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When do Revelations seals open


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43 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

You are making a doctrine on ONE WORD, when all the rest of the words are against your theory. Anyway, a harpazo does not have to be a violent seizing and catching away.

Acts 8:39: "water, the Spirit of the Lord  caught away Philip, that the eunuch"

Matthew 13:19: "the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart."

Jude 1:23: "save with fear,  pulling them out of the fire; hating"

2 Corinthians 12:4: "How that  he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words,"

It is not logical to make a doctrine from one word, when the other words say something different.

First off, he is not making doctrine on one word.

Secondly, you are making doctrine by changing the meaning of words. Must means must......not what you imagine it means.

 

Rev 4

1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Edited by The Light
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7 minutes ago, The Light said:

First off, he is not making doctrine on one word.

Secondly, you are making doctrine by changing the meaning of words. Must means must......not what you imagine it means.

 

Rev 4

1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

How many times MUST we go over this?

Question: DID God show John things in his (John's) future? Well, DID HE?
Answer: God showed John MANY THINGS that were in John's future - and many things still in OUR future.  Therefore God certainly fulfilled that verse.

Notice again that God did NOT include an "only" as in God would show John ONLY things in the hereafter.  You seem desperate to imagine an "only" in that verse. I wonder why?

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2 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Sorry, RM, but Jesus does NOT return on day 2520. If He did, then everyone would know the day.

Of course everyone knows the day of the Second Coming, its a play by play countdown. 6th Vial = the Armies gathering at Armageddon. Any Christian who has delved into the prophecies understand that Jesus is coming next, at the 7th Vial. The Rapture is the only surprise return, nt the Second Coming.  Day 2520 is the 7th Vial.

2 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Anyway, John shows us the week ending at the 7th vial, then the marriage and supper taking place in heaven BEFORE Jesus returns. I would guess He will return on day 1290 - but it is only a guess.

The Marriage Supper is on earth, it is Armageddon, the Kings Flesh etc. etc. etc. The FOWLS are the Church that return with Christ Jesus. 

2 hours ago, iamlamad said:

You KNOW I disagree on your theory of the seals.  Seals 1-5 are church age. Seal 6 begins end times judgment with the start of the Day of the Lord.

You need to let this go brother. By going down this hole you miss everything God has designed as the Great Middle of the Week fulcrum point. God designed EVERYTHING around day 1260-1261. The Anti-Christ breaks his agreements at that time and Conquers becoming the BEAST. The Dragon is kicked out on day 1261. Jerusalem is Conquered on day 1261. Israel repents via the Two-witnesses just BEFORE the DOTL which happens on day 1261. The 1290 happens 30 days BEFORE the 1260, it is the Abomination of Desolation sign to flee Judea. The 1335 happens before the 1290, it is the Two-witnesses showing up. 

Until you get off the Church is the first 5 seals its a pointless venture for us un reality. Its just not factual brother. 

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8 hours ago, iamlamad said:

How many times MUST we go over this?

I can't answer your question as I have no idea how long it is going to take for you to understand the meaning of MUST BE HEREAFTER.

 

Quote

Question: DID God show John things in his (John's) future? Well, DID HE?
Answer: God showed John MANY THINGS that were in John's future - and many things still in OUR future.  Therefore God certainly fulfilled that verse.

Notice again that God did NOT include an "only" as in God would show John ONLY things in the hereafter.  You seem desperate to imagine an "only" in that verse. I wonder why?

I can see you at the movie theater now. You grab your coke and popcorn and head into the movie only to be stopped by the ticket taker. "Sir, Sir, you MUST have a ticket to enter the movie".

Of course you respond - You are inserting the word only. See that guy and his wife? I saw you take tickets from them. They fulfilled the must requirement. You seem to find a need to insert only to make this business operate. I wonder why?

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16 hours ago, The Light said:

I can't answer your question as I have no idea how long it is going to take for you to understand the meaning of MUST BE HEREAFTER.

 

I can see you at the movie theater now. You grab your coke and popcorn and head into the movie only to be stopped by the ticket taker. "Sir, Sir, you MUST have a ticket to enter the movie".

Of course you respond - You are inserting the word only. See that guy and his wife? I saw you take tickets from them. They fulfilled the must requirement. You seem to find a need to insert only to make this business operate. I wonder why?

Time and time again I have proven to any reader that God certainly fulfilled "must be hereafter." Most of the book is "hereafter" events.

It is sure you are never going to see it the way God sees it. My guess is, you just don't want to.

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14 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Time and time again I have proven to any reader that God certainly fulfilled "must be hereafter." Most of the book is "hereafter" events.

