the words of Christ didn't have to come to pass, after you said God cannot lie?  

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Clearly, God planned for Judas Iscariot to betray Jesus.  This was his plan.  Arrangements were made for this to take place, unless you think the entire plan of salvation could have been thwarted.  Did God plan it or didn't he?  When Jesus told everyone that the one that dipped with him would betray him, was that just a prophecy that could be prevented?  How can that be if Jesus is God and God cannot lie?  

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