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Intimacy with God


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20 hours ago, Gideon said:

Brother,  I am curious. I know you are not naming names, but it seems odd that a post from you like this always pops up when we talk about having the need for a deep relationship with the Lord, and that the fruits of the Spirit to be the ultimate test of whether the gospel we are following is the truth or not. 

Do you believe that Notme and I are somehow following this gospel? And if you do, why? What exactl6 have either of us said that would lead you into that belief? Is the fruit of the Spirit the Biblical way to know our Lord’s disciples? Is God’s will that we get to know Him in a richer and deeper way in real relationship? 

I get that you are wary of the emergent churches. And I agree. But surely, you must understand, if they are counterfeits to lead people astray, that must mean they are counterfeiting off of the real deal? I have already told you when you asked me point blank if I was part of the emergent church or the prosperity church or what they taught and I plainly stated no. Unless you believe me to be a liar, then what is it about what we share that offends you and is causing you to invariably make statements such as you have made time and again? 

I want you to know, I am not angry, and I love you as a brother in Christ. Your zeal is refreshing.  I am simply curious as to exactly what you are understanding that we are sharing that you feel warrants your warnings, with care of course that you are naming no names? Is it possible you are wrong as to your assumptions?

Remember, love believes the best until proven otherwise. That is all I am asking you to do here. If you have real concerns or questions, ask away. I will be glad to do my best to answer them and I am sure Notme feels the same way. I have no hidden agenda. What I speak does not vary with who ai share it with or where I share it. Ask around. I drive people crazy with my ramblings about walking in our new nature the same, no matter who they are. LOL.

I fully realize that what we are sharing sounds “new” but it is not at all. But we as His church have lost sight of who we are and what the benefits are of being children of God. We have traded our birthright, victory over the world, the flesh and the devil for a mess of pottage. We have great need to re-discover overcoming faith that we truly are no longer bound by our old natures.

The awakening that I have spoken of is not some “new revelation” but simply His people finally getting so tired of living as saved children who are still not ‘safe’ from the growing evil in the world or the attacks of Satan that, in their desperation, they cry out to Jesús to deliver them from the old nature that still reigns inside of them. If nothing profits but a new creature, as the Word tells us, it is imperative we learn how to walk in it, amen? 

Again, I realize that this term bothers you and sends up warning flags, and I get that, but the counterfeit “awakening” is far, far from what I share and is available right now to any and all who are tired of sin reigning over them, keeping them earthbound and out of deep fellowship with our Lord. 

I love you brother and want to dispelll any notions you might have as to whether what we are sharing on non-stop is dangerous and in error. Have questions? Ask away. Again, I will do my best to answer you. 

Blessings, 

Gids

WARN the folks ,   Sound the trumpet , for the delusion of great delusion which will lead the world as one RIGHT to the beast has began .

WHEN this has filled world wide and to the full the hearts and minds of all who loved the lie and rejected the Love of the truth .    They will as one

with one mind , one heart ,  HEED the dark one and ones .     And many lambs will be butchered and hated .

A massive line of division has began and only increases ,   and it will pit those who reject and have rejected the Love of the truth ,  AGAINST those

who have received the love of the truth and preach it .   Our focus must be on exhorting , on reaching as many as we can and fast .

The lie which leads the world right to the beast who will be as their god ,  the ideal that leads to that , HAS ALREADY BEGAN .

We will witness not only an increase in watching all these religions join hands for peace and unity which leads them to the beast , WE will

witness an intensifying hatred against THAT TRUTH which WAS the TRUTH that could have saved them, AND against those who preach it .

We already are witnessing a massive false awakening ,   and more than ever we must preach the words of truth , and of holiness and soberness

and pray the grace of GOD awake the those who sleep in darkness .    Some will hear , but many will reject.

And those who reject will become harder and very hardened against that truth .   I MEAN their hearts will become HARDENED BIG TIME .

