enoob57 Posted July 3, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,064 Content Per Day: 7.97 Reputation: 21,391 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 3, 2018 Truth can never be made lie or lie truth but in Jesus' Person the apex of the eternal outcome of sin and judgment thereof... that which is of God continues and the rebellion through lie ceased into itself for eternal flame... James 3:12 12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh KJV The answer is clear that which is of God cannot be made any other and that which is of sin cannot be made of God... this 'IS' what 'IS' and the eternity is set to [of God] - [not of God]! However looking to creation of all things and then realizing separation from this forever in fire should convert the whole world to God but they simply will not [of God] believe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 3, 2018 On 6/19/2018 at 1:23 PM, shiloh357 said: Jesus did not die spiritually on the cross. Jesus was still God on the cross and was in complete sovereign control of everything that was happening. Wishful thinking I can't find this in the mind of the old testiment prophets, or the disciples mind. What make say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted July 3, 2018 Share Posted July 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: Wishful thinking I can't find this in the mind of the old testiment prophets, or the disciples mind. What make say that. If you claim that Jesus died spiritually on the cross and was not God on cross, you are promoting heresy and not Christianity. And you are calling God a liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 3, 2018 (edited) On 6/19/2018 at 1:23 PM, shiloh357 said: Jesus did not die spiritually on the cross. Quote Jesus was still God on the cross and was in complete sovereign control of everything that was happening. 33 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: Wishful thinking I can't find this in the mind of the old testiment prophets, or the disciples mind. What make say that. 30 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: If you claim that Jesus died spiritually on the cross and was not God on cross, you are promoting heresy and not Christianity. And you are calling God a liar. The first statement " Jesus did not die spiritually on the Cross", This is just the statement you made, and you follow by saying you believe it is truth. but you did not do the following, a) give your definition of what is a spiritual death, and follow that with an example if you could think of one, and b) you did not give the why you believe that he Jesus did not die spiritually, and c) you did not address the question whether or not It was possible for Jesus to die spiritually, and the consequences that would follow had he died spiritually. From the consequences we could established whether he died spiritually or not. Ca you try , in this case as it is a discussion after the fact, we could and we should point to the facts that establishes that he did not die spiritually, begining from his birth to show that he was born with the life God's life in him, and he died still with God's life in him. And there is more . You do not need to go on line to make your search, but from your own understanding, you could say something, and we won't judge you. Without prejudice Edited July 3, 2018 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted July 3, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,763 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,161 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted July 3, 2018 23 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: The first statement " Jesus did not die spiritually on the Cross", This is just the statement you made, and you follow by saying you believe it is truth. but you did not do the following, a) give your definition of what is a spiritual death, and follow that with an example if you could think of one, and b) you did not give the why you believe that he Jesus did not die spiritually, and c) you did not address the question whether or not It was possible for Jesus to die spiritually, and the consequences that would follow had he died spiritually. From the consequences we could established whether he died spiritually or not. Ca you try , in this case as it is a discussion after the fact, we could and we should point to the facts that establishes that he did not die spiritually, begining from his birth to show that he was born with the life God's life in him, and he died still with God's life in him. And there is more . You do not need to go on line to make your search, but from your own understanding, you could say something, and we won't judge you. Without prejudice Jesus had not God's life in Him ,He is God and did not die spiritually,how can God die? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 3, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, angels4u said: Jesus had not God's life in Him ,He is God and did not die spiritually,how can God die? I appreciate the reply, I you please read again the inquiries that I put on for discussion, we could have a go at it and that could be possible to bless one another and help others who are caught in the net of some other positions that have the appearances of truth, made by people of authority, and with some good intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 15 hours ago, angels4u said: Jesus had not God's life in Him ,He is God and did not die spiritually,how can God die? Jesus died physically. God cannot die. Jesus' deity did not die on the cross. Jesus saved the thief on the cross, which proves that Jesus was still God when he hung on the cross. Only God can save. If Jesus were just a man on the cross, He would have had the power to save the thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted July 4, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,064 Content Per Day: 7.97 Reputation: 21,391 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 4, 2018 (edited) The God aspect