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Only the Dead in Christ Return With Him


Philadelphianlady

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On 6/30/2018 at 6:58 PM, Philadelphianlady said:

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 is very clear.

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

I don't understand where the pre-trib. notion started, but the Bible is quiet clear. Only those already with Him, are returning with him, not those alive Christians caught up in some secret rapture having nothing to do with the return of Christ. The rapture has to do with HIS RETURN.

 

Turin Shroud, says it all, Toynbee Idea, Resurrect Dead on Planet Jupiter

https://i.imgur.com/Mm4M2g1.jpg

Hebrews 1:1-5

God completed his Measurement in the New Universe, (his native environment), and then God Created the Judgment Program

PAUSE

God created Man in his Image, with a form of Glory, and to signify that was the case, God allowed "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", and God revealed his Angels and talked very loosely about the Perfection in Jesus

PAUSE

God created Jesus in the Image of Man (Lower than the Angels) (God came in the likeness of Men), and to signify that was the case, God no longer blessed for payment of sin "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", furthermore, God commanded his Gospel to go into all the Nations of the World to reveal, the coming judgment of the end of all sin and wickedness with men before God...............and God revealed that if the Angels brought this Judgment Program, then Jesus brought the Completion of the Judgment Program

PAUSE

God completes this Measurement of Men (The Angels and the Living Jesus was the 1st Judgment.............The Locusts and the Risen Body of Jesus is the 2nd Judgment), and God reveals the sin and death of those that have taken PLEASURE AND PRIDE in the taking of, "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", more then the renewal of the spirit through the walk of faith, or the chastisement of the heart through his word, both individually and generationally.

..................

..................

So we are both clear now?  God is everlasting, God is omnipresent, and God does not need Angels, Jesus, or the slaves of men..................yet because God is righteous and tends to do good, you have  this judgment program created out of thin air, but this is only temporary, and from the beginning, God was created to his own means and God was left to his own means, and he has intended a portion for the faithful in his doings.

..................

..................

The Generations of Sin, there is no respect of persons, does not have a legal right to live, does not have a legal right to reproduce, and cannot and will not cooperate in society, and cannot and will not live with the relationship of "Joseph the Blessings", it will die quickly, think of this as a kind of "quantum constant" like the force of light by degree and intensity relative to the source.......................the more dead work and dead flesh there is the less of this relationship there will be, and the less of a portion of this generation if only, for the new universe, and earths.

..................

..................

When God reveals the "RISEN JESUS", the Temple Stones, then, "THE DEAD IN CHRIST RISE ALSO", they cannot live or cooperate with God in this form anymore else it is to say (BLASPHEMY AGAINST THE HOLY GHOST).

..................

..................

1. You lost the Seventy Year in 2017, nothing happened.

2. The last 7 Years if God does not react, then it is global death, humanity will be lobotomized, you will not remember who you are, what you were, you will just be created here and there, with a new language and things to do

..................

..................

3. Final Year to 2024, everything is finished, or if God is not finished, that is 7000 Days to 2020, which is to say, 49 Years from 2017 or "7 Weeks/Years for 49 Years" (God indicates that we have more time, so this will follow a logical argument, if nothing happens, then everything is resolved in 70 and 7 years, there's no indications from god so far, that is good for us, the faithful)

..................

..................

Everything will be resolved in 2020 perhaps with nothing happening at all, that means everyone dies, no nothing, 5 months are reserved for God's Work only.  There is no indication of anything else, so far, no indications of noting at all, only the suffering of Moses, whoever he is, whereever he is right now, this is good for the faithful, this indicates that God is still saving people, christians and many alike.

..................

..................