It is sure you are never going to see it the way God sees it. My guess is, you just don't want to.

You simply imagine what you think is going to happen and then change the meaning of words to make it appear possible.

I wonder what your definition for "only" and  "must" and "hereafter" are. And then do you change the meaning to fit the situation?

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22 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

Of course everyone knows the day of the Second Coming, its a play by play countdown. 6th Vial = the Armies gathering at Armageddon. Any Christian who has delved into the prophecies understand that Jesus is coming next, at the 7th Vial. The Rapture is the only surprise return, nt the Second Coming.  Day 2520 is the 7th Vial.

The Marriage Supper is on earth, it is Armageddon, the Kings Flesh etc. etc. etc. The FOWLS are the Church that return with Christ Jesus. 

You need to let this go brother. By going down this hole you miss everything God has designed as the Great Middle of the Week fulcrum point. God designed EVERYTHING around day 1260-1261. The Anti-Christ breaks his agreements at that time and Conquers becoming the BEAST. The Dragon is kicked out on day 1261. Jerusalem is Conquered on day 1261. Israel repents via the Two-witnesses just BEFORE the DOTL which happens on day 1261. The 1290 happens 30 days BEFORE the 1260, it is the Abomination of Desolation sign to flee Judea. The 1335 happens before the 1290, it is the Two-witnesses showing up. 

Until you get off the Church is the first 5 seals its a pointless venture for us un reality. Its just not factual brother. 

You are ignoring chapters 17 and 18 that come between the end of the week and His coming.

You are ignoring John's own words: "the wedding of the Lamb has come"  John did NOT write, "the wedding has almost come; first we have to descend to earth...."  When John writes "has come," it is right then, not some time later.

Next, John wrote, "Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!”  The supper ALWAYS comes after the ceremony. In other words, time has passed, the ceremony is over, and now it is time for the supper.

You are sick; just plain sick - to even IMAGINE the marriage supper is for the birds! Have you never been to a wedding?  Have you never read of the MANY people by now that have been to heaven and SEEN the tables spread - as far as the eye can see? Some have been told the preparations are all done: heaven is only waiting now for the arrival of the Bride of Christ.  You have had many errors but this one tops them all.

I must remind you:

THE GOLDEN RULE OF INTERPRETATION

When the plain sense of the scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense; else you end up with nonsense.

You have taken a verse meant to be taken literally, because it makes perfect sense taken literally, and made it into nonsense.

IN CONTEXT when Jesus said "no man knows the day nor the hour" is certainly talking about His coming AFTER the days of tribulation, or after the 70th week. You are in error yet again.

Day 2520 is the 7th Vial.  Agreed: a great earthquake and NO COMING.

Jerusalem is Conquered on day 1261.  Myth. There is no way you can prove a myth with scripture - there is no scripture for this. The evil spirits sent to gather the nations to Israel are not sent out until the 6th vial, LATE In the week.

the DOTL which happens on day 1261.  More MYTH. Can you ever just take John at his word? The Day of the Lord / Day of His wrath is at the 6th seal which is opened before the BOOK containing the 70th week is opened. 

Israel repents via the Two-witnesses  Sorry, but Israel - those of Israel who WILL repent - will not repent until they SEE with their own eyes the wounds in Jesus hands, feet, and side.  Please, show us any scripture that shows anyone listening and believing the two witnesses.  It is your imagination with human guessing.  We have to stick with scripture, line upon line.

The 1290 happens 30 days BEFORE the 1260  Do you count BACKWARDS? 90 is MORE than 60.

I don't think even Jesus would recognize your take on all these things - because your theories are so far from the written scriptures correctly understood.

In short, we are never going to agree on much. We did agree on ONE THING here. At least you know where the week ends. I wish you knew where it begins.

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5 minutes ago, The Light said:

You simply imagine what you think is going to happen and then change the meaning of words to make it appear possible.

I wonder what your definition for "only" and  "must" and "hereafter" are. And then do you change the meaning to fit the situation?

"hereafter" means to me exactly what it means you to: FUTURE events. God filled most of the book with future events, thus FULFILLING what He said to John.

You insist that John wrote only things hereafter - but you won't admit it.

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6 hours ago, iamlamad said:

You are ignoring chapters 17 and 18 that come between the end of the week and His coming.

 

Not understanding the chronology of the Book of Revelation {BoR} puts one at a total disadvantage, I know, I used to not get it for 25 years. 

Rev. 17 is the Harlot {All False Religion} being destroyed by the 10 Kings of the Beast, thus when the Beast demands to be worshipped as the only God, all other religions {Harlot} will be destroyed {Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism etc. all}. Thus this happens in Rev. ch. 6, when the first Seal is opened, not after Jesus Conquers the Beast and his minions in Rev. 16:17-19, where the Angel cries...IT IS DONE !! 

