Neighbor Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 949 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,515 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,022 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Sorry to hog the thread with my own idle meanderings but,- I just had a what if "vision" of a church offering plate holding the golden ticket for $1.6 billion and; the endless meetings of elders and deacons and even deaconesses that would then ensue. Fix the air conditioner, no send it all to missions, no save it all for a rainy day fund. But hey, the air conditioning doesn't work half the time. Well let's have committees formed for air conditioning for new missions funding for rainy day funding, for benevolence, for new kitchen pans, for .... Sometimes it is best to be close to broke I suppose, then one deals with only one issue of many, just one at a time maybe two steps forward and one back, maybe one forward and two back depending upon the week and the weather. Be content knowing that the provision by God, be it excessive or very lean, is always perfect for the further sanctification of the saints, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zemke Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 451 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/24/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 21, 2018 I partially remember a story told by a preacher named Romain. He was the number two at Costa Messa I believe with Chuck Smith. He said in the middle of finishing a church building with the struggles, to him anyway, of just barely having the funds month after month for the work, a man from the congregation showed up with a million dollar check saying he invested years ago and vowed to give a portion to the Lord if the investment did well. Well, it did, and here he was offering the portion. Romain was ecstatic that a weight of concern, his concern, was lifted. He sent the man to go find Chuck who was somewhere on the premise. Later, Romain ran into Chuck expecting a "praise the Lord" type greeting and when it wasn't forthcoming he asked Chuck if the young man had found him and Chuck said "Oh that, well yes he did and I told him to keep it, pray about it until the Lord shows him how to gift it. This fellowship is blessed every week seeing the Lord provide just what we need when we need it and taking that money would stand in the way of what God is doing." That is one reason why that man, an imperfect man, a man as we all are who made mistakes, was such a great pastor and why God used him and blessed that ministry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1sheep Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 6 hours ago, Dennis1209 said: I can only imagine, if all of a sudden I became a multi-millionaire. The sleepless nights, the anxiety and worry about all that money how to invest it, spend it, use it. Having dozens of people show up uninvited claiming they're related to me, scammers, thieves and hard luck people laying it on thick. I don't know any rich people personally, but I wonder how many of them are truly happy, content; how many hours of the day they can think of something else that doesn't involve the use of money? I don't know, but when a filthy rich person lays their head upon their pillow at night; what do you suppose their thoughts drift to going to sleep? I can only imagine and guess based upon my own thoughts. Matthew 6:19 (KJV) Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: Matthew 6:20 (KJV) But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: Having money is not the sin but it is what is in the heart of the man who is rich that God is concerned about! Its not a sin to have money and it does require a certain kind of person to handle it in a God glorifying manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1sheep Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, Davida said: It's hard when people who've never had money suddenly get a lot, because they don't suddenly also know how to manage it well. I met a guy who received a million from a car accident which left him disabled as a paraplegic and he blew it all. He was left with nothing & on welfare yrs later with severe health issues. Theres that old saying a fool and his money are easily parted. He would be secure if he had hired a trust worthy firm to invest his money and advise him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 hour ago, 1sheep said: Having money is not the sin but it is what is in the heart of the man who is rich that God is concerned about! Its not a sin to have money and it does require a certain kind of person to handle it in a God glorifying manner. Yes, you're correct, money in and of itself is not evil, it's only a medium of exchange for goods and services. Money is an efficient and accurate medium to represent stored labor, on and on... My point of contention is simply this; I've never seen an instance where someone suddenly becoming extremely wealthy, where it had not dramatically changed their lives, and from my perspective, not for the good. Of course there are always exceptions to the rule generally speaking. Since we're on the subject of 'money' and 'glorifying God', I find something very disturbing in America I stumbled upon. Google 'richest pastors / preachers in America' and see who comes up. Their openly lavish possessions and lifestyles and celebrity status glorifying themselves, instead of God (Pat Roberson exception possibly). Naturally, they are all purpose driven churches / religions and prosperity Gospel churches and cults (mega churches). Sort of reminds me of parts of what Jesus warned about in Matthew 24:. I don't know; but I think of all the rich disciples Jesus chose, the camel going through the eye of a needle, the rich man and Lazarus, etc. Something to ponder anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, Davida said: Yes, really. Hey look at the Vatican all decked in gold and Jesus was born in a manger and had no place to lay his head. ( who do these people think they are kidding? Evidently they're kidding a large "mass" (pun intended). It's so very sad. I've seen examples where persons couldn't even afford to pay their rent, electricity or feed themselves. And sent money to these religious wolves and hucksters, believing their perverted twisting of scripture, and pocketing their proceeds for their greed. Ah, I'm getting too worked up so time