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Are we destined to sit on the throne of God?


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19 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

I'm not troubled by those scriptures at all........as I explained (and why), as long as we are rightly dividing them.

I haven't thought about His throne in detail before....I see Marilyn C in her post above might have some knowledge of that.  Maybe she would be willing to bring a few scriptures concerning that topic.  All that is coming to mind at the moment is that New Jerusalem is coming down to EARTH and will rule and reign the EARTH, with Christ.  And that in the end, even Jesus will hand the kingdom back over to the Father.

Hi Heleadethme,

I`m glad you are led to think concerning `God`s throne.` The word `throne,` means `authority. Thus we realise that God`s authority is centred in Himself and beyond his created order. No one gave God His authority and all other rule and authority comes from God. Some use it wisely and other are rebellious.

So we have the Godhead (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) as the source. They are of the exact substance of entity in mind, will and heart (John 10: 30). Their entire oneness of being, expressed by omnipotence, omnipresence and omniscience. These capacities obviously we will never have.

The Godhead is the source, - the 3 persons are equal, in unity and of one mind. Then in function we see there is a hierarchy -

The Father - initiates,

The Son - administers,

The Holy Spirit - is the energizing power.    

 

So in relation to rule and authority we see the Son will put down `all rule, and all authority and all power. ......Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who puts all things under Him, that God (the Father) may be all in all.` (1 Cor. 15: 24 & 28)

We tend to think of these that are `rulers, authorities and powers,` as just on earth, however rebellion has gone throughout God`s great kingdom and every throne from the third heaven, through Principalities and Powers to the earth have been in rebellion.

All these `thrones,` authorities to rule, have been ordained and created by the Lord.

`For by Him all things were created, that are in heaven, and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or Principalities or Powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.` (Col. 1: 16) 

Thus, the Lord will occupy every throne/authority in every created realm!

And where will that be from? Leave that for our next discussion as you may want to comment on what I have written.

regards, Marilyn.

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5 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Heleadethme,

I`m glad you are led to think concerning `God`s throne.` The word `throne,` means `authority. Thus we realise that God`s authority is centred in Himself and beyond his created order. No one gave God His authority and all other rule and authority comes from God. Some use it wisely and other are rebellious.

So we have the Godhead (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) as the source. They are of the exact substance of entity in mind, will and heart (John 10: 30). Their entire oneness of being, expressed by omnipotence, omnipresence and omniscience. These capacities obviously we will never have.

The Godhead is the source, - the 3 persons are equal, in unity and of one mind. Then in function we see there is a hierarchy -

The Father - initiates,

The Son - administers,

The Holy Spirit - is the energizing power.    

 

So in relation to rule and authority we see the Son will put down `all rule, and all authority and all power. ......Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who puts all things under Him, that God (the Father) may be all in all.` (1 Cor. 15: 24 & 28)

We tend to think of these that are `rulers, authorities and powers,` as just on earth, however rebellion has gone throughout God`s great kingdom and every throne from the third heaven, through Principalities and Powers to the earth have been in rebellion.

All these `thrones,` authorities to rule, have been ordained and created by the Lord.

`For by Him all things were created, that are in heaven, and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or Principalities or Powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.` (Col. 1: 16) 

Thus, the Lord will occupy every throne/authority in every created realm!

And where will that be from? Leave that for our next discussion as you may want to comment on what I have written.

regards, Marilyn.

Amen, thanks Marilyn.   I agree....the throne of God is allegorical for His authority and rule......and that He has created and delegated authorities as well, under His.  There are those delegated authorities that have rebelled against Him......but His plan is to restore His rule.  (He has already done so in heaven, but it still remains to be manifested on earth in it's fullness, as I understand it.)

Look forward to hearing more about these things, and see if it will help to guide us in how we are to understand the main topic of this thread.

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18 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Amen, thanks Marilyn.   I agree....the throne of God is allegorical for His authority and rule......and that He has created and delegated authorities as well, under His.  There are those delegated authorities that have rebelled against Him......but His plan is to restore His rule.  (He has already done so in heaven, but it still remains to be manifested on earth in it's fullness, as I understand it.)

Look forward to hearing more about these things, and see if it will help to guide us in how we are to understand the main topic of this thread.

Hi Heleadethme,

That`s great we can look into this together. Now most people do think that it is only the rule, the authority, the powers on earth that still have to be restored under the Lord, BUT that is not so. Let me write what I believe, in a diagram and we can talk from there.

Above all - the Godhead - Father, Son and Holy Spirit. (Jesus ascended to the right hand of the Father) Rule, authority over all.

CREATED REALMS

The 3rd heaven - Lucifer, kingpriest, cast out.  Throne vacant.

The Universe - Principalities and Powers, Satan & fallen angels usurped this area.

The earth - The kingdoms of this world. Gentile rebellious rulership.

