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Alan Hales

Did Jesus go to Hell

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On ‎8‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 1:41 AM, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Alan Hales.

Nope! No error! Mankind is BODY, particularly a BREATHING BODY (a "soul"). The "spirit" is only the BREATH without which we wouldn't be alive. The breath originally came from God puffing a puff of air into the man's nostrils, and the man became a living, air-breather. That's what Genesis 2:7 says, and that's what I believe.

I'm sorry that you've been confused on these definitions for so long, but you're certainly not alone. Most of Christian Theology is BASED upon wrong definitions for these words.

Almost every student of the Bible knows that the OT words for "soul" and "spirit" are "nefesh" and "ruwach," respectively, but we've been taught they don't apply to the animal world. AH, but they DO! BOTH of them are used for animals that breathe air!

Here are a couple of examples:

Genesis 1:24-25 (KJV)

24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature (Hebrew: nefesh = "air-breathing creature") after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so. 
25 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Genesis 7:13-16 (KJV)

13 In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark; 14 They, and every beast after his kind, and all the cattle after their kind, and every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind, and every fowl after his kind, every bird of every sort. 15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath (Hebrew: ruwach = "[the] breath") of life. 16 And they that went in, went in male and female of all flesh, as God had commanded him: and the LORD shut him in.

It's not the usage of either word that distinguishes a human being from a land animal. It's the fact that the human being was made "in the image of God." THAT'S the only difference between them!

I have proved that mankind is Spirit, "Pneuma", Soul, "Psuche" and body, "Soma", 1 Thess 5: 23. So you are in error, And because of your ONE error, You have to give more errors to back up your erroneous beliefs. Look at these facts AGAIN, The "Spirit" in man, is "The Inner part of mankind, along with the soul.  

Spirit, can also mean breath or wind, but you have to put the right meaning in it's right context with the right scripture, Plus, Rev 6: 9 says they are "Soul's" NOT wind. And Rev 7: 9--15, says they are "people", NOT wind. Jesus didn't commend His wind, breath to God, He commended His Spirit, [His innermost part of His], Lk 23: 46. If the spirit is ONLY either wind or breath, how can people be dead and made alive spiritually??. Eph 2: 1 & v5. Your argument is with God and His word.

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6 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Alan Hales.

Sorry, but somehow you've misunderstood me.

Revelation 6:9 is not about people who have died only; the verse is about people who have died and have ALREADY COME BACK TO LIFE. They are once again "souls" which means "air-breathing creatures." It's hard to be an "air-breathing creature" without a body that can breathe air! They are NOT "disembodied souls" (which is an oxymoron and a contradiction in terms).

Revelation 6:9-11 (KJV)

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Why would they have been given white robes if they had nothing on which to put them? How could they cry with a loud voice if they had no vocal chords?

The same can be said about Revelation 7:9-15:

Revelation 7:9-17 (KJV)

9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. 11 And all the angels (messengers) stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.

13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

This "great multitude" or "huge crowd" which no one could count, from all nations, and families, and people, and languages STOOD before the throne and before Yeshua` haKeves Elohiym (Jesus the Lamb of God). Presumably, that means they were ON THEIR FEET! They were ARRAYED (DRESSED) IN WHITE ROBES. Again presumably, that means they had white robes ON THEIR BODIES! The clauses that follow are realized in the New Earth and are found in Revelation 21 & 22:

Revelation 22:1-5 (KJV)

1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. 2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. 3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: 4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads. 5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

Revelation 21:1-3 (KJV)

1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Revelation 21:22-23 (KJV)

22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. 23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

Revelation 21:5-6 (KJV)

5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. 6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

Revelation 21:3-4 (KJV)

3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. 4And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

This is all CERTAINLY after the Resurrection!