Rev. 18 is Babylon {WHOLE WORLD} getting hit with the Seal, Trumpet and Vial Judgments over a 42 month period. It starts in Rev. 6 also.

Rev. 19 is about the Marriage and Return, thus it covers the FULL 7 Years in Heaven, then back to earth via Jesus and the Bride. Where Jesus defeats the Beast in Rev. 19, that already happened in Rev. 16:19. IT IS DONE !! 

6 hours ago, iamlamad said:

You are ignoring John's own words: "the wedding of the Lamb has come"  John did NOT write, "the wedding has almost come; first we have to descend to earth...."  When John writes "has come," it is right then, not some time later.

Next, John wrote, "Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!”  The supper ALWAYS comes after the ceremony. In other words, time has passed, the ceremony is over, and now it is time for the supper.

Correct, Rev. 19 is the Raptured Church in Heaven, Marrying the Lamb, then Returning for the Marriage Supper after 7 years in Heaven.

6 hours ago, iamlamad said:

You are sick; just plain sick - to even IMAGINE the marriage supper is for the birds! Have you never been to a wedding?  Have you never read of the MANY people by now that have been to heaven and SEEN the tables spread - as far as the eye can see? Some have been told the preparations are all done: heaven is only waiting now for the arrival of the Bride of Christ.  You have had many errors but this one tops them all.

 

Allow me to weave this together for you to prove the Church/Bride are the FOWLS in Rev. 19.

Matt. 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. 25 Behold, I have told you before. 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Rev. 19 is shown above in so many words, because we are given a CLUE for a reason. Jesus is trying to teach his followers, and the Jews in the end time what to look for and how not to be deceived. The Anti-Christ and False Prophet are going to be doing Miracles, trying to TRICK the Jews into coming out of their SAFE ZONE in the Petra/Bozrah area so he can kill them. And Jesus says IF IT WERE POSSIBLE {its not possible because Jesus WARNED THEM beforehand] the Anti-Christ and False Prophet would TRICK the very Elect Jews who have come unto Christ. We know its the Jews because that is the only ones that the Anti-Christ can't get at, he can get at the Remnant Church {see Rev. 12:17}. 

Since Jesus has warned the Jews who repented beforehand {IN THIS VERY VERSE} the Jews will understand what they need to do, BUT WHY ? Because of the very next verses, he tells them, HEY LOOK, if they tell you I am in the Desert, don't believe it, if they tell you I am in a store room, don't believe it !! Then Jesus tells them EXACTLY where he will come from.......In the EASTERN SKIES !! The Jews in Petra will be looking for Jesus to come in the Eastern Skies, along with us the Church of course.

THEN A BIG CLUE that not many get.....Jesus says that WHEREVER the Carcass is at, that is WHERE the Eagles {Church/Bride} will be gathered at!! Then Jesus says Immediately after the Tribulation he will return [from the Eastern Skies no doubt, with the Church in tow].

Does this MATCH the Rev. 19 Armageddon Marriage Supper ? YES !!

The Marriage happens in Heaven {Rev. 19} we stay there 7 years, then Return on White Horses with Jesus Christ to the Marriage Supper !! Which is Armageddon. As shown in Rev. 19.

Rev. 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords. 17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. 19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

Armageddon IS THE MARRIAGE SUPPER !! We aren't going to eat them, its Symbolic, we have victory over the cowards !! We FEAST on their "look", as the Almighty God takes control, Amen, over those who hate God !!

We are the Eagles mentioned in Matt. 24:28, Jesus gives the Jews a clue where he will show up at....The Marriage Supper Feast.....Armageddon, not in the Desert, not in the Storeroom, etc. etc., but instead the Eagles/Bride/Fowls will be at Armageddon where the Carcass {armies of the Beast} is at. 

The only time we do not know his coming is the Pre trib Rapture, of course everyone knows when the Second Coming is, its 1260 days after the Beast Comes to power. 

Edited by Revelation Man
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2 hours ago, The Light said:

You simply imagine what you think is going to happen and then change the meaning of words to make it appear possible.

I wonder what your definition for "only" and  "must" and "hereafter" are. And then do you change the meaning to fit the situation?

I have changed nothing. I take scripture very literally when it makes sense to do so. I know exactly what hereafter means, and I know God DID (absolutely) show John many many things in the future.

Did you notice that this verse tells us NOTHING about God including some past in with the future. It certainly does not forbid it (although you think it does) Nor does it even mention it at all.

Why is it this scripture bothers you so much?

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