Literal, your PRE-TRIB = 9/11/2001

Edited by Gibbus
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On 8/20/2018 at 3:47 PM, Gibbus said:

 

Turin Shroud, says it all, Toynbee Idea, Resurrect Dead on Planet Jupiter

https://i.imgur.com/Mm4M2g1.jpg

Hebrews 1:1-5

God completed his Measurement in the New Universe, (his native environment), and then God Created the Judgment Program

PAUSE

God created Man in his Image, with a form of Glory, and to signify that was the case, God allowed "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", and God revealed his Angels and talked very loosely about the Perfection in Jesus

PAUSE

God created Jesus in the Image of Man (Lower than the Angels) (God came in the likeness of Men), and to signify that was the case, God no longer blessed for payment of sin "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", furthermore, God commanded his Gospel to go into all the Nations of the World to reveal, the coming judgment of the end of all sin and wickedness with men before God...............and God revealed that if the Angels brought this Judgment Program, then Jesus brought the Completion of the Judgment Program

PAUSE

God completes this Measurement of Men (The Angels and the Living Jesus was the 1st Judgment.............The Locusts and the Risen Body of Jesus is the 2nd Judgment), and God reveals the sin and death of those that have taken PLEASURE AND PRIDE in the taking of, "wives/eunuchs/animal sacrifices/feast and observances/church intercessions", more then the renewal of the spirit through the walk of faith, or the chastisement of the heart through his word, both individually and generationally.

..................

..................

So we are both clear now?  God is everlasting, God is omnipresent, and God does not need Angels, Jesus, or the slaves of men..................yet because God is righteous and tends to do good, you have  this judgment program created out of thin air, but this is only temporary, and from the beginning, God was created to his own means and God was left to his own means, and he has intended a portion for the faithful in his doings.

..................

..................

The Generations of Sin, there is no respect of persons, does not have a legal right to live, does not have a legal right to reproduce, and cannot and will not cooperate in society, and cannot and will not live with the relationship of "Joseph the Blessings", it will die quickly, think of this as a kind of "quantum constant" like the force of light by degree and intensity relative to the source.......................the more dead work and dead flesh there is the less of this relationship there will be, and the less of a portion of this generation if only, for the new universe, and earths.

..................

..................

When God reveals the "RISEN JESUS", the Temple Stones, then, "THE DEAD IN CHRIST RISE ALSO", they cannot live or cooperate with God in this form anymore else it is to say (BLASPHEMY AGAINST THE HOLY GHOST).

..................

..................

1. You lost the Seventy Year in 2017, nothing happened.

2. The last 7 Years if God does not react, then it is global death, humanity will be lobotomized, you will not remember who you are, what you were, you will just be created here and there, with a new language and things to do

..................

..................

3. Final Year to 2024, everything is finished, or if God is not finished, that is 7000 Days to 2020, which is to say, 49 Years from 2017 or "7 Weeks/Years for 49 Years" (God indicates that we have more time, so this will follow a logical argument, if nothing happens, then everything is resolved in 70 and 7 years, there's no indications from god so far, that is good for us, the faithful)

..................

..................

Everything will be resolved in 2020 perhaps with nothing happening at all, that means everyone dies, no nothing, 5 months are reserved for God's Work only.  There is no indication of anything else, so far, no indications of noting at all, only the suffering of Moses, whoever he is, whereever he is right now, this is good for the faithful, this indicates that God is still saving people, christians and many alike.

..................

..................

Literal, your PRE-TRIB = 9/11/2001

If you had a point, I missed it.

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3 hours ago, Philadelphianlady said:

If you had a point, I missed it.

1000 Years (Book of Job ... accounting book = Book of Genesis) (Book of Eternity) (Book of Enoch)

(God limits himself to Judge the Good and Evil, and thus Create, "Heaven/Jesus/Angels")

......................

1000 Years (Book of Zechariah ... accounting book = Book of Ezekiel) (Book of Damnation) (Book of Kings)

(God limits his payment for sin to reveal the Good and Evil to Men, and thus, delivers the Body of Jesus out of the Churches)

......................