Rev 6: 9 cleary says the SOULS were in heaven, Their bodies were killed, and bodies don't go to heaven, They go to the grave. The people in heaven have heavenly clothing on them Just like Moses and Elijah did when they appeared to Jesus, Peter James and John. Paul tells us that we are clothed when we go to heaven 2 Cor 5: 1--8. Also note V8, ABSENT FROM THE BODY. and present with the Lord.  I have told you, Because you have made ONE error, You have to carry on making errors, because you know you can't tell the truth because it will prove you wrong.

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1 hour ago, Alan Hales said:

I have proved that mankind is Spirit, "Pneuma", Soul, "Psuche" and body, "Soma", 1 Thess 5: 23. So you are in error, And because of your ONE error, You have to give more errors to back up your erroneous beliefs. Look at these facts AGAIN, The "Spirit" in man, is "The Inner part of mankind, along with the soul.  

Spirit, can also mean breath or wind, but you have to put the right meaning in it's right context with the right scripture, Plus, Rev 6: 9 says they are "Soul's" NOT wind. And Rev 7: 9--15, says they are "people", NOT wind. Jesus didn't commend His wind, breath to God, He commended His Spirit, [His innermost part of His], Lk 23: 46. If the spirit is ONLY either wind or breath, how can people be dead and made alive spiritually??. Eph 2: 1 & v5. Your argument is with God and His word.

Yes, obviously the analogy of spirit and breath doesn't confine the one to the other. 

John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

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On 8/10/2018 at 3:11 AM, Alan Hales said:

I have proved that mankind is Spirit, "Pneuma", Soul, "Psuche" and body, "Soma", 1 Thess 5: 23. So you are in error, And because of your ONE error, You have to give more errors to back up your erroneous beliefs. Look at these facts AGAIN, The "Spirit" in man, is "The Inner part of mankind, along with the soul.  

Spirit, can also mean breath or wind, but you have to put the right meaning in it's right context with the right scripture, Plus, Rev 6: 9 says they are "Soul's" NOT wind. And Rev 7: 9--15, says they are "people", NOT wind. Jesus didn't commend His wind, breath to God, He commended His Spirit, [His innermost part of His], Lk 23: 46. If the spirit is ONLY either wind or breath, how can people be dead and made alive spiritually??. Eph 2: 1 & v5. Your argument is with God and His word.

Shalom, Alan Hales.

You've done nothing of the sort. You THINK you've proved something but all you've done is quote a verse OUT OF CONTEXT and suggest that each of the three things are equally a part of all human beings, and you think you've "killed a big one." HOWEVER, that's NOT what Paul was saying to the Thessalonikans in  1 Thessalonians 5:23! He's not giving just a shallow list of the parts of human beings! Let's try again: The THEME is sanctification or holiness.

1 Thessalonians 4-5 (KJV)

1 Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. 2 For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. 3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: 4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; 5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: 6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified. 7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness. 8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

9 But as touching brotherly love ye need not that I write unto you: for ye yourselves are taught of God to love one another. 10 And indeed ye do it toward all the brethren which are in all Macedonia: but we beseech you, brethren, that ye increase (in love toward all the brethren) more and more; 11 And that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we commanded you; 12 That ye may walk honestly toward them that are without (outside [Christ]), and that ye may have lack of nothing.

13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him (Jesus). 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent (precede) them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven (from the sky) with a shout, with the voice of the archangel (chief messenger), and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ (in the Messiah) shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. 2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober
7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith (trust in God) and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation (the Rescue; the Deliverance). 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation (rescue) by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

12 And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; 13 And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. And be at peace among yourselves. 14 Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. 15 See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men. 16 Rejoice evermore. 17 Pray without ceasing. 18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. 19 Quench not the Spirit. 20 Despise not prophesyings. 21 Prove (Test) all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly (make you completely clean); and I pray God your whole spirit (your whole words) and soul (air-breathing body) and body (after death) be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ (our Master, Yeshua` the Messiah). 24 Faithful (Consistent; trustworthy) is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

25 Brethren, pray for us.

26 Greet all the brethren with an holy kiss (an Oriental salutation). 27 I charge (order) you by the Lord that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren (all the clean brothers [and sisters]).

