ROMANS 14 and homosexuality

[Willa]

In the old testament the sin of homosexuality was punished by death.

Lev 20:13  If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.

So in effect this was not a sin that was prevalent in Israel.  However in the Roman world it was rampant and had to be dealt with.  That is why Romans 1 gets to the heart of the matter.

Rom 1:24  Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, Rom 1:25  who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.

Rom 1:26  For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature.

Rom 1:27  Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.

Rom 1:28  And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; Rom 1:29  being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, Rom 1:30  backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Rom 1:31  undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; Rom 1:32  who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

[bryan]

Culture affects linguistics, the meaning of words, and how they are used.    If one is to examine the original words of something translated such as the bible, it's not just a simple 'this word means that' process.  If our native language is English and we wish to explore the meaning of Aramaic or other root languages of the bible, we need to learn about that language than reading a language dictionary.   

More on that topic:

Linguistics across Cultures: The Impact of Culture on Second Language Learning

Abstract: The purpose of this article is to discuss the inseparable relation between culture and language and the implementation of instructional strategies for teaching second language through culture to enhance students’ linguistic comprehension. Language is not only the product of culture, but also is the symbol of culture (Gleason, 1961). Culture must be incorporated outright as an essential component of second language learning and teaching. Only after cultural issues become an inherent part of the language curriculum and instruction, can students be successful in their target language learning. Second language teachers, therefore, should pay more attentions to the diversities of cultures, identify key cultural items in every aspect when they design a language curriculum, and apply appropriate teaching strategies to learning activities in order to help students to bridge the culture gaps.

Source: https://files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/ED496079.pdf

[bryan]

Cobalt - You seem bothered by my statement: "To understand the intent and use of the word 'homosexuality' in the bible, I found it necessary to research the original words translated to 'homosexuality'. "

Why is that? 

[discipler777]

On 11/5/2018 at 10:38 AM, ladyalaska said:

I'm re-reading Romans and chapter 14 is killing my brain. Paul is talking about not making someone weaker in the faith stumble because they don't believe exactly as you do and as an example he uses food.

 

I keep turning this over in my mind that would homosexuality/transgenderism fit in this verse as well? I want to say no as these are sins but............

.

ROMANS.14:1-4 (NKJV) = The Law of Liberty

14 Receive one who is weak in the faith, but not to disputes over doubtful things. 2 For one believes he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables. 3 Let not him who eats despise him who does not eat, and let not him who does not eat judge him who eats; for God has received him. 4 Who are you to judge another’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand.

.

What was this "Law of Liberty" mentioned by apostle Paul.?  = To prevent new Gentile Christians, who were formerly mostly lawless Gentiles, from losing their newfound faith in Jesus Christ and salvation, God liberated them from any law of Moses which is a burden, eg circumcision and kosher/clean foods. (ACTS.15:24-29 & 21:20-25, cf GALATIANS.2:9-14). God only required them to keep easy or non-burdensome laws, eg morality laws/commandments. But if they break even these easy and non-burdensome laws, God will curse/judge them with calamities or terrors or even an early death(1CORINTHIANS.5:1-5 & 11:30, 1JOHN.5:16-17, ACTS.5:1-4).

In comparison, Jewish Christians were required by God to continue to keep Moses Law, as many laws/commandments as possible, because it was not a burden to them.

.

With liberty from burdensome laws, there may come doubts, eg what if some Gentile Christians choose to keep some of the burdensome laws, eg choose to be circumcised or eat only kosher/clean foods.?  Paul's advice is for Gentile Christians to not judge each other wrt the burdensome laws which they have been liberated from.

But wrt non-burdensome laws, there are no doubts, ie Gentile Christians are still required to avoid eating blood(blood transfusion.?), foods/things offered to idols, strangled animal sacrifice, sexual immorality(including adultery and homosexuality), blasphemy, idolatry, taking God's name in vain, not keeping the Sabbath-rest day, dishonoring your parents, murder, stealing, bearing false witness against your neighbor/brethren/friend and coveting your neighbor's possessions(the Ten Commandments of EXODUS.20), etc. Otherwise, bad things will happen to them(JOHN.5:14 & 8:11).

