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How to interpret the Old Testament/covenant?


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38 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

No you are mistaken in memory or simply in error as to what was said. Please read what he wrote! Read his book "Christian Love Story" described on Amazon  as "The beautiful story of the wedding customs of Israel in Messiah's time and how He fulfilled these traditions in calling out His Bride, the Church. A striking and inspiring example of Scriptural logic and elegance."  https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Love-Story-Zola-Levitt/dp/1930749260?SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-d-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=1930749260 

Or at https://store.levitt.com/study/CLS as printed or Ibook or Kindle

- No I'm not mistaken. I was shocked when I heard him say it. At which point in his ministry he said it or wrote something different I can't say.

God is already married to Israel. - Jer.3

Although God gave Israel a Certificate Of Divorce Away From Him He said He is Still Married to Israel. - Jer.3:8

"Return Oh backsliding Children for I Am Married To You."

- Jesus doesn't not marry The 144,000 Of All The Tribes Of The Children Of Israel. They are 'The Friends Of The Bridegroom'.

He will be their King in The Davidic Kingdom on this Regenerated earth for 1,000 yrs.

 

Edited by RevelationWriter
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 Read His books, read his letters on the Zola Archives, read the full text of the writings  at the links  posted within this thread.  Perhaps you didn't hear what you heard. For what you  declare and now re-affirm is totally inconsistent with the many writings of Zola over time.

34 minutes ago, RevelationWriter said:

No I'm not mistaken. I was shocked when I heard him say it. At which point in his ministry he said it or wrote something different I can't say.

Hi, I believe you are sure you heard it

The record of his writings, his presentations, his direct commentary on that subject state he said otherwise and are still present today  declaring  what He said and what he wrote.  Perhaps reading them will be of some help.

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1 hour ago, Neighbor said:

 Read His books, read his letters on the Zola Archives, read the full text of the writings  at the links  posted within this thread.  Perhaps you didn't hear what you heard. For what you  declare and now re-affirm is totally inconsistent with the many writings of Zola over time.

Hi, I believe you are sure you heard it

The record of his writings, his presentations, his direct commentary on that subject state he said otherwise and are still present today  declaring  what He said and what he wrote.  Perhaps reading them will be of some help.

 

 

I have all of Zola’s books and this one about the Jewish wedding comparison was always my favorite.....there are enough parallels in it to make a Believer out of anybody who had a lick of sense...... Neighbor has his facts straight in this debate.....EVERYBODY should get this book....it is amazing ......btw, do yourself a favor and go to Zola’s site and check out his “ Go tell it on the mountain “ series .you can thank me later....lol

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10 hours ago, Neighbor said:

 Read His books, read his letters on the Zola Archives, read the full text of the writings  at the links  posted within this thread.  Perhaps you didn't hear what you heard. For what you  declare and now re-affirm is totally inconsistent with the many writings of Zola over time.

Hi, I believe you are sure you heard it

The record of his writings, his presentations, his direct commentary on that subject state he said otherwise and are still present today  declaring  what He said and what he wrote.  Perhaps reading them will be of some help.

- So you don't think he could've changed his mind at anytime about what he believed?

- I don't need to read his books I have the bible.

- If you'd like to post something you like that he said I'd be willing to discuss it with you.

 

 

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1 hour ago, RevelationWriter said:

If you'd like to post something you like that he said I'd be willing to discuss it with you.

 

Already did. and no I need not all that much more on the subject his weritings refute your memory. What more can i say? Anyone may look at his writings plus read his pamphlet and book on th esubject and compare what you state he spoke and what his own hand has written more than once, that is enough.

Sorry that you cannot bring yourself to read what he wrote.  Having the Bible to read is not going to provide a record of his statements anymore than it will provide a record of what you sincerely think you heard.

As for me I did check, I did read, I have given evidence and links to that evidence and I have reached my own conclusion. Long as anyone interested may do the same I am satisfied and am moving on fully confident  what Zola wrote is what Zola would have spoken.

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The Old and New Testament is like wings. You need both to fly. A Testament is a will. The inheritance of the will is only released when there is a death. The jews inhereted the promised land by the death of an sacrificed animal. The natural. They were under the blood of bulls and goats. 

But in the New Testament, our inheritance are handed to us by the death of Jesus in the flesh which is a far better plan by the Holy Ghost. Our Promised Land. 

The Old Testament was a shadow of the real Thing. God was speaking to us through the prophets but was still veiled. 

When Jesus died and the Blood cell was broken, the Life was released in order to come back on the believer. 

When Jesus died, the temple veil was rent in two and the mercy seat came in to plain view which says exactly the same thing as the previous paragraph. 

This means the God of the Old Testament came into plain view when Christ fulfilled all that was spoken of Him. God is the Living Word and Jesus is the Living Word. God was veiled behind the flesh which was Jesus. 

To the true believer God is unveiled. But to the Jews this veil still remains to today. 

So, on his way to Damascus, Paul was struck down by a Great Light. This is the same one that was in the burning Bush, that gave Moses his commission. This Light proclaimed to be Jesus. This was the same Light that Israel followed during the night, ie. the Pillar of Fire. Now revealed to the believer. 