28 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen. {The first epistle unto the Thessalonians was written from Athens.}

You said, "Jesus didn't commend His wind, breath to God, He commended His Spirit, [His innermost part of His ...], Lk 23: 46."

Luke 23:46 (KJV)

46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Here's the Greek:

46 Kai fooneesas foonee megalee ho Ieesous eipen, "Pater, eis cheiras sou paratithemai to pneuma mou." Touto de eipoon exepneusen.

46 Kai = 46 And
fooneesas = crying-out-(with)
foonee = a voice
megalee = loud
ho = the
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
eipen, = He-said,
"Pater, = "Father,
eis = into
cheiras = hand
sou = your
paratithemai = I-commend
to = the 
pneuma = breath
mou." = of-me."
Touto = This
de = but
eipoon =having-said
exepneusen. = He-expired/He-breathed-out-(His-last-breath).

Let's look at the other gospels:

Matthew 27:50 (KJV)

50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

50 Ho de Ieesous palin kraxas foonee megalee afeeken ta pneuma.

50 Ho = 50 The
de = but
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
palin = again
kraxas = having-shrieked-(with)
foonee = a-voice
megalee = loud
afeeken = He-sent-away
ta = the
pneuma. = breath.

Mark 15:37 (KJV)

37 And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.

37 Ho de Ieesous afeis fooneen megaleen exepneusen.

37 Ho = 37 The
de = but
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
afeis = having-released
fooneen = a-voice
megaleen = loud
exepneusen. = He-expired/He-breathed-out-(His-last-breath).

John 19:30 (KJV)

30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

30 Hote oun elaben to oxos ho Ieesous eipen Tetelestai, kai klinas teen kefaleen paredooken to pneuma.

30 Hote = 30 When
oun = therefore
elaben = He-took
to = the
oxos = sour-wine
ho = the
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
eipen = said,

Tetelestai, = "Paid-in-full,"
kai = and
klinas = having-bowed
teen = the
kefaleen = head
paredooken = He-gave-from-close-beside/He-delivered-up/He-turned-over
to = the
pneuma. = breath.

What do they all have in common? They all show that Yeshua` gave up trying to breathe. On a cross, a person had to work, lifting themselves up, either by pulling with their arms (pulling on the nails in His wrists) or pushing with their legs (pushing on the nails in His feet), to get enough room in their lungs to take a breath. Yeshua` decided WHEN He would die - not before all things had been accomplished (John 19:28) and not after they forced Him to die by breaking His legs (not a bone of Him was broken, John 19:36).

Your take on Yeshua` commending some "immaterial part of Himself" to God is not only unnecessary, but it also detracts from the activities of the Cross.

ALL of what He was to accomplish, He accomplished ON THE CROSS, not in "Hell" afterward! His BODY was the Sacrifice, not some "immaterial part of Him called a 'soul'!" He was the LAMB OF GOD, GOD'S choice for a LAMB!

Hebrews 10:5-10 (NLT)

5 That is why, when Christ (the Messiah) came into the world, he said to God,

“You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings.
But you have given me a body to offer.
6 You were not pleased with burnt offerings
or other offerings for sin.
7 Then I said, ‘Look, I have come to do your will, O God
as is written about me in the Scriptures.’” (Psalm 40:6-8)

8 First, Christ said, “You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings or burnt offerings or other offerings for sin, nor were you pleased with them” (though they are required by the law of Moses). 9 Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect. 
10 For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.

Also, consider once again Isaiah 53:

Isaiah 53:1-12 (KJV)

1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed?
2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.
3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul (his air-breather) an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
11 He shall see of the travail of his soul (his air-breather), and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul (his air-breather) unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Don't you get it? "His body once offered for all" IS the "soul (air-breather) He poured out unto death!" THAT'S what satisfied the LORD, YHWH, His Father!

 

Now, you asked, "If the spirit is ONLY either wind or breath, how can people be dead and made alive spiritually??. Eph 2: 1 & v5."

