Proof: You were only forgiven of your past sins!

[discipler777]

2 minutes ago, Cobalt1959 said:

But He has never told me, once I accepted Christ, that I could lose my salvation, or that I should spend my day worrying about losing my salvation.  Is salvation really that ephemeral?

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1TIMOTHY.4:1-4 = The Great Apostasy

4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

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2TIMOTHY.3:1- = Perilous Times and Perilous Men

3 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. 8 Now as Jannes and Jambres resisted Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, disapproved concerning the faith; 9 but they will progress no further, for their folly will be manifest to all, as theirs also was.

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2THESSALONIANS.2:1-4  = The Great Apostasy

2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.

3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

[Guest shiloh357]

2 hours ago, Betha said:

I think we are just not on the same level of understanding yet.

True.   You have a lot to learn before you grow and mature to our level of understanding.  

Quote

I see salvation as an 'initial promise Eph 1v13, as an heir of it according to promise Gal 3v9 while we are still in the flesh but in Christ.....UNTIL we are fully redeemed at death when we actually INHERIT the KGd..Eph 1v14, 1Cor 15v50

That's the kind of poor theology that comes from cherry-picking verses and stringing them together to make the Bible appear to say what you want it to say.  But competent, mature theology doesn't work that way. 

If you bothered to read all of Ephesians 1, you would discover that we are:

• blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ
• chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
• predestinated unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will
• accepted in the beloved
• predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will
• ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise

And that is just some of what it says.  There is nothing in the Bible about an "initial" promise of salvation.   Salvation is always presented to us in its fullness.   

The very fact that we have the abiding presence of the Holy Spirit in us, proves it is not an initial promise and that we can lose it later.  We are already heirs of God and joint-heirs with Jesus, we already have eternal life.   We are not waiting to be fully saved.   There are rewards and benefits we have not realized, but that does not mean that we are not full saved. 

Your approach to salvation is immature and lacking in understanding.

[enoob57]

Rom 8:37-39

37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, 39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. 
NKJV

this list is any possible scenario within creation even us... to say as they do it doesn't say that (I) can't is ludicrous to the grammatical verbiage used here and bringing in John's writ 

1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
KJV
seals the deal in thought and possibilities... they that say you can walk away do so on some other authority other then that of The Scriptures! So it is a matter of where you want to place your trust on man or God? Because from what is unquestioned in The Scriptures what is said is what is done...

 

[Guest shiloh357]

2 minutes ago, discipler777 said:

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1TIMOTHY.4:1-4 = The Great Apostasy

4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

.

2TIMOTHY.3:1- = Perilous Times and Perilous Men

3 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. 8 Now as Jannes and Jambres resisted Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, disapproved concerning the faith; 9 but they will progress no further, for their folly will be manifest to all, as theirs also was.

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2THESSALONIANS.2:1-4  = The Great Apostasy

2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.

3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

That is not talking about genuine Christians apostatizing.  Apostates are not ex-Christians.   Authentic Christians cannot apostatize.   Apostates are those who know the truth, who assent to the truth, but then ultimately reject the truth.   Those verses are not warnings about Genuine Christians falling into apostasy.   They are warning authentic Christians about signs of how much worse the world will be and when the falling away does happen, it will demonstrate who were the genuine Christians who remained faithful vs. those who assented to the Christian religion, but never embraced Jesus.  There are many who belong to the Christian religion, and assent to certain propositional truths in it, but never actually followed Jesus in salvation.   Those are the ones who will fall away, proving they were never saved to start with.

[discipler777]

44 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

That is not talking about genuine Christians apostatizing.  Apostates are not ex-Christians.   Authentic Christians cannot apostatize.   Apostates are those who know the truth, who assent to the truth, but then ultimately reject the truth.   Those verses are not warnings about Genuine Christians falling into apostasy.   They are warning authentic Christians about signs of how much worse the world will be and when the falling away does happen, it will demonstrate who were the genuine Christians who remained faithful vs. those who assented to the Christian religion, but never embraced Jesus.  There are many who belong to the Christian religion, and assent to certain propositional truths in it, but never actually followed Jesus in salvation.   Those are the ones who will fall away, proving they were never saved to start with.

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@Cobalt1959

Quote

Apostasy [N]

(Heb. mesubaa [h'bWv.m]; Gk. parapipto [parapivptw], aphistemi [ajfivsthmi], apostasia [ajpostasiva]).

