Dennis1209 Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 Daniel 4:25 (KJV) That they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field, and they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and they shall wet thee with the dew of heaven, and seven times shall pass over thee, till thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will. [Emphasis mine] It's interesting to note that "they" are not identified. I have my own opinion whom "they" might be. I'm curious to hear your opinions on whom "they" might be. This chapter is so extremely descriptive and detailed, I find it very curious a pronoun is used to identify whom is to accomplish this task? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Still Alive Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,024 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 1,224 Days Won: 3 Joined: 02/05/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 15 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said: Daniel 4:25 (KJV) That they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field, and they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and they shall wet thee with the dew of heaven, and seven times shall pass over thee, till thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will. [Emphasis mine] It's interesting to note that "they" are not identified. I have my own opinion whom "they" might be. I'm curious to hear your opinions on whom "they" might be. This chapter is so extremely descriptive and detailed, I find it very curious a pronoun is used to identify whom is to accomplish this task? I see it as a KJV thing. Not my favorite version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.94 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 The NIV Reads: Daniel 4:25 You will be driven away from people and will live with the wild animals; you will eat grass like the ox and be drenched with the dew of heaven. Seven times will pass by for you until you acknowledge that the Most High is sovereign over all kingdoms on earth and gives them to anyone he wishes. Reading the verses before this one I am going to make a guess here and say that I think "they" are the people who are not acknowledging God or following his commands. As 27 verse says: Therefore, Your Majesty, be pleased to accept my advice: Renounce your sins by doing what is right, and your wickedness by being kind to the oppressed. It may be that then your prosperity will continue.” Daniel 4:27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, Still Alive said: I see it as a KJV thing. Not my favorite version. You're right about that. Checked just a few for comparison; American Standard Version, World English Bible and Young's translation are totally different renderings. That would also apply to most of all scripture. Makes you wonder what the most accurate interpretation of scripture is doesn't it? We all have our own personal preferences and belief's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Still Alive Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,024 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 1,224 Days Won: 3 Joined: 02/05/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 Just now, Dennis1209 said: You're right about that. Checked just a few for comparison; American Standard Version, World English Bible and Young's translation are totally different renderings. That would also apply to most of all scripture. Makes you wonder what the most accurate interpretation of scripture is doesn't it? We all have our own personal preferences and belief's. Hey, yer preachin' to the choir on that one. I once talked to a student at a Christian college studying ancient hebrew and asked her which version of the bible was best. She said the only way to REALLY know what is in the bible is to be fluent in the language in which it was originally written. So, there you go. I was just exposed to some teaching on Genesis 9:24 that makes a ridiculously strong case that Ham's sin was not seeing Noah's naked body. His sin was having sex with Noah's wife. Which is why Noah cursed Canaan and not Ham. This includes link to podcast and transcript. It's truly fascinating and exhaustive: http://www.nakedbiblepodcast.com/naked-bible-159-noahs-nakedness-the-sin-of-ham-and-the-curse-of-canaan/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, LadyKay said: The NIV Reads: Daniel 4:25 You will be driven away from people and will live with the wild animals; you will eat grass like the ox and be drenched with the dew of heaven. Seven times will pass by for you until you acknowledge that the Most High is sovereign over all kingdoms on earth and gives them to anyone he wishes. Reading the verses before this one I am going to make a guess here and say that I think "they" are the people who are not acknowledging God or following his commands. As 27 verse says: Therefore, Your Majesty, be pleased to accept my advice: Renounce your sins by doing what is right, and your wickedness by being kind to the oppressed. It may be that then your prosperity will continue.” Daniel 4:27 I'm asking because it's very interesting, and I'm interested in other opinions. Also it shows a great difference in all the translations of the Bible from the original texts. The Septuagint refers to "they" as the 'Watchers". Let me throw out a question I've thought about? The Lord promised to preserve His word, but where and how? To my knowledge, there's only two translations of the Bible that are not copyrighted, the KJV and the Septuagint (could be others but I haven't found any). Would God allow His word to be copyrighted for restriction and profit? It's my understanding to obtain a 'copyright' on a translation of the Bible, it must be at least 15% different to avoid plagiarism issues. Now the math: 15% + 15% + 15% + 15% etc., any bells going off? Not to mention the profit from the best selling book of all time. Just my personal opinions, everyone else's mileage will vary. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 23 minutes ago, Still Alive said: I was just exposed to some teaching on Genesis 9:24 that makes a ridiculously strong case that Ham's sin was not seeing Noah's naked body. His sin was having sex with Noah's wife. Which is why Noah cursed Canaan and not Ham. Yeah, we're singing off the same sheet of music ? Doing my own research on your above opinion, I came to the same conclusion as you. I never believed it was a homosexual act, or viewing his naked body as others have suggested. Then Ham goes out and brags to Shem and Japheth about his incest. The whole biblical story about Ham, his curse and his descendants Canaan is interesting historically pertaining to Israel, and even in our own modern times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 17 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,436 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,360 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 5, 2018 36 minutes ago, Still Alive said: This includes link to podcast and transcript. It's truly fascinating and exhaustive: Looks like we travel in the same circles... Yeah, I listened to that pod cast some time ago and it was very interesting and informative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyKay Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 12 Topic Count: 385 Topics Per Day: 0.10 Content Count: 7,692 Content Per Day: 1.94 Reputation: 4,809 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/28/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 46 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said: I'm asking because it's very interesting, and I'm interested in other opinions. Also it shows a great difference in all the translations of the Bible from the original texts. The Septuagint refers to "they" as the 'Watchers". Let me throw out a question I've thought about? The Lord promised to preserve His word, but where and how? To my knowledge, there's only two translations of the Bible that are not copyrighted, the KJV and the Septuagint (could be others but I haven't found any). Would God allow His word to be copyrighted for restriction and profit? It's my understanding to obtain a 'copyright' on a translation of the Bible, it must be at least 15% different to avoid plagiarism issues. Now the math: 15% + 15% + 15% + 15% etc., any bells going off? Not to mention the profit from the best selling book of all time. Just my personal opinions, everyone else's mileage will vary. I am unsure how reply to this thread as I am not sure if it is a thread about Bible translations or asking for the meaning of Daniel 4:25. As of right now I would rather not comment on Bible translations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Still Alive Posted December 5, 2018 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,024 Content Per Day: 1.34 Reputation: 1,224 Days Won: 3 Joined: 02/05/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted December 5, 2018 43 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said: Looks like we travel in the same circles... Yeah, I listened to that pod cast some time ago and it was very interesting and informative. I just discovered him a few months ago, but I have a three hour round trip commute to "catch up". I'm on episode 161 now. Some amazing stuff in there. It makes you think. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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