to zip it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1sheep Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, Davida said: I guess we will never really know the nitty gritty of their lives if those things actually out weighed any bad effects. What if marriages collapsed , children became drug users etc etc. I guess God knows. But it really seems people can have blessings in this world or blessings in the life after. I know many very rich unsaved people and know of very few wealthy saved people. Its not either or. 1 minute ago, Dennis1209 said: Evidently they're kidding a large "mass" (pun intended). It's so very sad. I've seen examples where persons couldn't even afford to pay their rent, electricity or feed themselves. And sent money to these religious wolves and hucksters, believing their perverted twisting of scripture, and pocketing their proceeds for their greed. Ah, I'm getting too worked up so time to zip it. 9 out of 10 pentecostals are living in poverty. Most on tv including pat robertson are wof prosperity emergent apostate false prophets. That doesnt mean that there arent people with money who use wisdom and follow the leading of God to glorify Christ! God said the love of money is sin because in most cases it can lead people to rely on money and not the Lord! . More offten than not you wont hear about those who are wealthy that are glorifying the Lord with their money because they are humble and meek in spirit. Stories like theirs mostly never gets told because they wouldnt hear of it! They are humble. I knew a man like that. He earned every penny by the sweat of his brow on the land. He also served in ww11 and was the district attorney of his county. He loved the Lord and he served the Lord and his community. He walked the talk. He lived modestly. God intrusts those he knows can handle it . It does afterall take money to run a ministry. It takes millions and millions to run an international ministry I also know that there are few poor people who dont demonize wealthy people because of their money! They are envious in their heart. Which btw a person doesnt need to be wealthy to be guilty of the love of money! Many a pauper dreams of having alot of money to make their lives better one way or other. They are as guilty before God for lack of faith just as much as the rich man who lacks faith! Ponder on that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1sheep Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 54 minutes ago, Davida said: I guess we will never really know the nitty gritty of their lives if those things actually out weighed any bad effects. What if marriages collapsed , children became drug users etc etc. I guess God knows. But it really seems people can have blessings in this world or blessings in the life after. I know many very rich unsaved people and know of very few wealthy saved people. So it cant be both? What about the man who was able to put all his kids through college and the marriage that was better because both had more time for each other and a better quality of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, 1sheep said: Its not either or. 9 out of 10 pentecostals are living in poverty. Most on tv including pat robertson are wof prosperity emergent apostate false prophets. That doesnt mean that there arent people with money who use wisdom and follow the leading of God to glorify Christ! God said the love of money is sin because in most cases it can lead people to rely on money and not the Lord! . More offten than not you wont hear about those who are wealthy that are glorifying the Lord with their money because they are humble and meek in spirit. Stories like theirs mostly never gets told because they wouldnt hear of it! They are humble. I knew a man like that. He earned every penny by the sweat of his brow on the land. He also served in ww11 and was the district attorney of his county. He loved the Lord and he served the Lord and his community. He walked the talk. He lived modestly. God intrusts those he knows can handle it . It does afterall take money to run a ministry. It takes millions and millions to run an international ministry I also know that there are few poor people who dont demonize wealthy people because of their money! They are envious in their heart. Which btw a person doesnt need to be wealthy to be guilty of the love of money! Many a pauper dreams of having alot of money to make their lives better one way or other. They are as guilty before God for lack of faith just as much as the rich man who lacks faith! Ponder on that.... Well, I don't believe I made a blanket and all inclusive statements. Of course there's wealthy Godly people whom love the Lord and manage what God has given them for the benefit of the Kingdom. I totally agree with a lot of what you're saying. If you were paying attention, you'd have noticed I was focusing on the wolves in sheep's clothing, those individuals and organizations that are fraudulently twisting the word of God for personal wealth and gain. Comparatively speaking, what percentages would you think are using their wealth for the Kingdom of God, and for personal wealth and celebrity / influential status? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted October 21, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 minute ago, PepperS said: I have observed that the people who are against people having money, are those who have none themselves. It's just not fair or equitable; people working hard by the sweat of there brow should not have more than us. No one should have to work, the government should provide for 'all' our needs and wants. Those greedy rich people whom provide jobs should be taxed at a much higher rate to make us more equal. Capitalism is an evil system, it requires risk taking and using your own finances; socialism is an equitable, fair and just system to make us all equal. Our government has a welfare based program to make a living at and take advantage of; free food, free or reduced housing, utility assistance, monthly income, SS benefits, free medical, soon to come free college educations, free cell phones, schools providing translators, etc. But the problem is; it's not quite enough, we need more. What's not to like? Once again, this is not a blanket statement and one shoe fits all, but getting close to 50% of the population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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