TILL all they desire IS for the meek to be rid from the earth .  And their so called god WILL GIVE them their hearts desire .   FOR HE will rise up

and the world with him as one ,  to come against the LAMB and lambs .   And a tribulation so great will then begin.

And to be honest ,  we are fast running out of time .    The gospel MUST be the center , correction  must also be sounded , pure exhortations must begiven

to build up the body .    A great evil does come , for the land and worse the churches , refuse repentance by and large and grow rather WORSE .

AND FOR ALL THIS the JUDGMENT DOES COME .

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2 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

WARN the folks ,   Sound the trumpet , for the delusion of great delusion which will lead the world as one RIGHT to the beast has began .

WHEN this has filled world wide and to the full the hearts and minds of all who loved the lie and rejected the Love of the truth .    They will as one

with one mind , one heart ,  HEED the dark one and ones .     And many lambs will be butchered and hated .

A massive line of division has began and only increases ,   and it will pit those who reject and have rejected the Love of the truth ,  AGAINST those

who have received the love of the truth and preach it .   Our focus must be on exhorting , on reaching as many as we can and fast .

The lie which leads the world right to the beast who will be as their god ,  the ideal that leads to that , HAS ALREADY BEGAN .

We will witness not only an increase in watching all these religions join hands for peace and unity which leads them to the beast , WE will

witness an intensifying hatred against THAT TRUTH which WAS the TRUTH that could have saved them, AND against those who preach it .

We already are witnessing a massive false awakening ,   and more than ever we must preach the words of truth , and of holiness and soberness

and pray the grace of GOD awake the those who sleep in darkness .    Some will hear , but many will reject.

And those who reject will become harder and very hardened against that truth .   I MEAN their hearts will become HARDENED BIG TIME .

TILL all they desire IS for the meek to be rid from the earth .  And their so called god WILL GIVE them their hearts desire .   FOR HE will rise up

and the world with him as one ,  to come against the LAMB and lambs .   And a tribulation so great will then begin.

And to be honest ,  we are fast running out of time .    The gospel MUST be the center , correction  must also be sounded , pure exhortations must begiven

to build up the body .    A great evil does come , for the land and worse the churches , refuse repentance by and large and grow rather WORSE .

AND FOR ALL THIS the JUDGMENT DOES COME .

Brother, why is it that you assume from a brother using specific words such as experience and love and awakening that this must mean they are part of the delusion? Are you convinced that we as the true church are displaying God to a world desperate to see Christianity waked out in front of them, and not just hear our mantra that Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven?   

Do you really think that at present that we as His church are walking in love towards one another at present?

Do you think we  are walking in all God can possibly give us so there is no need to exhort and encourage brothers and sisters to go deeper in the Lord, experiencing Him in a far greater way than we are at present,  where joy is real and victory is as well?

Do you think we as His bride is actually ready to meet Him and that we do not need to be awakened to our desperate plight, with secret sins lurking in our hearts, with unbelief that God can actually keep us from falling and actually cause us to walk in real victory over the world the flesh and the devil. 

I want you to consider the possibility that you are incorrect in judging those here who talk about such things, especially when they give no sign of being a part of the things you so fear. There is plenty to warn about here.... hardened spirits, lack of patience, unkind words, doctrinal correctness without fruits of the Spirit. And yet you are strangely silent towards these occupancies, choosing instead to concentrate on your ‘trigger words’.  

Again, if you have specific questions when you hear certain words or phrases from myself or others that you feel might be  errorbefore you pass judgment and sully the words shared that are meant to bless others, ask for clarification. 

There are some here, myself included, who long to not only walk closer to the Lord and to walk as an overcomer of all sin in their hearts, but who want to share with others the HOW of holiness. The church has been silent on this subject for so long that sin has taken root in people’s lives and unbelief with it. Holiness today is looked at as a “goal” we cannot achieve. In fact, we have slipped so far from the core belief that without holiness, no one will see God that many believe that to try to follow close after God is “working for our salvation” so we are just going to trust grace and go through the motions till we get raptured our of here. which is absolutely ludicrous. 