The answer is in His RESURRECTION!

Ephesians 2:1-18 (KJV)

1 And you hath he quickened (brought to life), who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit (attitude) that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 Among whom also we all had our conversation (lifestyle) in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us (brought us back to life) together with Christ (with the Messiah), (by grace ye are saved;) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: 7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus (through the Messiah Yeshua`). 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus (in the Messiah Yeshua`) unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11 Wherefore remember, that ye (the Ephesians) being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by that which is called "the Circumcision" in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ (outside of the Messiah), being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus (in the Messiah Yeshua`) ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh (close) by the blood of Christ (there's no "blood" in a "soul" that has supposedly gone to "Hell"). 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off (the Ephesians, the Uncircumcision), and to them that were nigh (the Circumcision). 18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Paul explained this in greater detail in 1 Corinthians 15 (the Resurrection Chapter, btw) when he talks about the "spirit-ual" body vs. the "natural" ("soul-ual") body: This chapter is a study in contrasts!

1 Corinthians 15:42-49 (KJV)

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.

It is sown in corruption (fthora); it is raised in incorruption (aftharsia)
43 It is sown in dishonour (atimia); it is raised in glory (doxee):
it is sown in weakness (astheneia); it is raised in power (dunamei)
44 It is sown a natural body (sooma psuchikon = "an air-breathing body"); it is raised a spiritual body (sooma pneumatikon = "a wind-producing body").

There is a natural body (sooma psuchikon = "an-air-breathing body"), and
there is a spiritual body ([sooma] pneumatikon = "a wind-producing [body]). 45 And so it is written,

"The first man (Adam) was made a living soul (eis psucheen zoosan = a living air-breather)" (Gen.2:7);
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (eis pneuma zoo-opoioun = into a life-giving wind-producer)

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual (a wind-producer), but that which is natural (an air-breather); and afterward that which is spiritual (a wind-producer). 

47 The first man is of the earth (ek gees = "out of earth, dirt, soil, land, ground"), earthy (choikos = "dirt/soil-like"):
the second man is the Lord from heaven (ex ouranou = "out from [the] sky"). 
48 As is the earthy (ho choikos = the-one dirt/soil-like), such are they also that are earthy (hoi choikoi = "the-ones dirt/soil-like") and as is the heavenly (ho epouranios = the-one from-ab0ve-the-sky), such are they also that are heavenly (hoi epouranioi = the-ones from-above-the-sky). 

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy (teen eikona tou choikou = "the image of the-one of-the dirt/soil-like"), we shall also bear the image of the heavenly (teen eikona tou epouraniou = "the image of the-one from-above-the-sky").

"Spiritual" does NOT mean "non-physical," "other-worldly," or "of-the-spirit-dimension" (as christoplatonism would have you believe); it means a STRONG, SUPERHUMAN,"WIND-PRODUCING" body!

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On 8/10/2018 at 3:20 AM, Alan Hales said:

Rev 6: 9 cleary says the SOULS were in heaven, Their bodies were killed, and bodies don't go to heaven, They go to the grave. The people in heaven have heavenly clothing on them Just like Moses and Elijah did when they appeared to Jesus, Peter James and John. Paul tells us that we are clothed when we go to heaven 2 Cor 5: 1--8. Also note V8, ABSENT FROM THE BODY. and present with the Lord.  I have told you, Because you have made ONE error, You have to carry on making errors, because you know you can't tell the truth because it will prove you wrong.

Shabbat shalom, Alan Hales.

Nope. Revelation 6:9 does NOT "clearly" say the "souls were in heaven!" It CLEARLY says that the "souls" (the "air-breathing beings") were "UNDER THE ALTAR" or "AT THE FOOT OF THE ALTAR" (Greek: hupokatoo tou thusiasteeriou = literally "down-under the altar-for-burnt-offerings"). That YOU have to add they were "in heaven" or "without bodies" is YOUR fiction!

Hmphf! "Heavenly clothing!" Ridiculous! Where'd you get THAT piece of nonsense?!

