Guest 1sheep Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, Heleadethme said: It's funny how people assume someone is talking about salvation by works just because they are agreeing with obedience. It's not an either/or kind of thing. Obedience doesn't contradict salvation by faith, and salvation by faith doesn't contradict obedience. The word of God is clear....if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction and if you keep on wilfully sinning after coming to a knowledge of the truth, there is NO. MORE. SACRIFICE. FOR SINS. Not me saying this...it's scripture.......SO just obey the Lord and sow to the Spirit then. Your choice. End of argument. I dont see anyone doing that nor do I think its funny. Its devastating actually. It is the heart motivation behind works and obedience that can be unbiblical. If a person is obedient and working to be saved it is not biblical. Salvation by faith works because one is saved and not to be saved. You would be surprised how many believe wrongly and that is why I think that differentiation must be made. We are saved by grace alone in faith alone in Christ alone. We are obedient strivibg for righteoysness because we are saved and not TO BE saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1sheep Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Just now, 1sheep said: I dont see anyone doing that nor do I think its funny. Its devastating actually. It is the heart motivation behind works and obedience that can be unbiblical. If a person is obedient and working to be saved it is not biblical. Salvation by faith works because one is saved and not to be saved. You would be surprised how many believe wrongly and that is why I think that differentiation must be made. We are saved by grace alone in faith alone in Christ alone. We are obedient striving for righteousness because we are saved and not TO BE saved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted October 15, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.89 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 15, 2018 52 minutes ago, Heleadethme said: It's funny how people assume someone is talking about salvation by works just because they are agreeing with obedience. It's not an either/or kind of thing. Obedience doesn't contradict salvation by faith, and salvation by faith doesn't contradict obedience. The word of God is clear....if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction and if you keep on wilfully sinning after coming to a knowledge of the truth, there is NO. MORE. SACRIFICE. FOR SINS. Not me saying this...it's scripture.......SO just obey the Lord and sow to the Spirit then. Your choice. End of argument. That “ no more sacrifice for sins” thing is out of context.Text without context is error.The writer of Hebrews was talking to fence- sitting Jews who wanted to go back to offering sacrifices at the Temple.There was no more sacrifices to be made .It was a waste of time.Jesus gave Himself once for the only Sacrifice needed to satisfy God.To feel the need for a Sacrifice on top of what Jesus accomplished at the Cross is trampling the Blood Of Christ,treating it as useless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted October 16, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted October 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Heleadethme said: It's funny how people assume someone is talking about salvation by works just because they are agreeing with obedience. It's not an either/or kind of thing. Obedience doesn't contradict salvation by faith, and salvation by faith doesn't contradict obedience. The word of God is clear....if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction and if you keep on wilfully sinning after coming to a knowledge of the truth, there is NO. MORE. SACRIFICE. FOR SINS. Not me saying this...it's scripture.......SO just obey the Lord and sow to the Spirit then. Your choice. End of argument. The first part of your post is wonderful, many they quick to Judge, and quick to believe the can read correctly between the lines... Obedience saves, As a matter of fact obedience saves from Hell... This is the obedience that saves from Hell... To obey God who ask us to believe in Jesus Christ. When Jesus was condemn to die on the Cross, God did not say do not condemned Jesus on the Cross, he wanted us to condemn Jesus on the Cross. The Devil was the one who did not want to condemn Jesus on the Cross... Anyway Jesus died, and first off all he cannot reversed that, and he does not want to reversed that no matter what... For many reasons... Jesus mission had a very wide range of proposed, he had a matter to settled , an outstanding matter between him and the Devil, and he had to fullfilled the promise he gave to Adam and Eve at the time of their Judgement at the exit of the Garden, or at their entrance to the world that lied ahead of them, and not only to them, but also to the rest of the humanity to their offsprings: That at the right time he as the "seed of the woman" he will have his day with him, when he will die on the Cross, and will distroy the power of the Devil upon all humanity... And to keep his promise to Abel that he will revence him... He said not against Cain, but against the one who took Abel away from him. He promise to do something to destroy the power of the Devil, his right to take Abel at the time of his death... Abel the righteous and if I can add holy man, witout anysin and witout any disobedience but because of Adam's inherited state of being. If the Devil could take this pure man who can escape from him... All were going to the Devil and no one for God... We see the Devil took everyone, he did not refuse to take Abel because he was pure and said to the Lord this one is your, I will wait for the sinner Cain to die ... Neither God contested the right of the Devil to take the righteous Abel. If someone is knowledgeable as to who Jesus was before he was borned and enter our world through his birth by Mary, he must understand that the Lord God the Creator when he said "the seed of the woman...." he evision him self being born by Mary.... Any way Jesus must take the power of the Devil to take the good and the bad. The Devil did not take the bad only but he took the good , the very good and the bad... So Jesus must take this right from the devil to take the good and not only the good but also the bad and keep them and no one to be abke to take them from him. . So Jesus died not only for all, but also for all the sins for all people...and he Saves everyone who believes in him...