I pray you see your error. Your fears are justified as to false teachings, but Satan has gotten you to throw the baby out with the bath water, shutting yourself off from truth meant to restore that which the canker worm has eaten from His bride. 

God is not coming back for a church that has its doctrines tied up with neat little bows but lacks the fruits of the Spirit that come from abiding in Him. Something must first happen and happen it will. The only question for each one of us is, can we admit we need such an awakening and will we humble ourselves and cry out for Him to “do it for us”. (Ezekiel 36:37)

I love you brother, and pray you finally see that we are on your side. I want what you want. I may be doing it in a different manner than you, but I pray you believe that. 

Blessings, Gids

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8 minutes ago, Gideon said:

Brother, why is it that you assume from a brother using specific words such as experience and love and awakening that this must mean they are part of the delusion? Are you convinced that we as the true church are displaying God to a world desperate to see Christianity waked out in front of them, and not just hear our mantra that Christians aren’t perfect, just forgiven?   

Do you really think that at present that we as His church are walking in love towards one another at present?

Do you think we  are walking in all God can possibly give us so there is no need to exhort and encourage brothers and sisters to go deeper in the Lord, experiencing Him in a far greater way than we are at present,  where joy is real and victory is as well?

Do you think we as His bride is actually ready to meet Him and that we do not need to be awakened to our desperate plight, with secret sins lurking in our hearts, with unbelief that God can actually keep us from falling and actually cause us to walk in real victory over the world the flesh and the devil. 

I want you to consider the possibility that you are incorrect in judging those here who talk about such things, especially when they give no sign of being a part of the things you so fear. There is plenty to warn about here.... hardened spirits, lack of patience, unkind words, doctrinal correctness without fruits of the Spirit. And yet you are strangely silent towards these occupancies, choosing instead to concentrate on your ‘trigger words’.  

Again, if you have specific questions when you hear certain words or phrases from myself or others that you feel might be  errorbefore you pass judgment and sully the words shared that are meant to bless others, ask for clarification. 

There are some here, myself included, who long to not only walk closer to the Lord and to walk as an overcomer of all sin in their hearts, but who want to share with others the HOW of holiness. The church has been silent on this subject for so long that sin has taken root in people’s lives and unbelief with it. Holiness today is looked at as a “goal” we cannot achieve. In fact, we have slipped so far from the core belief that without holiness, no one will see God that many believe that to try to follow close after God is “working for our salvation” so we are just going to trust grace and go through the motions till we get raptured our of here. which is absolutely ludicrous. 

I pray you see your error. Your fears are justified as to false teachings, but Satan has gotten you to throw the baby out with the bath water, shutting yourself off from truth meant to restore that which the canker worm has eaten from His bride. 

God is not coming back for a church that has its doctrines tied up with neat little bows but lacks the fruits of the Spirit that come from abiding in Him. Something must first happen and happen it will. The only question for each one of us is, can we admit we need such an awakening and will we humble ourselves and cry out for Him to “do it for us”. (Ezekiel 36:37)

I love you brother, and pray you finally see that we are on your side. I want what you want. I may be doing it in a different manner than you, but I pray you believe that. 

Blessings, Gids

Bruder  gids .    If what I said above ,  if what I warned above ,  if what I exhorted above ,  DID NOT SEND a good warning and exhortation INTO YA SOUL.

THEN my advice is start fresh .   Something happened along the way .    Okay , cause I was not once naming any names .  I JUST simply warned what is coming and even now is building to come against the TRUE CHURCH that clung to DOCTRINE and NOT FEELINGS .     I wasn't saying one word about you, not me , or anyone .

NOW if this is not unctionning you ,    SOMETHNG has went wrong .   And all I NOW am asking is ,  LETS GET THAT FOCUS ON THE BIBLE NOW and ASAP NOW .

FEELINGS alone are no good .      WE NEED BIBLICAL SOUND SERRIOUS < GRAVE AND COMPASSIONATE BIBLE DOCTRINE AS THE FOCUS .