Defection from the faith, an act of unpardonable rebellion against God and his truth. The sin of apostasy results in the abandonment of Christian doctrine and conduct.

With respect to the covenant relationship established through prior profession of faith (passive profession in the case of baptized infants), apostates place themselves under the curse and wrath of God as covenant breakers, having entered into a state of final and irrevocable condemnation. Those who apostatize are thus numbered among the reprobate. Since the resurrection of Christ, there is no distinction between blasphemy against Christ and blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (cf. Matt 12:31-32 ; Heb 6:4-6 ; 10:26-29 ; 1 John 5:16-17 ). G. C. Berkouwer comments: "We must underscore the deep seriousness of the biblical warning against apostasy after enlightenment' and after the knowledge of the truth.' This is the apostasy which reviles the Spirit of grace and despises the Son of God and crucifies the Man of Sorrows anew" (p. 343).

https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionary/apostasy/

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2THESSALONIANS.2:1- (NKJV) = The Great Apostasy

2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Edited November 9, 2018 by discipler777

[Blood Bought 1953]

1 hour ago, discipler777 said:

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REVELATION.22:12-17 (NKJV) = Jesus Testifies to the Churches

12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

 

There are 31,173 verses in the Bible.Do you want to go over all of them? I don’t.I’ll say this once more...pull out any verse you like, if it sounds like it is inferring you can lose your Salvation, that verse is taken out of context or it is not talking about the Body of Christ.You should check out this verse....” God, have mercy on me, a sinner”.....if spoken from a truly contrite heart, God will initialize your Salvation and go on to finish what “ HE” started.It’s all Him.Not you.All you contribute is your faith, and even that was given to you by the Grace of God.The Shed Blood Of Jesus was not a supplement to your works .It’s faith in that Blood plus nothing.Just like the song says—- Nothing But The Blood.Millions sing it . Few believe it.Its that “ Narrow Gate” thingy.

[discipler777]

52 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

Authentic Christians cannot apostatize.

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MATTHEW.26:31-35 = Jesus Predicts Peter’s Denial

31 Then Jesus said to them, “All of you will be made to stumble because of Me this night, for it is written:

‘I will strike the Shepherd,
And the sheep of the flock will be scattered.’

32 But after I have been raised, I will go before you to Galilee.”

33 Peter answered and said to Him, “Even if all are made to stumble because of You, I will never be made to stumble.”

34 Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you that this night, before the rooster crows, you will deny Me three times.”

35 Peter said to Him, “Even if I have to die with You, I will not deny You!”

And so said all the disciples.

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MATTHEW.10:32-33 = Confess Christ Before Men

32 “Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven. 33 But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 minute ago, discipler777 said:

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MATTHEW.26:31-35 = Jesus Predicts Peter’s Denial

31 Then Jesus said to them, “All of you will be made to stumble because of Me this night, for it is written:

‘I will strike the Shepherd,
And the sheep of the flock will be scattered.’

32 But after I have been raised, I will go before you to Galilee.”

33 Peter answered and said to Him, “Even if all are made to stumble because of You, I will never be made to stumble.”

34 Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you that this night, before the rooster crows, you will deny Me three times.”

35 Peter said to Him, “Even if I have to die with You, I will not deny You!”

And so said all the disciples.

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Peter didn't apostatize.  Peter's denial wasn't apostasy.
 

Quote

 

MATTHEW.10:32-33 = Confess Christ Before Men

32 “Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven. 33 But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.

 

Yes, and that applies to sinners.   Genuine followers of Jesus never deny Him.   It is the sinners who deny him and they will be denied in eternity.

[Guest shiloh357]

22 minutes ago, discipler777 said:

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@Cobalt1959

https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionary/apostasy/

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2THESSALONIANS.2:1- (NKJV) = The Great Apostasy

2 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Again, authentic followers of Jesus will never apostatize.   II Thess. 2: isn't talking about those who are true followers of Jesus, but of those who simply belonged to the Christian religion, but fell away from it.  

[discipler777]

@Blood Bought 1953

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Quote

I was sad to see the announcement but not surprised, as yet another hyper-grace teacher took a giant step towards apostasy. I’m not naming names here, but I’m speaking about a man who had been a pastor and respected Christian leader, but who is now claiming that Jesus would bless a same-sex “wedding.” What a gross misrepresentation of our Savior and Lord!

https://askdrbrown.org/library/another-hyper-grace-teacher-bites-dust