Revelation and the Study of Woe

[iamlamad]

14 hours ago, Willie T said:

You mean like the simple text that says that letter was written to seven, then existing churches in Old Turkey in the 1st Century about things "that were to happen shortly?"

Yes, exactly: read what is written AS it is written. But do try to understand it: God's "shortly" is not our shortly.

[Revelation Man]

On 7/25/2018 at 11:55 PM, iamlamad said:

You go ahead and believe you alone know the truth. One day you will find things will turn out just as I have written them, in that order, because I follow what John has written. 

 

Plenty of others know the truths, plenty don't because they are not called to prophecy or do not listen to the Spirit. 

On 7/25/2018 at 11:55 PM, iamlamad said:

I will write it again since you missed it.

The man of sin will enter the temple and declare he is the God of the Jews. This will reveal him to the world as the Antichrist Beast of chapter 13.  And in Revelation, the 7th trumpet will sound in heaven the moment he enters the must holy place. 

And you can't cite anywhere in the bible that quotes the Anti-Christ/Man of Sin/Little Horn as saying he will be the King of the Jews or God of the Jews, you conflate this man acting like and DEMANDING to be Worshiped as GOD with this man professing to be the God of the Jews, the Messiah. I know where this confusion comes from, and I know all the facts show this not to be true, if one only digs down a little.

This Anti-Christ will Conquer the Jews and kill 2/3, hes not going to try and be or fake being their coming Messiah, once he Conquers the Jews hes going to Murder them. The only Jews that survive are the 1/3 who accept Jesus as their Messiah before the Day of the Lord begins and thus Flee Judea because they HEED Jesus' words !! You see him professing to be a GOD is totally different from him saying I am the Messiah, that is never stated anywhere, period, its just not factual. The people on earth who take the Mark of the Beast are the same types on earth now who hate the REAL God, the love homosexuality, Abortion, loony Earth fads like Global Warming etc. etc. etc. Hes going to be the God of the Humanists, hes not going to say LOOK A ME, I am Jesus !! They don't want Jesus, even the 2/3 of Jews who reject Christ Jesus as their Messiah when the Two-witnesses start witnessing Christ crucified at the 1335 don' want Jesus. There is only one group of people that they try to DECEIVE with the lie that the Christ has shown up, and Jesus warns those in the Wilderness/Petra, BEFOREHAND that they will be lying to them, then he tells them lo, I will not be in the Desert, nor in the Secret Chambers (Store Room), I will be coming in the EASTERN SKIES, thus the Elect Jews have been FOREWARNED and CAN NOT be deceived !! 

The 7th Trumpet has nothing to do with the Anti-Christ, you refuse to acknowledge that Rev. 13 happens during Rev. ch. 6 because you just can't quite grasp that, that is on you brother, that is a very easy understanding there, not understanding that Rev. 11, 12, 13, 14, 17, 18 and 19 are Parenthetical Citations and nor Real Time Events, is gong to leave your timing off. The Anti-Christ is the White Horse/Seal # 1, it the exact same person as the Beast of Rev. chapter 13. 

Now nowhere in Scriptures will you be able to point to the Jews accepting Jesus as their God. The scriptures you will cite are misunderstood by many (not that many) but I understand what it is they are conflating. HOUSE CLEANING YESTERDAY.....TIRED, WIFE RULED ME YESTERDAY, LOL. 

On 7/25/2018 at 11:55 PM, iamlamad said:

The 70th week begins at the 7th seal, 3 1/2 years before he is revealed.

Got it this time? 

And you are still wrong.  The First Seal is the Anti-Christ. That happens 3.5 years into the 70th Week. 

 

On 7/25/2018 at 11:55 PM, iamlamad said:

By the way, your "facts" are easy to prove wrong, simply because they are wrong. But you have so many, it is just not worth the time it would take. And you would not believe it anyway.

No, you just chose to run from the truth brother, you can't handle the truths I bring forth. 

[Willie T]

8 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Yes, exactly: read what is written AS it is written. But do try to understand it: God's "shortly" is not our shortly.

Does the book tell us , "as it is written", that we are to presume to read that particular "shortly" as meaning something other than when "shortly" is written elsewhere in the Bible?  I mean, how do we determine that we are to change the meaning of this particular "shortly", but not the meanings of others?

Edited July 27, 2018 by Willie T

[iamlamad]

2 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

Plenty of others know the truths, plenty don't because they are not called to prophecy or do not listen to the Spirit. 

And you can't cite anywhere in the bible that quotes the Anti-Christ/Man of Sin/Little Horn as saying he will be the King of the Jews or God of the Jews, you conflate this man acting like and DEMANDING to be Worshiped as GOD with this man professing to be the God of the Jews, the Messiah. I know where this confusion comes from, and I know all the facts show this not to be true, if one only digs down a little.