ANYONE can say THEY FOLLOW JESUS .  YOU KNOW THAT .   YOU DO .     Emotions , feelings ,  words are empty , IF THEY NOT FOCUSED ON THE WORD and WHAT THE WORD
when it became FLESH TUAGHT .     GILBERT so many are in dire danger.     And feelings aint gonna cut anything , in fact feelings often get folks deceived bad and real bad.

THE ORIGINAL PATTERN TUAGHT BY THE ORIGINAL APOSTELS ,    INCLUDING PAUL ,   IS WHAT WE MUST ALL OUT < FULL OUT < FOCUS ON NOW .

OR many will just get and are getting deceived .  ITS A MONSTER GIDEON and it aint taking names ,   ITS TAKING ALL CAPTIVE NOW that are not in that lambs book of life .

NOW we need to get busy preaching and teaching and reaching , JUST LIKE THE APOSTELS DID .   SAME PATTERN , SAME GRAVITY ,SAME GODLY and HOLY FEAR .

SAME EVERYTHING they taught .   not a verse here or their .  THE WHOLE PATTERN.   GIDOEN ,  GIDEON   its here , and ITS A MOSNTER IN SIZE NOW .

and the early church never made it THIER ENTIER MISSION to keep telling the church about SOME END TIME AWAEKING .  THEY DID NOT MAKE THAT THEIR MISSION .

IN FACT ,   in fact ,  ALL THOSE SEASONED MEN WARNED ABOUT CONCERNING the END TIMES ,  was DELUSOIN , was beware when they say PEACE

was beware that seducers BOHT IN and outside the CHURCH were going to explode in both number and the delusions would in fact get only WORSE and WORSE AND WORSE

till it came to the point of an all out full force falling away and an all out STRONG DELUSOIN from which if a man went under , ITS TOO LATE .

NOW lets armour up and lets preach the WHOLE COIN OF TRUTH , not parts , not some , BUT ALL OF IT .  DO IT AND DO IT WITH EVERY SENSE OF URGENCY TO GET THE lost

won to JESUS FAST and to get the church BUILT UP ON SOLID SOUND DOCTRINE so it wont to tossed to and fro by deceiving men who allure sensually .    ARMOUR UP .

ARMOUR UP ALL OF US .   ALL OF US NOW ,   a monster under the guise of love peace and unity , IS GAINING IN THE HEARTS OF ALL MEN AND ALL RELIGOINS NOW .

 

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On 6/23/2018 at 2:00 AM, MadHermit said:

When I was 16, I  endured an epic faith crisis.  Through church leaders, I encountered the spiritual shallowness of prominent church leaders.  Through diligent Bible study, I sought greater intimacy with God, but instead was appalled by perceived errors in Scripture.  The gifts of the Spirit exercised in my church struck me as the product of psychological manipulation and wishful thinking.  No one ever endured a more prolonged passionate longing for God to make Himself real than me in those days.  Then I made the  fateful decision to give God one last chance.  I attended a weeklong series of camp meetings in eastern Manitoba.

At first, I thought I'd made a big mistake.  The services in the large outdoor amphitheater seemed shallow.  I tarried at the altar after the services to seek God's face, but found myself resisting the temptation to succumb to an emotional  catharsis fueled by wishful thinking.  Then on Tuesday,  I went for a 7 mile walk on a country road, during which I poured out my doubts and emptiness to God.  I was on the brink of agnosticism.  In desperation I promised God that if He made Himself real to me, I'd be willing to pay any price to serve Him with all my heart.  After my long walk, I was famished, and so, I went to the camp cafeteria to eat.  But then I was inspired by the unprecedented impulse to fast instead and put my meal money in the evening offering.  I  was bored by the evening service and at its conclusion I went forward, alone, to seek God at the front.  I waited and waited, depressed, expecting nothing, and determined not to conjure a false mystical experience.