1000 Years (Book of Hebrews ... accounting book = Book of Revelation) (Book of Life) (Book of Jasher/Urantia Books)

(God presents the finished work, that is revealed as the "Risen Jesus, which is from God a Lamb Slain, but to us, the new temple stones)

 

Linear Statement (those genetic lines don't have a legal right to, "Minister, Reproduce, or Live" ... they are alive only in man's war with God ... God concludes this "Spiritual War", with the "Sign of Divorce" rebuke, then there's no accusation ... just the end of life processes for the unclean, and those with them) (Nightly Walk and Euthanasia, also in broad daylight, then you have the problem of their public servants, promoting suicide, all of this will be revealed soon)

1. God calls himself the "Fire" that Establishes the, Tree of Life (Exodus 3:2)

2. God calls himself the "Messiah/Revealed that the "Tree of Life was Living")" (Exodus 3:4)

3. God calls himself the "Memorial" (Heaven/Jesus/Angels, created to be destroyed, and the dead with them) (Exodus 3:15

At the same time God reveals this to Moses, God is restating Hebrews 1:1-3 (Hebrews 1:1-3, is Book of Job, Book of Zechariah, Book of Revelation ... for those 3 verses).

The Premise is simple, the Gospel's Law is designed to afford the Equal Potential God has in view, but for those falling short, God kills them all when God kills Jesus/Angels/Heaven, since God has no need for those, as he clearly states.  (Until God reacts several versions of his Second Coming are Valid.  However, your not entitled to anything beyond 5 months, that means nothing at all, only validates that statement ... ... ... 2011,2012,2017,2019 ... ... ... were the lynchpins to invalidate that, but since nothing happened, we'll just have to keep watch) (Nightly Walk, City Hall Philadelphia, tonight for Euthanasia, don't think I forgot, I just managed to finish all my errans today, for those suicides).

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1 hour ago, Gibbus said:

God created Jesus in the Image of Man

Hi Gibbus.....

You do know that Jesus was NOT created, right?

Neither is He made in the image of man.

He is the Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, He is the Word made flesh, He is the Righteousness of God, Image of the invisible God, the Light of the world, the Anointed One, the Good Shepherd, the Bread of Life, our Healer and Forgiver, He is the Way and the Truth and the Life, He is the Resurrection and  Life, He is the Prince of Peace, He is Sinless and Holy.........and much more

To say He is created....well, that's just blasphemy!

YOU SAID...." God kills them all when God kills Jesus/Angels/Heaven, since God has no need for those, as he clearly states. 

Please.....enough with the nonsense. ( I would say "enough with this crap", but I don't think it's polite on this forum, otherwise I would )

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On 9/6/2018 at 6:34 PM, Gibbus said:

1000 Years (Book of Job ... accounting book = Book of Genesis) (Book of Eternity) (Book of Enoch)

(God limits himself to Judge the Good and Evil, and thus Create, "Heaven/Jesus/Angels")

......................

1000 Years (Book of Zechariah ... accounting book = Book of Ezekiel) (Book of Damnation) (Book of Kings)

(God limits his payment for sin to reveal the Good and Evil to Men, and thus, delivers the Body of Jesus out of the Churches)

......................

1000 Years (Book of Hebrews ... accounting book = Book of Revelation) (Book of Life) (Book of Jasher/Urantia Books)

(God presents the finished work, that is revealed as the "Risen Jesus, which is from God a Lamb Slain, but to us, the new temple stones)

 

Linear Statement (those genetic lines don't have a legal right to, "Minister, Reproduce, or Live" ... they are alive only in man's war with God ... God concludes this "Spiritual War", with the "Sign of Divorce" rebuke, then there's no accusation ... just the end of life processes for the unclean, and those with them) (Nightly Walk and Euthanasia, also in broad daylight, then you have the problem of their public servants, promoting suicide, all of this will be revealed soon)

1. God calls himself the "Fire" that Establishes the, Tree of Life (Exodus 3:2)

2. God calls himself the "Messiah/Revealed that the "Tree of Life was Living")" (Exodus 3:4)

3. God calls himself the "Memorial" (Heaven/Jesus/Angels, created to be destroyed, and the dead with them) (Exodus 3:15

At the same time God reveals this to Moses, God is restating Hebrews 1:1-3 (Hebrews 1:1-3, is Book of Job, Book of Zechariah, Book of Revelation ... for those 3 verses).