Mosheh and Eliyahuw appeared WITH Yeshua` transformed IN A VISION!

Matthew 16:24-28; 17:1-9 (KJV)

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. 26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here (Peter, James, and John), which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, 2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him. 4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. 5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. 6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.
7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said,
Arise, and be not afraid. 8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only.

9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged (ordered) them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.

Finally, regarding 2 Corinthians 5 (one of my favorite chapters, by the way), READ ON!

2 Corinthians 5:1-10 (KJV)

1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Yes, and "absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord" is EXACTLY how it will feel to one who sleeps in the Messiah! They go to sleep in this life, and - WHAM! - they wake up in the presence of the Lord Yeshua` at the RESURRECTION! The Judgment Seat of Christ is the same thing as the Judgment Seat of the Messiah, the LORD'S (YHWH'S) Anointed One. When He has returned and begun His reign from Jerusalem, THEN He will initiate His Judgment Seat, or didn't you know that one of the jobs of an Israeliy King will be to perform the occupation of a Supreme Court Judge?

Furthermore, we read,

Luke 1:30-33 (KJV)

30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. 31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. 32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: 33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

He won't just reign for "a thousand years" in the Millennium, but His reign will continue FOREVER! The Millennium is just about how long haSatan will be incarcerated within the Bottomless Pit.

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46 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Shabbat shalom, Alan Hales.

Nope. Revelation 6:9 does NOT "clearly" say the "souls were in heaven!" It CLEARLY says that the "souls" (the "air-breathing beings") were "UNDER THE ALTAR" or "AT THE FOOT OF THE ALTAR" (Greek: hupokatoo tou thusiasteeriou = literally "down-under the altar-for-burnt-offerings"). That YOU have to add they were "in heaven" or "without bodies" is YOUR fiction!

Hmphf! "Heavenly clothing!" Ridiculous! Where'd you get THAT piece of nonsense?!

Mosheh and Eliyahuw appeared WITH Yeshua` transformed IN A VISION!

Matthew 16:24-28; 17:1-9 (KJV)

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. 26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here (Peter, James, and John), which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, 2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him. 4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. 5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. 6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.
7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said,
Arise, and be not afraid. 8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only.

9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged (ordered) them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.

Finally, regarding 2 Corinthians 5 (one of my favorite chapters, by the way), READ ON!

2 Corinthians 5:1-10 (KJV)

1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Yes, and "absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord" is EXACTLY how it will feel to one who sleeps in the Messiah! They go to sleep in this life, and - WHAM! - they wake up in the presence of the Lord Yeshua` at the RESURRECTION! The Judgment Seat of Christ is the same thing as the Judgment Seat of the Messiah, the LORD'S (YHWH'S) Anointed One. When He has returned and begun His reign from Jerusalem, THEN He will initiate His Judgment Seat, or didn't you know that one of the jobs of an Israeliy King will be to perform the occupation of a Supreme Court Judge?

Furthermore, we read,

Luke 1:30-33 (KJV)

30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. 31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. 32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: 33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

He won't just reign for "a thousand years" in the Millennium, but His reign will continue FOREVER! The Millennium is just about how long haSatan will be incarcerated within the Bottomless Pit.

How many more times do I have to tell you that, "Spirit" can mean, Breath, Wind, The Holy Spirit or the Spirit of making, [The inner man]. It's the bodies lungs that breath in air, NOT the Soul.  And Rev 6: 9, clearly says the "SOULS" "Psuche" of them that were slain, Dead bodies "Soma" don't breath. As for heavenly clothing, see 2 Cor 5: 1--8, [Vs 1--4]. The Bible proves that the soul doesn't sleep. Lk 16: 22--31. 2 Cor 5: 1--8. Rev 6: 9.

Rev 7: 9--15. You seem to love arguing with God.

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1 hour ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, Alan Hales.