Then it happened.  I felt a warm breeze, which at first I thought was a natural breeze coming off the nearby lake.  I soon realize that this was the supernatural breeze of a Holy Spirit outpouring.  I found myself involuntarily speaking in tongues at the top of my voice.  More importantly, I was engulfed by wave after wave of liquid love, each more powerful than the last.  This became so intense that I feared it would kill me!   At 0ne point it seemed like my mind was on the verge of ceasing to exist and be absorbed into God's mind!  It was hundreds of times more intense an experience of divine tenderness, sweetness, affection, and power than I have ever experienced before or since.  The lights had been dimmed, but a spectator would later tell me she watched in awe as my face glowed radiantly in the dark.  A Lutheran pastor took it upon himself to interrupt me and tell me that he didn't believe in speaking in tongues, but I simply touched him gently on the forehead and he just exploded in tongues!

God spoke to me through this experience, saying, "You crave answers to many questions, but right now answers aren't good for you.  They will cause you to live too much in your head.  What I want you to do is just live the big questions until they lead you to the center of my heart."  Almost immediately, my grades dramatically improved and at graduation I was awarded scholarships for having the highest GPA in the province of Manitoba.  The Spirit had assured me of this honor in the days after my experience.  I also received the gift of "the word of knowledge," which I often exercised.  More importantly, I fell in love with the Jesus I was disillusioned with and, after my BA, pursued an MDiv (Princeton) and doctorate in NT, Judaism, and Greco-Roman culture (Harvard), so that I could live the big questions just as God commanded me.  Hardly a day goes by when I don't draw spiritual nourishment from the memory of that magical life-changing day, even though I long ago severed all ties with Pentecostalism over doctrinal differences.  I'm sobered by the realization that, were it not for that fateful appointment with God, I probably would no longer be a Christian.

Thank you for sharing such a beautiful and sacred experience. I started out as a cessationist until someone challenged me to compare such teaching with Scripture. Once I did, I became willing to receive what God had for me. I am so glad I did! The fellowship of the Holy Spirit has brought me to a deeper level of intimacy with the Lord. Additionally, this closeness with God brings discernment, for Jesus stated that He would "guide us into all truth" (John 16:13). 

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2 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Bruder  gids .    If what I said above ,  if what I warned above ,  if what I exhorted above ,  DID NOT SEND a good warning and exhortation INTO YA SOUL.

THEN my advice is start fresh .   Something happened along the way .    Okay , cause I was not once naming any names .  I JUST simply warned what is coming and even now is building to come against the TRUE CHURCH that clung to DOCTRINE and NOT FEELINGS .     I wasn't saying one word about you, not me , or anyone .

NOW if this is not unctionning you ,    SOMETHNG has went wrong .   And all I NOW am asking is ,  LETS GET THAT FOCUS ON THE BIBLE NOW and ASAP NOW .

FEELINGS alone are no good .      WE NEED BIBLICAL SOUND SERRIOUS < GRAVE AND COMPASSIONATE BIBLE DOCTRINE AS THE FOCUS .

ANYONE can say THEY FOLLOW JESUS .  YOU KNOW THAT .   YOU DO .     Emotions , feelings ,  words are empty , IF THEY NOT FOCUSED ON THE WORD and WHAT THE WORD
when it became FLESH TUAGHT .     GILBERT so many are in dire danger.     And feelings aint gonna cut anything , in fact feelings often get folks deceived bad and real bad.

THE ORIGINAL PATTERN TUAGHT BY THE ORIGINAL APOSTELS ,    INCLUDING PAUL ,   IS WHAT WE MUST ALL OUT < FULL OUT < FOCUS ON NOW .

OR many will just get and are getting deceived .  ITS A MONSTER GIDEON and it aint taking names ,   ITS TAKING ALL CAPTIVE NOW that are not in that lambs book of life .

NOW we need to get busy preaching and teaching and reaching , JUST LIKE THE APOSTELS DID .   SAME PATTERN , SAME GRAVITY ,SAME GODLY and HOLY FEAR .