The Premise is simple, the Gospel's Law is designed to afford the Equal Potential God has in view, but for those falling short, God kills them all when God kills Jesus/Angels/Heaven, since God has no need for those, as he clearly states.  (Until God reacts several versions of his Second Coming are Valid.  However, your not entitled to anything beyond 5 months, that means nothing at all, only validates that statement ... ... ... 2011,2012,2017,2019 ... ... ... were the lynchpins to invalidate that, but since nothing happened, we'll just have to keep watch) (Nightly Walk, City Hall Philadelphia, tonight for Euthanasia, don't think I forgot, I just managed to finish all my errans today, for those suicides).

Sorry, still too esoteric to hold my interest.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Philadelphianlady said:

Sorry, still too esoteric to hold my interest.

 

 

(The Unfaithful will die, believing that Jesus will Return = Only the Dead Return with Jesus)

(We which are alive, and remain, with Jesus Already, will be Caught up in the Clouds, understand? We have Jesus Already, and do not Await his Return)

(Statements Translated into Prophecy) ("Jesus in the Clouds Revealed" = Already Done)

1. God Observed 62 Weeks/430 Years of Hebrews under Egypt ... God observed 2300 Days of Plagues ("Jesus Clouds/Plagues")

2. God Observed 69 Weeks/480 Years from Nehemiah's Wall to Jesus in Jerusalem ... God observed 2300 Days from Birth of Jesus to Jerusalem ("Jesus Clouds/Star Bethlehem)

3. God Observes "One Week", Seven Years Only, and we are told this Seven Year Period is Divided into two, that is it has a "Middle of the Week" .................. We are not to use "2300 Days" (7yrs.)....................... "1290 and 1335" (7yrs) is Divided into Two, it has a Middle ...................... Flight 370 (Jesus in the Clouds) to 70th Year (9/23/2017), then 1335 Days to the Work of God and Jesus for 153 Days (Humanity is not allowed to live)

................

................

Think  this Way ................... Jesus Crucified 29 B.C. ................. then God used "1260/42 Years" as the "Middle of the Week" to 70 A.D. .......................... Jesus Confirmed the Covenant for the New Testament with his Ministry ........................ God only gives us two figures "1290 and 1335" to use for the "One Week of Daniel" 9:27, and one half of that is 1290 or 1335 ....................... to say that "1260 is the Middle of the Week" and therefore 42 Years, is adding to the gospel's law of Daniel, that God did not modify.

................

................

I'm not being a false witness, but I made things clear, that, the Gentiles claim that God did not give us "1290 and 1335", to answer Daniel, but they claim God gave us 1260/42 Years to answer and that is false, not true.

................

................

I'm voice the argument as intelligent interjection with the Gospel's Law, based on a "unity" between Scientific Measurement/Creation, and the Gospel's Claims ........................... God does not give "Scientific Measurement/Creation" any credibility because, Creation is destroyed first with the DEAD IN CHRIST, and those saved by God through Jesus remain and that is a mystery, not for flesh and blood.

................

................

May 21, 2011 + 2300 Days to 9/23/2017

Flight 370 + 1290 Days to 9/23/2017 + 1335 Days to May 21 to October 21 for 153 Days

Humanity is dead during the 153 Days, God does not allow you to perform a work of any kind

................

................

Without understanding the full situation of Scientific Theory that is imposed falsely against Prophecy, where and when do we limit, the our additions to the gospel, if God does not use 1260/42 for the 70th Year Marker only "1290 and 1335" before and after.

................

................

Halley's Comet 2060 A.D. based on 42 Years + 70 Years, with 1290 Days before the 70th Year and 1260/42 years after the 70the Year ................... IS VIOLATION ...................... of  the Gospel's law that says 1290 Days before and 1335 Days after the 70th Year.

................

................

(At the same time Jesus is sown into our Hearts and Jesus completes our Walk of Faith, God sends forth a Great Deception for the Wicked, and they will always wait for Jesus return until they die ..................... my answer about 2060 A.D. is honest and sincere, as Science has tried to tie Astrology and Creation to the Bible, but God does not acknowledge that ....................... all of this will be resolved on 12/21/2018 ...................... (with nothing happening at all) (perhaps with nothing happening at all)

................