 

So we can see that each realm has thrones, yet to be restored under Christ. The timing is the Father`s. He is the initiator. When He sends the Lord to earth to gather His Body, then they will all go to the third heaven where there will be a glorious coronation of the Lord as the Highest authority IN the created order, (& not just over it). With Him will be His order of kingpriests, to rule and serve with Him, in the ages to come.

regards, Marilyn.

 

 

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On 9/23/2018 at 4:16 AM, Marilyn C said:

Hi Heleadethme,

That`s great we can look into this together. Now most people do think that it is only the rule, the authority, the powers on earth that still have to be restored under the Lord, BUT that is not so. Let me write what I believe, in a diagram and we can talk from there.

Above all - the Godhead - Father, Son and Holy Spirit. (Jesus ascended to the right hand of the Father) Rule, authority over all.

CREATED REALMS

The 3rd heaven - Lucifer, kingpriest, cast out.  Throne vacant.

The Universe - Principalities and Powers, Satan & fallen angels usurped this area.

The earth - The kingdoms of this world. Gentile rebellious rulership.

 

So we can see that each realm has thrones, yet to be restored under Christ. The timing is the Father`s. He is the initiator. When He sends the Lord to earth to gather His Body, then they will all go to the third heaven where there will be a glorious coronation of the Lord as the Highest authority IN the created order, (& not just over it). With Him will be His order of kingpriests, to rule and serve with Him, in the ages to come.

regards, Marilyn.

 

 

Okay, thanks Marilyn....could you pls bring some scriptures to go along with what you are saying as we go along? 

...I'm not sure if I understand the third heaven very well....only that it is talking about paradise.  Is this (paradise/third heaven) the heaven that we understand is where God dwells and has His throne now (thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven), and where Jesus sits at the right hand of it.

2Co 12:2-4

I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

How that he was caught up into paradise (G3857), and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

 

( the same paradise as these references:

Luk 23:43

And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. (G3857)

Rev 2:7

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise (G3857) of God. )

 

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11 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Okay, thanks Marilyn....could you pls bring some scriptures to go along with what you are saying as we go along? 

...I'm not sure if I understand the third heaven very well....only that it is talking about paradise.  Is this (paradise/third heaven) the heaven that we understand is where God dwells and has His throne now (thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven), and where Jesus sits at the right hand of it.

2Co 12:2-4

I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

How that he was caught up into paradise (G3857), and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

 

( the same paradise as these references:

Luk 23:43

And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. (G3857)

Rev 2:7

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise (G3857) of God. )

 

Hi Heleadethme,

Great, let`s look at this in God`s word.  You said -

...I'm not sure if I understand the third heaven very well....only that it is talking about paradise.  Is this (paradise/third heaven) the heaven that we understand is where God dwells and has His throne now (thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven), and where Jesus sits at the right hand of it.

We see in Hebrews that the third heaven, the angelic realm, has those in the Body of Christ AND the just men, (& women - pre-cross).

`...you have come to Mount Zion and the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the GENERAL ASSEMBLY and church of the first born who are registered in heaven, to God the judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant..` (Heb. 12: 22 - 24)

So we have Mount Zion, the name for God`s rulership in the third heaven. King David ruled from Mount Zion on earth, and that is a picture of God`s authority in the third heaven. Remember that God is Spirit, (John 4: 24) and not seen.

The city, the heavenly Jerusalem, till it is time for it to descend to near the earth. (Rev. 21: 2)

We have the innumerable company of angels, that do God`s bidding. (Heb. 1: 13 & 14)

Then the General Assembly with the Body of Christ, (those who are asleep in Christ - 1 Thess. 4: 14) waiting to have their immortal & incorruptible bodies. (1 Cor. 15: 52 - 54)

And the spirits of Just men (& women) pre-cross, waiting their inheritance. (Heb. 11: 16)

And to Jesus the mediator... who makes intercession for us. (Heb. 7: 25)

Quite a lot is in the third heaven, awaiting God`s timing for their inheritances.

Regards, Marilyn.

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The bible says a lot of stuff. Remember that time when Jesus said the greatest in the kingdom of heaven is like a little child? Chances are people who are spiritually immature would desire to be like a little child.

The idea that we get to sit on "Daddy's throne" is akin to sitting on santa's lap. I seriously don't care.

I'm more interested in the idea that we get to engage in immortal combat in heaven. Space pirate boarding parties, laser guns, and hot women wearing body armor, with beautiful nebulas swirling at the celestial horizon.

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6 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi Heleadethme,

Great, let`s look at this in God`s word.  You said -

...I'm not sure if I understand the third heaven very well....only that it is talking about paradise.  Is this (paradise/third heaven) the heaven that we understand is where God dwells and has His throne now (thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven), and where Jesus sits at the right hand of it.