SAME EVERYTHING they taught .   not a verse here or their .  THE WHOLE PATTERN.   GIDOEN ,  GIDEON   its here , and ITS A MOSNTER IN SIZE NOW .

and the early church never made it THIER ENTIER MISSION to keep telling the church about SOME END TIME AWAEKING .  THEY DID NOT MAKE THAT THEIR MISSION .

IN FACT ,   in fact ,  ALL THOSE SEASONED MEN WARNED ABOUT CONCERNING the END TIMES ,  was DELUSOIN , was beware when they say PEACE

was beware that seducers BOHT IN and outside the CHURCH were going to explode in both number and the delusions would in fact get only WORSE and WORSE AND WORSE

till it came to the point of an all out full force falling away and an all out STRONG DELUSOIN from which if a man went under , ITS TOO LATE .

NOW lets armour up and lets preach the WHOLE COIN OF TRUTH , not parts , not some , BUT ALL OF IT .  DO IT AND DO IT WITH EVERY SENSE OF URGENCY TO GET THE lost

won to JESUS FAST and to get the church BUILT UP ON SOLID SOUND DOCTRINE so it wont to tossed to and fro by deceiving men who allure sensually .    ARMOUR UP .

ARMOUR UP ALL OF US .   ALL OF US NOW ,   a monster under the guise of love peace and unity , IS GAINING IN THE HEARTS OF ALL MEN AND ALL RELIGOINS NOW .

 

Brother, what you are not seeing is that your own actions are so purposed on filling people with fear of erring by wanting to be more fruitful, and to walk in more victory, and being awakened to experience God in a more intimate way that you are actually fighting against the Lord’s purpose. 

It is not coincidence in my mind that Therese warning always are given to any post mentioning being more loving, or walking in a deeper place with God, or being awakened as to how to walk in victory when saints are struggling. 

You have several times made it clear in a way that you name no names, that you object to things being shared, and by way of attaching the unnamed to known false beliefs, you indirectly accuse them of doing wrong when the only evidence you have is your suppositions based upon your own fears of these false teachings. 

Whether  you intend it or not, you are casting arrows at good brothers, and yet you simply do not see it or will or admit it. Is God’s truth not greater than the lies being spread by false teaching movements? Are we not told that God’s sheep will not follow another? Why the sounding of fear then? Simply declare what God promises to do, keep us from falling and cause us both to will AND to do of His good pleasure, and the sheep will respond. Amen? 

Blessings, 

Gideon

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8 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Hi, Please allow me to question the opening sentence  and premise; "Knowning God personally is that which the human heart craves for."

I must say I wonder about that one's accuracy. It has been declared within both the Old testament as well as the New Testament that men do not seek God. None are righteous.

Seems to me the human heart, the natural person not only does not crave God, instead it flat out rejects His authority, sovereignty, and even his existence.

Personally I think  it is necessary to start from there, an acknowledgement of the denial of God by every natural man and then denial of his sovereignty, and not the presumption that man craves God.

Sure, but it’s the first two sentences that make up the premise, so let’s look at the first two sentences and see if they are accurate? 

“Knowning God personally is that which the human heart craves for. Whether people acknowledge it or not.”

First we need to differentiate between what a man seeks after, and what his heart craves for. For it is quite evident that a man seeks after many things that he thinks will bring satisfaction to his heart. Than after he has achieved that goal and discovers that it does not bring satisfaction to his heart, than he thinks that maybe this other thing will bring satisfaction to his heart. When it does not, he thinks for still something else. Than he achieves that, and once again his heart is not satisfied. This happens again and again.  Why? It is because his heart is craving after something that he knows not what. 

Since it is true that every craving can only be satisfied by that which it craves after, nothing else will satisfy it.  And the human heart has a God shaped hole in it that will only be satisfied when it is filled by God Himself. All other things will not bring it satisfaction. Try as man might to find something that will satisfy his heart, he will only end in frustration. This is what we see in all the world. Humanity trying to fill this craving after what it knows not. 