................

(God is not being a "False Witness" remember, the, sons of man are used only to facilitate assisted suicide, in pain for pain, and this is already for many generations ..................... that is satan's answer to the "dead work and dead flesh" issue ....................... you have to eliminate lots by nuclear weapons, if you have even a small change of discernment of 200,000,000 in god revealing his hand, but given the timetable that is vanity ....................... you have suicide with moses until you die, and you have terrorism, thats all) (not to worry, instead of god taking the living that are left over, God just fills in the blanks, remember the less you have in knowledge and doctrine from this dying world full of contention with god, the better the judgment turns out, you need god to perform a lobotomy, complete cleansing for the new generations, otherwise god may not do that)

................

................

(clearly the arguments were false anyway, but, 12/21/2018 is a much better answer, and its not the Straight Answer God gives us, its a turncoated answer, that requires a lot of work, a lot of logical assessment and calculations, the gospel never mentions) (we'll see soon) (Every sign and prophecy fails just like the gospel says) (these people committed mass suicide already by using any measure of force agains Moses, how much better to cut their lives short spiritually for the benefit of the faithful, if and when nothing happens at all, is God the enemy of Moses or the beloved? we'll have to see on 12/21/2018)

Edited by Gibbus
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On 9/16/2018 at 2:42 AM, Gibbus said:

(The Unfaithful will die, believing that Jesus will Return = Only the Dead Return with Jesus)

(We which are alive, and remain, with Jesus Already, will be Caught up in the Clouds, understand? We have Jesus Already, and do not Await his Return)

(Statements Translated into Prophecy) ("Jesus in the Clouds Revealed" = Already Done)

1. God Observed 62 Weeks/430 Years of Hebrews under Egypt ... God observed 2300 Days of Plagues ("Jesus Clouds/Plagues")

2. God Observed 69 Weeks/480 Years from Nehemiah's Wall to Jesus in Jerusalem ... God observed 2300 Days from Birth of Jesus to Jerusalem ("Jesus Clouds/Star Bethlehem)

3. God Observes "One Week", Seven Years Only, and we are told this Seven Year Period is Divided into two, that is it has a "Middle of the Week" .................. We are not to use "2300 Days" (7yrs.)....................... "1290 and 1335" (7yrs) is Divided into Two, it has a Middle ...................... Flight 370 (Jesus in the Clouds) to 70th Year (9/23/2017), then 1335 Days to the Work of God and Jesus for 153 Days (Humanity is not allowed to live)

................

................

Think  this Way ................... Jesus Crucified 29 B.C. ................. then God used "1260/42 Years" as the "Middle of the Week" to 70 A.D. .......................... Jesus Confirmed the Covenant for the New Testament with his Ministry ........................ God only gives us two figures "1290 and 1335" to use for the "One Week of Daniel" 9:27, and one half of that is 1290 or 1335 ....................... to say that "1260 is the Middle of the Week" and therefore 42 Years, is adding to the gospel's law of Daniel, that God did not modify.

................

................

I'm not being a false witness, but I made things clear, that, the Gentiles claim that God did not give us "1290 and 1335", to answer Daniel, but they claim God gave us 1260/42 Years to answer and that is false, not true.

................

................

I'm voice the argument as intelligent interjection with the Gospel's Law, based on a "unity" between Scientific Measurement/Creation, and the Gospel's Claims ........................... God does not give "Scientific Measurement/Creation" any credibility because, Creation is destroyed first with the DEAD IN CHRIST, and those saved by God through Jesus remain and that is a mystery, not for flesh and blood.

................

................

May 21, 2011 + 2300 Days to 9/23/2017

Flight 370 + 1290 Days to 9/23/2017 + 1335 Days to May 21 to October 21 for 153 Days

Humanity is dead during the 153 Days, God does not allow you to perform a work of any kind

................

................