of The Son was that He 'dismissed' his life from His Earthly body Matt 27:50 50 And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. NKJV Matt 27:50 o( T_NSM 3588 ho de\ CONJ 1161 dé )Ihsou=$ N__NSM Jesus 2424 I¢soús pa/lin ADV again 3825 pálin kra/ca$ V_AAP___NSM when he had cried 2896 kráxas fwnh=| N__DSF a 5456 phœn¢¡ mega/lh| A__DSF loud 3173 megál¢ a)fh=ken V_AAI_3S yielded up 863 aph¢¡ken to\ T_ASN the 3588 tó pneu=ma N__ASN ghost 4151 pneúma [snip] 863. a)fi/hmi aphí¢mi; fut. aph¢¡sœ, fut. pass. apheth¢¡somai; aor. pass. aphéth¢n, perf. apheíka; irregular forms: pres. 2d person apheís, imperf. ¢¡phion, perf. pass. 3d person pl. aphéœntai; from apó (575), from, and hi¢mi (n.f., see iós [2447]), to send. To send forth or away, let go from oneself. Used trans.: (I) To dismiss, e.g., the multitudes (Matt 13:36); of a wife, to put her away (1 Cor 7:11-13). In Matt 27:50, "he gave up the spirit" (a.t.), expired. See also Gen 35:18. In Mark 15:37, "when Jesus let forth a loud cry" (a.t. [Sept.: Gen 45:2]). (II) To let go from one's power, possession, to let go free, let escape (Matt 24:40,41; Luke 17:34-36; Sept.: Prov 4:13). Metaphorically, to let go from obligation toward oneself, to remit, e.g., a debt, offense, with the dat. of person (Matt 18:27,32,35; Mark 11:25; Sept.: Deut 15:2). Of sins, to remit the penalty of sins, i.e., to pardon, forgive, with the dat. of person, e.g., opheil¢¡mata (3783), debts, faults (Matt 6:12); hamartías (266), sins (Matt 9:2,5,6; 12:31; Mark 2:5,7,9,10); blasph¢mían (988), blasphemy, evil speaking (Matt 12:31,32); paraptœ¡mata (3900), trespasses, offenses (Matt 6:14,15; Mark 11:25); hamart¢¡mata (265), individual sins (Mark 3:28; 4:12); anomías (458), iniquities, acts of lawlessness (Rom 4:7). Also Sept.: Gen 50:17; Ex 32:32; Lev 4:20; 5:10,13; Ps 25:18 Ps 32:5 Isa 22:14; 55:7. The expression "to forgive sins" or to remit sins means to remove the sins from someone. Only God is said to be able to do this (Mark 2:10). To forgive sins is not to disregard them and do nothing about them, but to liberate a person from them, their guilt, and their power. We are to ask God to forgive our sins, remove them away from us so that we do not stand guilty of them or under their power. We are never expected to forgive the sins of others toward God because we have no power to do so, but we are expected to forgive others for the sins done to us ("Forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors" or those who are our debtors [Matt 6:12]). To forgive others does not mean to separate them from us, but to allow them through our contact to know God who can free them from their sins. Thus we should do everything in our power to see that the sins of others are removed from them through the grace and power of Jesus Christ which we make known to them. (III) To let go from one's further notice, care, attendance, occupancy, i.e., to leave or let alone. (A) Spoken of persons, to quit, forsake or abandon (Matt 4:11; 8:15; 15:14; 26:44,56; Mark 4:36; John 10:12). Of things, the nets (Matt 4:20); the house (Mark 13:34); Judea (John 4:3); all things (Matt 19:27,29). See also Sept.: 1 Sam 17:20,28; Jer 12:7. To leave in any place or state, let remain (Matt 5:24; 18:12; Mark 1:20; Luke 10:30; John 4:28; 8:29, "hath not left me"; 14:18,27; 16:32; Acts 14:17; Sept.: Gen 42:33; Ex 9:21; 2 Sam 15:16; 1 Kings 19:3; 1 Chron 16:21). To leave to anyone, i.e., to let him have or take (Matt 5:40, "let him have thy cloak"). To leave behind as at death (Matt 22:25; Mark 12:19-22; Sept.: Ps 17:14 Eccl 2:18). To leave remaining, and in the pass., to be left, remain (Matt 23:38; 24:2, "There shall not be left here one stone upon another"; Mark 13:2; Luke 13:35; 19:44; 21:6; Heb 2:8; Sept.: Judg 2:23; 3:1). (B) Metaphorically, in various senses, to leave, desert, quit (Rom 1:27, "the natural use"; Rev 2:4). To omit, pass by (Heb 6:1, leaving the word of the beginning). To neglect, to omit (Matt 23:23, "the weightier matters of the law"; Mark 7:8; Luke 11:42; Sept.: Eccl 11:6). (IV) To let go, i.e., to let pass, permit, suffer, with the acc. followed by the inf. expressed or implied (Matt 8:22; 13:30; 19:14; Mark 1:34; 5:37). See also Matt 3:15; Mark 5:19; 11:6; Luke 13:8; John 11:48; 12:7; Rev 2:20 (apheís or eás) "your [wife] Jezebel to teach" (a.t.); Sept.: Ex 12:23; Num 22:13; Judg 16:26; 2 Sam 16:11. Followed by hína (2443), so that, with the subjunctive after verbs of command (Mark 11:16). The imper. áphes (sing.) and áphete (pl.) are followed by the subjunctive without hína, e.g., áphes ídœmen (first person pl. 2d aor. subjunctive of horᜠ[3708], to see, let us see, suffer us to see [Matt 27:49; Mark 15:36]); Matt 7:4, "Let me pull out"; Luke 6:42. Complete Word Study Dictionary: New Testament © 1992 by AMG International, Inc. Revised Edition, 1993_ [snip] How beautiful the harmony of Scripture John 10:18 18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father. KJV Edited July 4, 2018 by enoob57 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 4, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 596 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,043 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,786 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 4, 2018 Jesus's body was put into the tomb, but where did his spirit go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adstar Posted July 4, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 75 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,399 Content Per Day: 0.43 Reputation: 1,307 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted July 4, 2018 On 6/20/2018 at 6:36 AM, angels4u said: The reason I put this topic up was that I was surprised that Arnold Fruchtenbaught believes that Jesus did die How can God die,think of it,really? Jesus and God are one .. How can they be seperated spiritually? Where does this teaching come from? Can someone quote scripture to support this teaching? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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