You've done nothing of the sort. You THINK you've proved something but all you've done is quote a verse OUT OF CONTEXT and suggest that each of the three things are equally a part of all human beings, and you think you've "killed a big one." HOWEVER, that's NOT what Paul was saying to the Thessalonikans in  1 Thessalonians 5:23! He's not giving just a shallow list of the parts of human beings! Let's try again: The THEME is sanctification or holiness.

1 Thessalonians 4-5 (KJV)

1 Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. 2 For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. 3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: 4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; 5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: 6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified. 7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness. 8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

9 But as touching brotherly love ye need not that I write unto you: for ye yourselves are taught of God to love one another. 10 And indeed ye do it toward all the brethren which are in all Macedonia: but we beseech you, brethren, that ye increase (in love toward all the brethren) more and more; 11 And that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we commanded you; 12 That ye may walk honestly toward them that are without (outside [Christ]), and that ye may have lack of nothing.

13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him (Jesus). 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent (precede) them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven (from the sky) with a shout, with the voice of the archangel (chief messenger), and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ (in the Messiah) shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. 2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober
7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith (trust in God) and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation (the Rescue; the Deliverance). 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation (rescue) by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. 11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

12 And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; 13 And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. And be at peace among yourselves. 14 Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. 15 See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men. 16 Rejoice evermore. 17 Pray without ceasing. 18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. 19 Quench not the Spirit. 20 Despise not prophesyings. 21 Prove (Test) all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly (make you completely clean); and I pray God your whole spirit (your whole words) and soul (air-breathing body) and body (after death) be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ (our Master, Yeshua` the Messiah). 24 Faithful (Consistent; trustworthy) is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

25 Brethren, pray for us.

26 Greet all the brethren with an holy kiss (an Oriental salutation). 27 I charge (order) you by the Lord that this epistle be read unto all the holy brethren (all the clean brothers [and sisters]).

28 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen. {The first epistle unto the Thessalonians was written from Athens.}

You said, "Jesus didn't commend His wind, breath to God, He commended His Spirit, [His innermost part of His ...], Lk 23: 46."

Luke 23:46 (KJV)

46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Here's the Greek:

46 Kai fooneesas foonee megalee ho Ieesous eipen, "Pater, eis cheiras sou paratithemai to pneuma mou." Touto de eipoon exepneusen.

46 Kai = 46 And
fooneesas = crying-out-(with)
foonee = a voice
megalee = loud
ho = the
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
eipen, = He-said,
"Pater, = "Father,
eis = into
cheiras = hand
sou = your
paratithemai = I-commend
to = the 
pneuma = breath
mou." = of-me."
Touto = This
de = but
eipoon =having-said
exepneusen. = He-expired/He-breathed-out-(His-last-breath).

Let's look at the other gospels:

Matthew 27:50 (KJV)

50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

50 Ho de Ieesous palin kraxas foonee megalee afeeken ta pneuma.

50 Ho = 50 The
de = but
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
palin = again
kraxas = having-shrieked-(with)
foonee = a-voice
megalee = loud
afeeken = He-sent-away
ta = the
pneuma. = breath.

Mark 15:37 (KJV)

37 And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.

37 Ho de Ieesous afeis fooneen megaleen exepneusen.

37 Ho = 37 The
de = but
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
afeis = having-released
fooneen = a-voice
megaleen = loud
exepneusen. = He-expired/He-breathed-out-(His-last-breath).

John 19:30 (KJV)

30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

30 Hote oun elaben to oxos ho Ieesous eipen Tetelestai, kai klinas teen kefaleen paredooken to pneuma.

30 Hote = 30 When
oun = therefore
elaben = He-took
to = the
oxos = sour-wine
ho = the
Ieesous = Yeshua` ("Jesus")
eipen = said,

Tetelestai, = "Paid-in-full,"
kai = and
klinas = having-bowed
teen = the
kefaleen = head
paredooken = He-gave-from-close-beside/He-delivered-up/He-turned-over
to = the
pneuma. = breath.