Why is this?

As was stated above. It is because only the thing that the craving craves for will satisfy or stop the craving. The craving can only be brought to an end by being satisfied by receiving that which it craves after. The proof that man’s heart craves after God is simply that nothing else will bring man’s heart to rest and stop it from looking elsewhere for it knows not what. 

Much love in Christ, Not me 

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9 hours ago, Neighbor said:

Hi, Please allow me to question the opening sentence  and premise; "Knowning God personally is that which the human heart craves for."

I must say I wonder about that one's accuracy. It has been declared within both the Old testament as well as the New Testament that men do not seek God. None are righteous.

Seems to me the human heart, the natural person not only does not crave God, instead it flat out rejects His authority, sovereignty, and even his existence.

Personally I think  it is necessary to start from there, an acknowledgement of the denial of God by every natural man and then denial of his sovereignty, and not the presumption that man craves God.

I would suspect this to be true of those fitted for destruction, but the sheep, are they not drawn to the voice of the Shepherd? How would any come to the Lord unless there is a drawing inside them to the light of Christ that those who love darkness more than the light do not possess? 

I think all men look for things like love, security, protection, purpose, but the elect are drawn deeper and deeper until they reach the understanding that all that they seek is found in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ reigning over them.The tares seek those things as well for the most part, but self love prevents them from looking away from themselves to find it in another. 

Blessings, Gideon

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It is hard for me to isolate doctrine from personal experience. I do find they are reconciled if I understand that  man is depraved, and does not want anything to do with a god outside of himself, the only desire being to be in charge oneself of one's personal environment. And that man has no understanding of God the Holy Spirit, Jesus who is God, nor God the Father, three persons one God, except that the Holy Spirit reveal it all to him.

It is said by many a Christian that atheists do not exist, that there is, to borrow the term, "a craving for God" even in the atheist.  I declare I had no such craving, not ever. I was an atheist, one without theistic need, desire, or even awareness. I was totally self sufficient, completely without need of deity in any sense of the word. Yet God the Holy Spirit revealed Jesus and turned me about to my own repentance in a matter of moments, come the time for me to be brought into the "fold" of the Good Shepherd.

There simply was no desire In my heart nor mind to have such an experience, certainly no craving, no heart shaped hole in my heart of emotions, nor in my spirit. Didn't matter to God what I thought I knew nor wanted  or didn't acknowledge, nor want. He answered the prayer of saints that had prayed for my salvation, and that was that. I had no possible way to deny the Holy Spirit's call  to me personally. Not this side of personal sanity anyway.

 I do think it is a mistake so many believers make- the thinking that an atheist really isn't an atheist, and that they must believe in something, some creating force. It just isn't so. I lived in the midst of religion, schmoozed with pastors, priests of all sorts of many gods, and rabbis, near daily for many years, yet never ever had a craving for anything having to do with deity. Deity just did not exist. Didn't bother me that some others believed in a god or even gods, that was their business.

 The good news is it just didn't matter what I thought- God is sovereign, His will is done.  I was so fortunate as to have many a saint  pray for me along the years, especially my grandmother who though paralyzed in her sick bed would read the Bible to me and pray for me as a small child. At the time it was not effective upon me, instead it was scary because she would get excited, and would rant in a somewhat paralyzed tongue that I could not understand. Instead  I think  I feared that, not understanding her paralysis very well. None the less, God answers prayer and he did call on me via the Holy Spirit who revealed Jesus to me. That left me with no other choice, but to turn about,  repent, and become very rapidly a bond-servant of  Jesus.

My awareness and my salvation is all of the work of God, and none of my own desire, nor work. It was done by God without my having hardly a bit of doctrinal awareness, and certainly no awareness of what a bond-servant is. Anyway, it is grand to have been turned about and to have fellow saints to call brother and sister in the Lord Jesus.