Without understanding the full situation of Scientific Theory that is imposed falsely against Prophecy, where and when do we limit, the our additions to the gospel, if God does not use 1260/42 for the 70th Year Marker only "1290 and 1335" before and after.

................

................

Halley's Comet 2060 A.D. based on 42 Years + 70 Years, with 1290 Days before the 70th Year and 1260/42 years after the 70the Year ................... IS VIOLATION ...................... of  the Gospel's law that says 1290 Days before and 1335 Days after the 70th Year.

................

................

(At the same time Jesus is sown into our Hearts and Jesus completes our Walk of Faith, God sends forth a Great Deception for the Wicked, and they will always wait for Jesus return until they die ..................... my answer about 2060 A.D. is honest and sincere, as Science has tried to tie Astrology and Creation to the Bible, but God does not acknowledge that ....................... all of this will be resolved on 12/21/2018 ...................... (with nothing happening at all) (perhaps with nothing happening at all)

................

................

(God is not being a "False Witness" remember, the, sons of man are used only to facilitate assisted suicide, in pain for pain, and this is already for many generations ..................... that is satan's answer to the "dead work and dead flesh" issue ....................... you have to eliminate lots by nuclear weapons, if you have even a small change of discernment of 200,000,000 in god revealing his hand, but given the timetable that is vanity ....................... you have suicide with moses until you die, and you have terrorism, thats all) (not to worry, instead of god taking the living that are left over, God just fills in the blanks, remember the less you have in knowledge and doctrine from this dying world full of contention with god, the better the judgment turns out, you need god to perform a lobotomy, complete cleansing for the new generations, otherwise god may not do that)

................

................

(clearly the arguments were false anyway, but, 12/21/2018 is a much better answer, and its not the Straight Answer God gives us, its a turncoated answer, that requires a lot of work, a lot of logical assessment and calculations, the gospel never mentions) (we'll see soon) (Every sign and prophecy fails just like the gospel says) (these people committed mass suicide already by using any measure of force agains Moses, how much better to cut their lives short spiritually for the benefit of the faithful, if and when nothing happens at all, is God the enemy of Moses or the beloved? we'll have to see on 12/21/2018)

2300 days is only a little over 6 years. The plagues in Egypt were not for that long. The only mention of 2300 evenings and mornings/days was referring to the reign of Antiochus Epiphanes IV.

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On 9/16/2018 at 11:38 PM, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

It is important to know that the Apostle Paul was not speaking of rain CLOUDS hanging in the heights, as many think.

It is important to know that these CLOUDS have nothing to do with RAIN CLOUDS hanging in the heights, but nothing at all, absolutely nothing. But has with special and celestial environment, as follow:

Exodus 34:v.4-6 - synthesis:
And Moses hewed two tables of stone like unto the first; and Moses rose up early in the morning, and went up unto mount Sinai, as the Lord had commanded him, and took in his hand the two tables of stone;
And the Lord descended in the CLOUD, and stood with Moses and passed by before Moses, and Moses proclaimed the name of the Lord:  The Lord, The Lord God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth.

Numbers 11:24-25 & 12:5-10

24 And Moses went out, and told the people the words of the Lord, and gathered the seventy men of the elders of the people, and set them round about the tabernacle.
25 And the Lord came down in a CLOUD, and spake unto him, and took of the spirit that was upon him, and gave it unto the seventy elders: and it came to pass, that, when the spirit rested upon them, they prophesied ... 
12:v.5 And the Lord came down in the pillar of the CLOUD, and stood in the door of the tabernacle, and called Aaron and Miriam: and they both came forth.
6 And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, I the Lord will make myself known unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream.
7 My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the SIMILITUDE of the Lord shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?
9 And the anger of the Lord was kindled against them; and he (the Lord) departed.
10 And the CLOUD departed from off the tabernacle; and, behold, Miriam became leprous, white as snow: and Aaron looked upon Miriam, and, behold, she was leprous.


Exodus 19:7-11 &  14-16 -  (What is written in this portion of Scriptures, reveals unto us what will happen now, in the third Day after Christ): 

7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the Lord commanded him.
8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the Lord hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the Lord.
9 And the Lord said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick CLOUD, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the Lord.