What do they all have in common? They all show that Yeshua` gave up trying to breathe. On a cross, a person had to work, lifting themselves up, either by pulling with their arms (pulling on the nails in His wrists) or pushing with their legs (pushing on the nails in His feet), to get enough room in their lungs to take a breath. Yeshua` decided WHEN He would die - not before all things had been accomplished (John 19:28) and not after they forced Him to die by breaking His legs (not a bone of Him was broken, John 19:36).

Your take on Yeshua` commending some "immaterial part of Himself" to God is not only unnecessary, but it also detracts from the activities of the Cross.

ALL of what He was to accomplish, He accomplished ON THE CROSS, not in "Hell" afterward! His BODY was the Sacrifice, not some "immaterial part of Him called a 'soul'!" He was the LAMB OF GOD, GOD'S choice for a LAMB!

Hebrews 10:5-10 (NLT)

5 That is why, when Christ (the Messiah) came into the world, he said to God,

“You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings.
But you have given me a body to offer.
6 You were not pleased with burnt offerings
or other offerings for sin.
7 Then I said, ‘Look, I have come to do your will, O God
as is written about me in the Scriptures.’” (Psalm 40:6-8)

8 First, Christ said, “You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings or burnt offerings or other offerings for sin, nor were you pleased with them” (though they are required by the law of Moses). 9 Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect. 
10 For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.

Also, consider once again Isaiah 53:

Isaiah 53:1-12 (KJV)

1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed?
2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.
3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.
9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul (his air-breather) an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
11 He shall see of the travail of his soul (his air-breather), and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul (his air-breather) unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Don't you get it? "His body once offered for all" IS the "soul (air-breather) He poured out unto death!" THAT'S what satisfied the LORD, YHWH, His Father!

 

Now, you asked, "If the spirit is ONLY either wind or breath, how can people be dead and made alive spiritually??. Eph 2: 1 & v5."

The answer is in His RESURRECTION!

Ephesians 2:1-18 (KJV)

1 And you hath he quickened (brought to life), who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit (attitude) that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 Among whom also we all had our conversation (lifestyle) in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us (brought us back to life) together with Christ (with the Messiah), (by grace ye are saved;) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: 7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus (through the Messiah Yeshua`). 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus (in the Messiah Yeshua`) unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11 Wherefore remember, that ye (the Ephesians) being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by that which is called "the Circumcision" in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ (outside of the Messiah), being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus (in the Messiah Yeshua`) ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh (close) by the blood of Christ (there's no "blood" in a "soul" that has supposedly gone to "Hell"). 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby
17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off (the Ephesians, the Uncircumcision), and to them that were nigh (the Circumcision). 18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Paul explained this in greater detail in 1 Corinthians 15 (the Resurrection Chapter, btw) when he talks about the "spirit-ual" body vs. the "natural" ("soul-ual") body: This chapter is a study in contrasts!

1 Corinthians 15:42-49 (KJV)

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.

It is sown in corruption (fthora); it is raised in incorruption (aftharsia)
43 It is sown in dishonour (atimia); it is raised in glory (doxee):
it is sown in weakness (astheneia); it is raised in power (dunamei)
44 It is sown a natural body (sooma psuchikon = "an air-breathing body"); it is raised a spiritual body (sooma pneumatikon = "a wind-producing body").

There is a natural body (sooma psuchikon = "an-air-breathing body"), and
there is a spiritual body ([sooma] pneumatikon = "a wind-producing [body]). 45 And so it is written,

"The first man (Adam) was made a living soul (eis psucheen zoosan = a living air-breather)" (Gen.2:7);
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (eis pneuma zoo-opoioun = into a life-giving wind-producer)

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual (a wind-producer), but that which is natural (an air-breather); and afterward that which is spiritual (a wind-producer). 