This Anti-Christ will Conquer the Jews and kill 2/3, hes not going to try and be or fake being their coming Messiah, once he Conquers the Jews hes going to Murder them. The only Jews that survive are the 1/3 who accept Jesus as their Messiah before the Day of the Lord begins and thus Flee Judea because they HEED Jesus' words !! You see him professing to be a GOD is totally different from him saying I am the Messiah, that is never stated anywhere, period, its just not factual. The people on earth who take the Mark of the Beast are the same types on earth now who hate the REAL God, the love homosexuality, Abortion, loony Earth fads like Global Warming etc. etc. etc. Hes going to be the God of the Humanists, hes not going to say LOOK A ME, I am Jesus !! They don't want Jesus, even the 2/3 of Jews who reject Christ Jesus as their Messiah when the Two-witnesses start witnessing Christ crucified at the 1335 don' want Jesus. There is only one group of people that they try to DECEIVE with the lie that the Christ has shown up, and Jesus warns those in the Wilderness/Petra, BEFOREHAND that they will be lying to them, then he tells them lo, I will not be in the Desert, nor in the Secret Chambers (Store Room), I will be coming in the EASTERN SKIES, thus the Elect Jews have been FOREWARNED and CAN NOT be deceived !! 

The 7th Trumpet has nothing to do with the Anti-Christ, you refuse to acknowledge that Rev. 13 happens during Rev. ch. 6 because you just can't quite grasp that, that is on you brother, that is a very easy understanding there, not understanding that Rev. 11, 12, 13, 14, 17, 18 and 19 are Parenthetical Citations and nor Real Time Events, is gong to leave your timing off. The Anti-Christ is the White Horse/Seal # 1, it the exact same person as the Beast of Rev. chapter 13. 

Now nowhere in Scriptures will you be able to point to the Jews accepting Jesus as their God. The scriptures you will cite are misunderstood by many (not that many) but I understand what it is they are conflating. HOUSE CLEANING YESTERDAY.....TIRED, WIFE RULED ME YESTERDAY, LOL. 

And you are still wrong.  The First Seal is the Anti-Christ. That happens 3.5 years into the 70th Week. 

 

No, you just chose to run from the truth brother, you can't handle the truths I bring forth. 

Your theories require dissecting and rearranging Revelation. I know therefore that your theories will be proven wrong. 

Look: anyone can make any verse say almost anything they want - if they are willing (as you are) to pull verses from their context. I will not do that.

It is for sure I cannot handle your kind of "truth."  I choose to believe what is written AS it is written. Your theories don't fit what is written as it is written. You have inserted human reasoning. 

Edited July 27, 2018 by iamlamad

[iamlamad]

Just now, Willie T said:

Does the book tell us , "as it is written", that we are to presume to read that particular "shortly" as being something than when "shortly" is written elsewhere in the Bible?  I mean, how do we determine that we are to change the meaning of this particular "shortly", but not the meanings of others?

You can argue with God about "shortly" when we get to heaven. It will do little good to argue about it here. Did you notice that In Hebrews it was the "last days" when Jesus was here?

Hebrews 1:2

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

 

Yet, we have had almost another 2000 years.  It is a fact: we don't see time like God sees it!

 

I suggest you don't spend so much time on one word, but discover that much of Revelation cannot be history, simply because these events have never happened.

[Willie T]

Of course I "noticed it."  What do you think I have been saying all along when I keep on challenging all these people saying that finally the year 2018 is the "Last Days" the whole world has been waiting for?  I think we are a lot more confused as to what "The Last Days" were, as to the date.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Willie T

[Revelation Man]

22 hours ago, Willie T said:

You mean like the simple text that says that letter was written to seven, then existing churches in Old Turkey in the 1st Century about things "that were to happen shortly?"

This is why we have to put in WORK/Study brother. What you understand Rev. 1:1 to say because of a BAD TRANSLATION, and what it actually says are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS, which is why I dig deep in the Word Study. There is TWO WORDS behind Shortly....My Greek site helps !! WATCH:

 The Reuelation 602 of Iesus 2424 Christ, 5547 which 3739 God 2316 gaue 1325 z5656 vnto him, 846 to shewe 1166 z5658 vnto his y846 x848 seruants 1401 things which 3739 must 1163 z5748 shortly 1722 5034 come to passe; 1096 z5635 and 2532 he sent 649 z5660 and signified 4591 z5656 [it] by 1223 his y846 x848 Angel 32 vnto his y846 x848 seruant 1401 Iohn, 2491

NOTICE the TWO NUMBERS which stand for TWO WORDS ? Now watch what thy actually mean.........

#1722 ἐν en {en} a primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state),..................( At a FUTURE POINT IN TIME !! Get it? )

 

#5034 τάχος tachos {takh'-os}  1) quickness, speed

From the same as G5036; a brief space (of time), that is, (with G1722 prefixed) in haste:— + quickly,  speedily.......( Jesus will come in HASTE )

—Strong's (Greek Dictionary of the New Testament)

So does it actually mean Jesus will come SHORTLY ? Of course not, it was a bad translation via the KJV.