10 And the Lord said unto Moses, Go unto the people, and sanctify them to day and to morrow, and let them wash their clothes,
11 And be ready against the third day: for the third day the Lord will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.
14 And Moses went down from the mount unto the people, and sanctified the people; and they washed their clothes.
15 And he said unto the people, Be ready against the third day: come not at your wives.
16 And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick CLOUD upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that was in the camp trembled.


Mat.17:1-7
And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
5 While he yet spake, behold, a BRIGHT CLOUD overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the CLOUD, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.   (Moses had a good knowledge about that CLOUD)
6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.
7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid.
8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only.


Acts 1:9-11
9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a CLOUD received Him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up (TO THE THIRD HEAVEN), behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven (INTO THE THIRD HEAVEN), shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. (the third)

Understand Philippians 3:20-21
20 Our conversation is in heaven (2nd heaven); from whence (yea, from 2nd heaven) also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: 
21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body, according to the working whereby He is able even to subdue all things unto Himself.

The CLOUD that appeared in the Old Testament to Moses and to the people of Israel, is the same that appeared on the mount where JESUS was with His three disciples, Peter and John and James, and will appear again in the return of our Lord JESUS Christ in this third Day . The kingdoms of THIS WORLD are become the kingdoms of our Lord and His Christ, and He will reign for ever and ever from now on.  The nations will be angry.

Yea, the nations will be angry, but God's wrath is come against the idolaters and wicked nations, and also the time of the dead, that they should be Judged, through the Judgment Seat of Christ, and that should give reward unto His servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear His name, small and great; and should destroy them which destroy the earth.  

And they will say to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of Him that sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, for the great Day of His wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
And the temple of God will be opened in heaven, and there will be seen in His temple the ark of His testament: there will be lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and earthquake, and great hail. 

This same Jesus, which was taken up from the disciples in the beginning  into heaven (INTO THE THIRD HEAVEN), will so come in like manner as they did see JESUS go into heaven (the third heaven).
 
 

Today, more than ever before do we realize by experience what the "cloud" is. It is the glory of God.

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3 hours ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Yes, you have a good understanding and interpretation of the Holy Scriptures, surely. 

It is important to know that the Apostle Paul was not speaking of rain CLOUDS hanging in the heights, as many think.

It is important to know that these CLOUDS have nothing to do with RAIN CLOUDS hanging in the heights, but nothing at all, absolutely nothing. But has with special and celestial environment, as you are interpreting it.  Within this special and celestial environment, "the Lord himself shall descend from heaven (3rd heaven) with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first.  Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the *AIR: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.(1The.4:V.16-17)

*AIR is not the physical space where the high clouds are hanging, absolutely, this is a materialist interpretation, but is the high third celestial or heavenly environment, much more high than this in which we are living now. I am referring to the third CELESTIAL PLACE in Christ, that is the Kingdom of God, as is written in Ephesians 1:v.3. Check it.   Note that our conversation is in heaven, from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body, according to the working whereby He is able even to subdue all things unto Himself, as is written in Philippians 3:v.20-21. Check it.

Well, Paulç Apostle revealed unto us, saying : Romans 8:18-25

 

18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,

21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.

22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.

23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

Get ready.

An old pastor of mine, Dr. Jack Hayford, walked into the parish one Saturday when the church was only 18 members and there was a silvery mist (cloud) in the center. A voice came out of the cloud and said "I will fill this place with my glory."

 

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On 6/30/2018 at 7:13 PM, Daniel 11:36 said:

"I don't understand where the pre-trib. notion started, but the Bible is quiet clear. Only those already with Him, are returning with him, not those alive Christians caught up in some secret rapture having nothing to do with the return of Christ. The rapture has to do with HIS RETURN"

 

Read it again .... both the dead in Christ and the living believers are caught up together .... in a instant, in the twinkling of an eye

The dead are already with Him,the living are changed to like those(who have died) coming with

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