We see in Hebrews that the third heaven, the angelic realm, has those in the Body of Christ AND the just men, (& women - pre-cross).

`...you have come to Mount Zion and the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the GENERAL ASSEMBLY and church of the first born who are registered in heaven, to God the judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant..` (Heb. 12: 22 - 24)

So we have Mount Zion, the name for God`s rulership in the third heaven. King David ruled from Mount Zion on earth, and that is a picture of God`s authority in the third heaven. Remember that God is Spirit, (John 4: 24) and not seen.

The city, the heavenly Jerusalem, till it is time for it to descend to near the earth. (Rev. 21: 2)

We have the innumerable company of angels, that do God`s bidding. (Heb. 1: 13 & 14)

Then the General Assembly with the Body of Christ, (those who are asleep in Christ - 1 Thess. 4: 14) waiting to have their immortal & incorruptible bodies. (1 Cor. 15: 52 - 54)

And the spirits of Just men (& women) pre-cross, waiting their inheritance. (Heb. 11: 16)

And to Jesus the mediator... who makes intercession for us. (Heb. 7: 25)

Quite a lot is in the third heaven, awaiting God`s timing for their inheritances.

Regards, Marilyn.

God is still ruling and reigning in the third heaven (heaven) though, is He not sister....In the book of Job, Satan and other angels appeared/assembled to present themselves to the Lord, and the devil needed God's permission before He could test Job.  I'm not understanding what throne is vacant in the Third Heaven, if Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father.

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On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 3:18 AM, Heleadethme said:

God is still ruling and reigning in the third heaven (heaven) though, is He not sister....In the book of Job, Satan and other angels appeared/assembled to present themselves to the Lord, and the devil needed God's permission before He could test Job.  I'm not understanding what throne is vacant in the Third Heaven, if Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father.

Goodness sister .   you rose up before the rooster even crowed .  I seen three eighteen Am  .

You loved sister .

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On ‎9‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 6:18 PM, Heleadethme said:

God is still ruling and reigning in the third heaven (heaven) though, is He not sister....In the book of Job, Satan and other angels appeared/assembled to present themselves to the Lord, and the devil needed God's permission before He could test Job.  I'm not understanding what throne is vacant in the Third Heaven, if Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father.

Hi Heleadethme,

Sorry haven`t replied sooner. We are travelling and can`t always get online. Now I have been thinking of your good points, so here are more of my thoughts -

 

So true sister, that God is still and ever will be ruling and reigning over all. God has never abdicated and no one can ever take His place. His is the ultimate authority, as all authority and power resides in Him.

And we know that when all (rebellious) rule and authority and power are put down by our Lord, then everything comes under God, who will be all in all. (1 Cor. 15: 24 - 28)

So....Angels are in the presence of God, in the third heaven, however when Satan is summoned to present himself to God, it is at the `edge` of the universe, (as it were). Evil, (Satan) cannot enter the holy third heaven. Remember that God is omnipresent and can talk to us on earth or to Satan in the universal area.

 

Now to this good point. You said -

I'm not understanding what throne is vacant in the Third Heaven, if Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father.`

When Jesus ascended to the Father we know that Jesus was given authority -

`...far above all principality and power and might and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this age but also in that which is to come...` (Eph. 1: 21)

The Father said to His Son -

`..”Sit at my right hand, till I make your enemies your footstool..` (Ps. 110: 1)

So at the Father`s right hand we read that the Lord Jesus Christ is interceding for His Body.

`Therefore He is able to save to the uttermost those who come to God (the Father) through Him, since He ever lives to make intercession for them.` (Heb. 7: 25)

The glorified Son of God, the Lord Jesus Christ is the High Priest, interceding for believers. He has been given all authority and power, under the Father and is waiting till the Father brings His enemies to His footstool.

Then......the Lord WILL OPERATE in that authority given of the Father.

 

 

Will give you time to digest all that and ask questions or make comments before we go on.

 

 Marilyn.

 

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On 9/28/2018 at 3:05 AM, Marilyn C said:

Then......the Lord WILL OPERATE in that authority given of the Father.

Okay, I am not sure what you mean by this sister.....all authority on heaven and earth has already been given to Jesus:

Mat 28:18-20

And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

I think this passage even shows how we will rule and reign with Him, operating in HIS authority/rulership....for example where Jesus said to His disciples that He has given them authority to tread on snakes and scorpions.  The point I was hoping we could bring to this thread is that sitting on His throne and ruling and reigning with Christ, does not mean that we will rule and reign in our own right and usurp His throne/authority, no indeed. We will rule and reign in union WITH Him and in complete submission to Him.

Anyway, no worries, I understand you are travelling Marilyn.  We can always come back to this later if you like, Lord willing.  Blessing to you in Christ.

 

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