47 The first man is of the earth (ek gees = "out of earth, dirt, soil, land, ground"), earthy (choikos = "dirt/soil-like"):
the second man is the Lord from heaven (ex ouranou = "out from [the] sky"). 
48 As is the earthy (ho choikos = the-one dirt/soil-like), such are they also that are earthy (hoi choikoi = "the-ones dirt/soil-like") and as is the heavenly (ho epouranios = the-one from-ab0ve-the-sky), such are they also that are heavenly (hoi epouranioi = the-ones from-above-the-sky). 

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy (teen eikona tou choikou = "the image of the-one of-the dirt/soil-like"), we shall also bear the image of the heavenly (teen eikona tou epouraniou = "the image of the-one from-above-the-sky").

"Spiritual" does NOT mean "non-physical," "other-worldly," or "of-the-spirit-dimension" (as christoplatonism would have you believe); it means a STRONG, SUPERHUMAN,"WIND-PRODUCING" body!

How many more times do I have to tell you that "Spirit" Can mean, Breath, Wind, Holy Spirit and the inner part of mankind, And When Jesus commended His Spirit to God, It Wasn't His wind or breath, It was His inner man. Mankind is Spirit, Pneuma, Soul, Pshuche, and body, Soma. And at death, only the body, Soma dies, The Spirit and soul live on.  Those who die in Christ, will come back from heaven with Jesus to collect there resurrected bodies, 1 Thess 4: 13--16. As for 1 Cor 15: 42--49. You are getting the body mixed up with the soul. When Jesus was on the cross and He said It is finished, He wasn't talking about the work for salvation, Because He had to go to Hell. [Hades], Acts 2: 27--31, and be raised from the dead so our sins can be forgiven, 1 Cor 15: 17--19. And justified. Rom 4: 25.

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53 minutes ago, Alan Hales said:

How many more times do I have to tell you that, "Spirit" can mean, Breath, Wind, The Holy Spirit or the Spirit of making, [The inner man]. It's the bodies lungs that breath in air, NOT the Soul.  And Rev 6: 9, clearly says the "SOULS" "Psuche" of them that were slain, Dead bodies "Soma" don't breath. As for heavenly clothing, see 2 Cor 5: 1--8, [Vs 1--4]. The Bible proves that the soul doesn't sleep. Lk 16: 22--31. 2 Cor 5: 1--8. Rev 6: 9.

Rev 7: 9--15. You seem to love arguing with God.

 

37 minutes ago, Alan Hales said:

How many more times do I have to tell you that "Spirit" Can mean, Breath, Wind, Holy Spirit and the inner part of mankind, And When Jesus commended His Spirit to God, It Wasn't His wind or breath, It was His inner man. Mankind is Spirit, Pneuma, Soul, Pshuche, and body, Soma. And at death, only the body, Soma dies, The Spirit and soul live on.  Those who die in Christ, will come back from heaven with Jesus to collect there resurrected bodies, 1 Thess 4: 13--16. As for 1 Cor 15: 42--49. You are getting the body mixed up with the soul. When Jesus was on the cross and He said It is finished, He wasn't talking about the work for salvation, Because He had to go to Hell. [Hades], Acts 2: 27--31, and be raised from the dead so our sins can be forgiven, 1 Cor 15: 17--19. And justified. Rom 4: 25.

Shabbat shalom, Alan Hales.

You won't "have" to tell me ANY more times. I'm done trying to convince you. "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still" and the corollary is also true: "A man NEVER convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." So, believe what you want to believe. I only hope you will hear the words of Yeshua` the Messiah better, but that will depend upon whether you will recognize Him when He comes.

May the Lord richly bless you.

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12 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

 

Shabbat shalom, Alan Hales.

You won't "have" to tell me ANY more times. I'm done trying to convince you. "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still" and the corollary is also true: "A man NEVER convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." So, believe what you want to believe. I only hope you will hear the words of Yeshua` the Messiah better, but that will depend upon whether you will recognize Him when He comes.

May the Lord richly bless you.

It's a waste of time me truing to tell someone like you who can't understand or won't believe the Biblical Hebrew and Greek for, "Spirit". All I can do is, Tell you what the Bible, Hebrew and Greek say, I can't make you understand or believe it.

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