Paul was a scholar of the Old Testament taught by Gamaliel, arguably the best in his day. But up to now it was only letter that killeth. But this Light had everything Paul lacked. For the first time in Paul's life he started to really understand what the Old Testament was all about. 

God picked Paul for a reason. God used Paul in an incredible powerful way. Paul took the Old Testament and started to discect it under this New Light. 

I know many dissagree but I am fully persuaded that it was only after this that Paul could go and set forth and separate law from grace and wrote the book of Hebrews. The Foundation for our Christian faith was laid and today we have the New Testament too. 

Edited by Small Fish
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On 7/14/2018 at 2:40 PM, Tyler S. said:

As the church of gentile Christians living in the ministry of Paul, how should we interpret and keep the Old Testament/covenant? I see many songs and preachers nowadays valiantly proclaiming such encouraging verses as, for example, Exodus 14:14 or Lamentations 3:21-24 to ease peoples mind and praise the lord. If the Old Testament/covenant was written to the Israelite Jews...then how can many of us today, as Christians of the church age, use these verses to worship and encourage and ease minds if these promises were never meant or written to US? Thanks for any advice or responses!

While it is true that some pastors use OT scripture out of context and therefore they are using it incorrectly the general concept of using OT scripture for Christians is a NT declaration

2 Timothy 3  KJV

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

This is why we have the OT books within the Bible.. Because used the correct way they are profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction and instruction in righteousness..

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On 7/13/2018 at 11:40 PM, Tyler S. said:

As the church of gentile Christians living in the ministry of Paul, how should we interpret and keep the Old Testament/covenant? I see many songs and preachers nowadays valiantly proclaiming such encouraging verses as, for example, Exodus 14:14 or Lamentations 3:21-24 to ease peoples mind and praise the lord. If the Old Testament/covenant was written to the Israelite Jews...then how can many of us today, as Christians of the church age, use these verses to worship and encourage and ease minds if these promises were never meant or written to US? Thanks for any advice or responses!

Cutting right to the chase... 

2 Peter 1:20–21 (NASB95)
20 But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, 
21 for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

All scripture came prophetically from the Holy Spirit in this way, therefor this refers to all scripture.  

The Word of God  is not fractured or schismatic as those who try to carve it us suggest (this is for Jews, that is for Gentiles, this is of Jesus , that is of Paul, then there are the Yahwists versus the Elohists in Genesis, and on and on and on)... It comes from a lame attempt in Higher / Lower criticism of the Bible (I'm a bit rusty on this but it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth after all these years... go figure). 

The Word of God applies to all (but not in the same way since circumstances change as the progression of the Word of God increases and with reference to which side of the cross a people exist on). 

I do not believe Tyler S. is willfully engaging in the tactics of some very misled German theologians around the time of Martin Luther... but their poison seeps in through unnoticed. 

We should view the scriptures as a whole and the same Holy Spirit who interprets them as the same Holy Spirit who wrote them. 

The covenants changed on the cross of Christ (Hebrews 9:16-17). And that's what makes the difference (Galatians 3:24-25). 

But it's not as though we cannot benefit from the Old Covenant Schoolmaster... just remember to apply Grace to Law and not Law to Grace.

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@Tyler S.

For the first post: these verses of the OT do apply to us as we as gentiles are now "ingrafted into the vine" because of what Jesus did on the cross, and the OT and NT are of the same perfect Word of God (prophecy*) so the OT applies to the gentiles too.

*The books of the OT prophecy the events of the NT and the books of the NT fulfill the prophecies of the OT.

These verses can ease our minds because of this.

 

@ambc

It used to be "a tooth for a tooth" in the OT but now through Jesus "it is is said a tooth for a tooth but now I say love your enemy" (paraphrase - research that verse).

So why have the OT in this case? With the law we would not know what sin is. OT is a benchmark to know what sin is and the NT is fulfillment of the law through the cross which by grace we receive through faith. Jesus died for our sins.

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Shalom Tyler, 

The TaNaK or Old Testament is vital. The New Testament doesn't make sense without it. As for the relevance, it's all relevant for us to learn. Not all of it talks to the jews, not all of it talks to gentiles. All of it speaks of Messiah. Blatantly and crptically. 

As for the Torah i believe that Father would have us keep all of the Tem Commandments at least, and even more. Not all because some isn't relevant but the Spirit will guide you in these things for you individually is you study and meditate on the Torah. 

But the first and foremost is to love Yahweh and love your neighbour. If you cannot do this, don't bother with the rest. If you can or are trying you best, let the Spirit lead you to the next step.

Make sure motive is not for righteousness though but to please Father, to learn about his ways and to care for others. 

Remember, its a step at a time. Take your time, be open to the Spirit of Yahweh and to change. Remember you are saved by mercy, not by following Torah. Most importantly, love him and your neighbour. The Old Testament and the New Testament highlight this is the whole Torah summarised. The rest of it is "guidance for life". From the Creator of the universe, surely that's worth a constant study! 

Love & Shalom

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