-but the devils-because he did not die for the devil- As a man he died to redeemed man from the power of the Devil...his right to take them upon their death... Jesus did not die only for the repented but also the unrepented believers... Jesus did not die for those who asks forgivness but for those who sin and do not ask for forgiveness, so the Devil cannot take from him no one who has believe in him. Even the bad, the very bad, as the Devil before took the good even the very good, as someone like Abel... Now as you said earlier people like to suppress the truth with the fear of stereotyping the meseger with names that do not justice. . I am a repented believer myself because I understand the importance of repentance for my walk in this life, withot Judging Jesus who walked with me in my life of unrepentance and encourage me to repent and he did not grow woerry and did not stopped till I made the step towards repentance... And I am glad for those who believe the repented and the unrepented... And I am not trying to Saved the Saved unrepentant believer, niether I scare the with Hell, and tell them that they are going to Hell, unless they repent because they need to prove and convince to them selfs and others that they believed... I don't want to go further than that and exposed the triks of many upon me, when they find me as a unrepented believer... They prayed for my torment so To have dreams of going to Hell, as to force repentance upon me to avoid Hell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Naturebuff Posted October 16, 2018 Share Posted October 16, 2018 When I was in school, I obeyed my teachers because it is what was expected and I wanted to be a good student. I didn’t love any of my teachers, can’t think of one that I loved (not even close) but I was obedient. In the end we do it out of love or duty and though I am not as obedient as I was as a student in school, my heart and love for Him is more than I could have imagined and I want to please Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 On 10/15/2018 at 4:12 PM, Heleadethme said: It's funny how people assume someone is talking about salvation by works just because they are agreeing with obedience. No, but I am maintaining that the OP is incorrect in asserting that Jesus told him/her that obedience is required to go to Heaven. That is salvation by works and you have been defending that. You have repeatedly disagreed with me when I said that works do not play a part in how we are saved. Quote It's not an either/or kind of thing. Obedience doesn't contradict salvation by faith, and salvation by faith doesn't contradict obedience. The problem occurs when you and the OP assert that obedience is required in addition to faith for salvation. Quote The word of God is clear....if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction and if you keep on wilfully sinning after coming to a knowledge of the truth, there is NO. MORE. SACRIFICE. FOR SINS. Not me saying this...it's scripture.......SO just obey the Lord and sow to the Spirit then. Your choice. End of argument. You are grabbing verses out of context and misapplying them to issues they were not intended to address. Paul was addressing Jews who rejected the Gospel and returned to the OT economy after receiving the knowledge of the truth and for them there remains no sacrifice for sins. "willfully sinning" in Hebrews 10 pertains to sinning against the knowledge of Jesus as the final sacrifice for sin. To know that Jesus was the final sacrifice for sin and willfully returning to the OT sacrificial system was the ultimate in apostacy and pretty much sealed their eternal doom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted October 17, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.89 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted October 17, 2018 What must I do to get into Heaven? I have a young daughter who asks me the same thing.This is what I tell her.Its a simple little thing that is easy for young “ and” old to remember.Believing the following ten words will get you saved forever.If we let one one finger on each hand represent one word it goes like this: These are the five words for one hand—“ Jesus died for my sins.” On the other hand, using each finger to stand for the remaining five words—“Jesus rose from the dead”. Yeah , I know it’s corny, but kids seem to like it and it is something they can remember and carry with them the rest of their lives.Now , for the rest of their lives they can show others in a simple, easy-to-remember way, how they know they are forever saved.The Gospel in a nutshell— Jesus promised this using Paul as His spokesman and all we have to do is believe it and never add anything to it. An adult version of this little game can be found in 1cor15:1-4. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frienduff thaylorde Posted October 17, 2018 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 17 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 13,256 Content Per Day: 5.35 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 62 Joined: 07/07/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/25/1972 Share Posted October 17, 2018 On 10/15/2018 at 2:12 PM, Heleadethme said: It's funny how people assume someone is talking about salvation by works just because they are agreeing with obedience. It's not an either/or kind of thing. Obedience doesn't contradict salvation by faith, and salvation by faith doesn't contradict obedience. The word of God is clear....if you sow to the flesh you will reap destruction and if you keep on wilfully sinning after coming to a knowledge of the truth, there is NO. MORE. SACRIFICE. FOR SINS. Not me saying this...it's scripture.......SO just obey the Lord and sow to the Spirit then. Your choice. End of argument. For what I say to one ,I say to all. For we are servants to whom we obey , whether of sin unto death or of obedience unto Righteousness. So , whose servants are we . sins or Christs . Let us be ever encouraged IN THE LORD . And let us look to Christ for all things . For God has given us a way out of , not some, not even most , but out of any temptation common to man , AND HIS NAME IS CHRIST JESUS , the freer of slaves and breaker of chains of bondage of sin . And HE is able to keep us from falling . ONLY HEED HIS VOICE , HEED THE SPIRIT and not the flesh . And know and understand their is no sin too great That Christ cannot give us the POWER to overcome . But who we OBEY , IS WHOSE SLAVES WE ARE . And this cannot be denied . I will not leave you comfortless , HE IS ALL WE NEED to overcome all evil . But if one believes not this , then where is their faith . LET OUR FAITH BE ONLY IN CHRIST and not in men who would say otherwise . WE GOT ALL WE NEED IN CHRIST and greater is HE than the evil in our felsh . WE have all things IN CHRIST given us freely to walk righteously , godly , holy in this present world . But if a man comes and POINTS NOT to CHRIST who is the ONE who can keep us from falling , this one is unstable and unlearned , knowing only the power of the flesh and thus cannot overcome the evil and will leave the flock in darkness of sin , pointing to NO WAY OUT of that sin . LET US POINT TO JESUS , FOR THE BLOOD OF CHRIST IS sufficient , and in HIM as our guide we shall abound by the grace given us IN CHRIST and overcome and do overcome and will do so unto our end . But if a preach wont teach the POWER due to unbelief , then woe that is one long fall . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frienduff thaylorde Posted October 17, 2018 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 17 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 13,256 Content Per Day: 5.35 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 62 Joined: 07/07/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/25/1972 Share Posted October 17, 2018 (edited) Now to answer the post , State the TRUTH . We are saved by Grace alone through faith in CHRIST ALONE . Their is no trust in our own ability . ONLY the ability given us IN CHRIST by the GRACE OF GOD . FOR THAT IS all we need to overcome the evil . CHRIST . To believe in the one WHOM GOD has sent , CHRIST , who fulfilled all things , and paid the price of sins, and in His body we too are crucified . That we being dead to sin , SHOULD LIVE UNTO RIGHTEOUSNESS, YES THIER IS POWER in the BLOOD. But I think we need to examine that word BELEIVE . FOR IF WE TRULY BELIEVE JESUS , we would BELIEVE ALL THINGS HE BOTH TUAGHT AND SAID . And JESUS did not come that we would continue in darkness of sin as children of the night . HE translates his sheep OUT OF darkness and INTO HIS LIGHT . Where they see how to walk , how to live and have both the unction reminder and ability to walk as they ought . IF we are HIS we will walk BY HIS SPIRIT and BY HIS SPIRIT crucify the evils of the flesh . And IF any does err, let the correction process JESUS taught and paul and othes taught , BE APLLIED .For godly sorrow works repentance unto salvation not to be repented of , And it is that ONE SPIRIT of CHRIST called HOLY , that is working through the members to edify and build the church up . But an uncorrected member and church , IS a church that is taught nothing but destruction and will fall as the leaven rises full . JESUS PATTERN , THE APPOSTELS PATTERN. MUST BE FOLLOWED AND KEPT and those who have the SPIRIT understand THIS . Remember the HOLY SCRIPTURES make one wise unto SALVATION through our faith in CHRIST . an unread bible .............well HIS PEOPLE PERISH FROM LACK OF KNOWLEDGE . FEAST ON IT . FEAST on those pages as though its a banquet for the soul, FOR TRULY IT IS . Edited October 17, 2018 by frienduff thaylorde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PinkBelt Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 On 10/13/2018 at 3:33 PM, mynickname said: He told me to obey Him. He said obey My teachings and obey Me, do everything I tell you and you will live. He told me i must stay with Him and obey Him until the end. Jesus gave a different answer to this exact same question in the bible: Matt. 19:16-22, “And behold, one came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” 17 And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 He said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; 19 Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 20 The young man said to Him, “All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?” 21 Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.” 22 But when the young man heard this statement, he went away grieved; for he was one who owned much property.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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