It means at a FIXED POINT IN TIME (Only the Father knows right ? Why would anyone expect Jesus to be able to tell us anything except at a FIXED POINT IN TIME !! And that is Just what Jesus says).........So at a FIXED POINT IN TIME, Jesus will come in a FLASH, in HASTE, like a THIEF IN THE NIGHT, Boom.

 

So God never said Jesus was coming SHORTLY, men messed up the translation because we are MISTAKE PRONE. 

[Willie T]

10 minutes ago, Revelation Man said:

This is why we have to put in WORK/Study brother. What you understand Rev. 1:1 to say because of a BAD TRANSLATION, and what it actually says are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS, which is why I dig deep in the Word Study. There is TWO WORDS behind Shortly....My Greek site helps !! WATCH:

 The Reuelation 602 of Iesus 2424 Christ, 5547 which 3739 God 2316 gaue 1325 z5656 vnto him, 846 to shewe 1166 z5658 vnto his y846 x848 seruants 1401 things which 3739 must 1163 z5748 shortly 1722 5034 come to passe; 1096 z5635 and 2532 he sent 649 z5660 and signified 4591 z5656 [it] by 1223 his y846 x848 Angel 32 vnto his y846 x848 seruant 1401 Iohn, 2491

NOTICE the TWO NUMBERS which stand for TWO WORDS ? Now watch what thy actually mean.........

#1722 ἐν en {en} a primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state),..................( At a FUTURE POINT IN TIME !! Get it? )

 

#5034 τάχος tachos {takh'-os}  1) quickness, speed

From the same as G5036; a brief space (of time), that is, (with G1722 prefixed) in haste:— + quickly,  speedily.......( Jesus will come in HASTE )

—Strong's (Greek Dictionary of the New Testament)

So does it actually mean Jesus will come SHORTLY ? Of course not, it was a bad translation via the KJV.

It means at a FIXED POINT IN TIME (Only the Father knows right ? Why would anyone expect Jesus to be able to tell us anything except at a FIXED POINT IN TIME !! And that is Just what Jesus says).........So at a FIXED POINT IN TIME, Jesus will come in a FLASH, in HASTE, like a THIEF IN THE NIGHT, Boom.

 

So God never said Jesus was coming SHORTLY, men messed up the translation because we are MISTAKE PRONE. 

Yet "men" were totally ignorant of any of these Greek meanings until a guy named Strong finally came along and showed them how the language was to be read?  If it was all hidden till he was born, how did he find it?  No, I suspect the old scribes might have had just a tiny clue as to how Greek was written, and wrote it down in a way that conveyed the meaning to later translators.

True, I have no doubt that various translators slanted a lot of their interpretations toward the biases of their own religious preferences.  But, I keep hearing that those guys didn't didn't get it right.... no matter who translated it, or what they believed.  And even we, today, are only going along with what someone else tells us was the REAL meaning of a specific word. 

Edited July 27, 2018 by Willie T

[Revelation Man]

15 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Your theories require dissecting and rearranging Revelation. I know therefore that your theories will be proven wrong. 

 

No it doesn't, its your lack of understanding the book of Revelation that causes you to error, the way I see the book of Revelation as revealed by the Holy Spirit the timeline fits because I listen to what God is teaching me. I refuse to accept a time-line that did not FIT, so God gave me the answers. I have told you before, I don't do theories. You are of the ilk that once e gets an answer/understanding, its hard for God to teach you. You seem to let understandings overwhelm you, that was the Pharisees problem, their pride kept them from seeing Jesus/New Things of God. 

21 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Look: anyone can make any verse say almost anything they want - if they are willing (as you are) to pull verses from their context. I will not do that.

It is for sure I cannot handle your kind of "truth."  I choose to believe what is written AS it is written. Your theories don't fit what is written as it is written. You have inserted human reasoning. 

au contraire mon ami, my understandings fit the timeline, your don't.

The Two-witnesses ministry lasts 1260 Days as does the Beast..............Now explain when tey both show up and both die and make it fit.

[Revelation Man]

2 hours ago, Willie T said:

Yet "men" were totally ignorant of any of these Greek meanings until a guy named Strong finally came along and showed them how the language was to be read?  If it was all hidden till he was born, how did he find it?  No, I suspect the old scribes might have had just a tiny clue as to how Greek was written, and wrote it down in a way that conveyed the meaning to later translators..

Facts are FACTS............You not accepting these FACTS is like someone thinking the earth has been around only 6000 years, just because you chose to believe that doesn't make it truth brother. The bible was translated from Greek, so we know the WORDS Jesus/John used for Revelation. 

Which was/is TRUE ? That is easy, Jesus can't lie, he stated ONLY the Father knows when He will send His Son (Jesus) back, so Rev. 1:1 backs that up.  At a FIXED point in time (unknown to Jesus) the Father will send Jesus who will COME IN HASTE !! 

Edited July 27, 2018 by Revelation Man