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7 hours ago, Neighbor said:

It is hard for me to isolate doctrine from personal experience. I do find they are reconciled if I understand that  man is depraved, and does not want anything to do with a god outside of himself, the only desire being to be in charge oneself of one's personal environment. And that man has no understanding of God the Holy Spirit, Jesus who is God, nor God the Father, three persons one God, except that the Holy Spirit reveal it all to him.

It is said by many a Christian that atheists do not exist, that there is, to borrow the term, "a craving for God" even in the atheist.  I declare I had no such craving, not ever. I was an atheist, one without theistic need, desire, or even awareness. I was totally self sufficient, completely without need of deity in any sense of the word. Yet God the Holy Spirit revealed Jesus and turned me about to my own repentance in a matter of moments, come the time for me to be brought into the "fold" of the Good Shepherd.

There simply was no desire In my heart nor mind to have such an experience, certainly no craving, no heart shaped hole in my heart of emotions, nor in my spirit. Didn't matter to God what I thought I knew nor wanted  or didn't acknowledge, nor want. He answered the prayer of saints that had prayed for my salvation, and that was that. I had no possible way to deny the Holy Spirit's call  to me personally. Not this side of personal sanity anyway.

 I do think it is a mistake so many believers make- the thinking that an atheist really isn't an atheist, and that they must believe in something, some creating force. It just isn't so. I lived in the midst of religion, schmoozed with pastors, priests of all sorts of many gods, and rabbis, near daily for many years, yet never ever had a craving for anything having to do with deity. Deity just did not exist. Didn't bother me that some others believed in a god or even gods, that was their business.

 The good news is it just didn't matter what I thought- God is sovereign, His will is done.  I was so fortunate as to have many a saint  pray for me along the years, especially my grandmother who though paralyzed in her sick bed would read the Bible to me and pray for me as a small child. At the time it was not effective upon me, instead it was scary because she would get excited, and would rant in a somewhat paralyzed tongue that I could not understand. Instead  I think  I feared that, not understanding her paralysis very well. None the less, God answers prayer and he did call on me via the Holy Spirit who revealed Jesus to me. That left me with no other choice, but to turn about,  repent, and become very rapidly a bond-servant of  Jesus.

My awareness and my salvation is all of the work of God, and none of my own desire, nor work. It was done by God without my having hardly a bit of doctrinal awareness, and certainly no awareness of what a bond-servant is. Anyway, it is grand to have been turned about and to have fellow saints to call brother and sister in the Lord Jesus.

Thank you for sharing a bit of your testimony. It’s always nice to hear how God has drawn and worked in another believers life. I rejoice with you, that when God called on you, you answered the call. 

I too have a hard time isolating doctrine from personal experience. I find it best to learn doctrine by experience. But that’s a conversation for another time. Blessings to you. 

Much love in Christ, Not me

Edited by Not me
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3 hours ago, Yowm said:

My experience paralleled that of Neighbor, as an agnostic I had no thoughts, no fear, no desire or craving for God.

Thank you also for sharing a bit of your testimony, always enjoy reading how God has worked in another believers life. It is a wonder that you do not see or realize that the human heart is a restless craving until it finds it’s rest in God. But as one believers growth is different than another’s.  What matters is Christ being formed in the believer. 

Quote

Perhaps your experience told you otherwise but experience is a poor foundation to learn doctrine from.

Seeing how scripture does teach;

“the letter kills, but it’s the Spirit that gives life” 

and again;

“that the Carnal mind can not understand or grasp the things of God.”

It teaches that, if a persons only understanding of scripture,  is by the letter or with his Carnal mind his understanding is not as it should be. 

And again; 

Is it not true that Paul’s  experience on the road to Damascus was a great experience that was the foundation or starting point of Christ being formed in him?  Though all believers do not have such a great experience with God, each believer  will find God to the degree that his heart searches after Him. For again scripture says; “you will find me when you search for me with all your heart”. It is with the heart man searches for God, all other searching for God will end in frustration till he searches for God with his whole heart. 

Much love in Christ, Not me. 

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