.

My comment does not negate the true doctrine of salvation by faith (in Jesus Christ) alone, and not by the good works of keeping the Law, whether keeping all the laws or only non-burdensome laws.(GALATIANS.2:16-17, JOHN.3:14-18) Wrt the evil works/deeds of not keeping the Law/commandments,  ...

GALATIANS.6:6-9 = Be Generous and Do Good

6 Let him who is taught the word share in all good things with him who teaches.

7 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. 9 And let us not grow weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all, especially to those who are of the household of faith.

Edited November 12, 2018 by discipler777

[Pencil24]

On 11/4/2018 at 8:38 PM, ladyalaska said:

Please help me with this

 

I am anti homosexuality and I have been told by numerous liberals that 'love is love' in regards to homosexuality and profess to be Christians.

 

I'm re-reading Romans and chapter 14 is killing my brain. Paul is talking about not making someone weaker in the faith stumble because they don't believe exactly as you do and as an example he uses food.

 

I keep turning this over in my mind that would homosexuality/transgenderism fit in this verse as well? I want to say no as these are sins but............

I am struggling with this to I have a gay family member I think it is a very delicate subject for me. I believe once your saved all sin is pardoned and that all sin is the same in Gods eyes.

[artsylady]

Read the book by Justin Lee's called Torn.   This was the beginning of when I decided to change my mind on this important issue.

[artsylady]

On ‎11‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 11:04 PM, Cletus said:

Not everything you love is good for you.  and not everyone who says I am a christian is telling you the truth.

Lev 18:22  Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

tell those liberals God didnt make adam and steve, he made Adam and Eve.  male and female He made them.  He made the woman to be a helpmeet for the man... He didnt make man for man. 

Also in Leviticus, eating shrimp, lobster, crab is an 'abomination'.   

[artsylady]

On ‎11‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 4:50 AM, shiloh357 said:

 

Romans 14. the entire chapter, is dealing with things like extra-biblical fast days  and issues of conscience.   Romans 14 does not address things that God calls sin.   Homosexuality is something that God abhors.  It is not an issue conscience and thus, would not be included in what Paul is discussing in this chapter. 

And homosexual love is not true love, not "love" from the Bible's definition of love.

Jesus never said a thing against being gay.  

[artsylady]

On ‎11‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 11:05 AM, Billiards Ball said:

Homosexual action is a sin, homosexual desire/temptation from a Christian is not.

If someone isn't a Christian, they can be a homosexual if they wish it. A born again Christian should get counseling if they struggle against homosexual desire.

I used to argue in this regard - that counseling could change a person's mind etc, etc.   I used to point to a group called Exodus who was doing that very thing.   However, when I was debating this one day, I was informed that Exodus, a Christian group, had folded, admitting their attempts to 'ungay' people did not work.   Gay conversion therapy really doesn't seem to work.   Just one more factor that changed my mind on the whole gay issue.  

I still do believe that if a Christian is sincere and wants to change, God will ALWAYS heal the spirit and change will happen.  I had to wonder why these sincere people, wanting change, were not being changed.

[Billiards Ball]

41 minutes ago, artsylady said:

I used to argue in this regard - that counseling could change a person's mind etc, etc.   I used to point to a group called Exodus who was doing that very thing.   However, when I was debating this one day, I was informed that Exodus, a Christian group, had folded, admitting their attempts to 'ungay' people did not work.   Gay conversion therapy really doesn't seem to work.   Just one more factor that changed my mind on the whole gay issue.  

I still do believe that if a Christian is sincere and wants to change, God will ALWAYS heal the spirit and change will happen.  I had to wonder why these sincere people, wanting change, were not being changed.

Homosexual and heterosexual desire are not a choice; homosexual and heterosexual activity are of choice. A person who was abused by same sex abusers as a prepubescent teen may have a much harder time overcoming homosexual desire then someone who had a gay experience by choice in college or high school.

I know several people in the church who have had a gay orientation/desire and are now hopeful for future heterosexual relationships. After counseling, word study and prayer they have had heterosexual desires also.