What did Christ mean in Matthew 7:21-23?

[George]

6 minutes ago, discipler777 said:

2COR.3:6 was talking about the elementary principles of Christ where salvation is not by keeping the letter of the Law but solely by faith in Jesus Christ and being born-again of the Spirit, in whom the letter of the Law/Word of God is spiritually unveiled. Hence, the letter or Law kills but the Spirit gives (eternal) life.

Absolutely, however there's a means by which we're called to deliver the truths of God's Word!

 

[Sower]

3 hours ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Have you never read? If any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His. Yeah, these words come from my mouth, but what I said it is written in Rom. 8:v.9, do not you know of this?  

Yes, I know that. That is basic milk, as you would know.  Now I ask you, does your posts reflect the Spirit of Christ, Oseas? You post much scripture. That is wisdom. I would ask how you apply the scriptures that you post, to your witness here on Worthy. Do you believe your spirit reflects the Spirit of our Savior?  Just asking, my fellow student of the word.

[Mike Mclees]

11 hours ago, discipler777 said:

2CORINTHIANS.3:1-4 & 12-18 (NKJV) = 3:1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? Or do we need, as some others, epistles of commendation to you or letters of commendation from you? 2 You are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3 clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart. ...

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12 Therefore, since we have such hope, we use great boldness of speech— 13 unlike Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ. 15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart. 16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.

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2COR.3:6 was talking about the elementary principles of Christ where salvation is not by keeping the letter of the Law but solely by faith in Jesus Christ and being born-again of the Spirit, in whom the letter of the Law/Word of God is spiritually unveiled. Hence, the letter or Law kills but the Spirit gives (eternal) life.

2COR.3:6 is not much related to the 'how-to' in the giving of the Word or Law/commandments.

Has God made you His mediator to determine who goes to heaven or hell. I went to the cross once for my sins. Have you ever had to Ask God to forgive you of a sin since you were save? . Do you know the struggles of men. Have you ever had a addiction.? Do you know anything about it at all. I praise God today because Im free even though there is temptation at time. It discusses that in Hebrews also. It talks about it also 1st John 2:1  Little children these things I write unto you that you sin not and if any man sin we have and advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous . I think you should let God decide.  Love and compassion longsuffering seems to be something you could study more.

We also have a High preist that wast Tempted as we yet without sin. Therefore let come to the throne of Grace boldly. 

Without grace there would be no hope at all.  You and I could get acquainted better then.

Edited December 27, 2018 by Mike Mclees

[Sower]

21 hours ago, Gary Lee said:

You may want to consider your own words that comes from your mouth, Oseas.
Rom 2:13  (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

Math 7; 19-20  Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.  Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

 

 

10 hours ago, Gary Lee said:

13 hours ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Have you never read? If any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His. Yeah, these words come from my mouth, but what I said it is written in Rom. 8:v.9, do not you know of this?  

Yes, I know that. That is basic milk, as you would know.  Now I ask you, does your posts reflect the Spirit of Christ, Oseas? You post much scripture. That is wisdom. I would ask how you apply the scriptures that you post, to your witness here on Worthy. Do you believe your spirit reflects the Spirit of our Savior?  Just asking, my fellow student of the word.

Oseas. Do you realize you have posted thirty four lines of dialog, quoted eighteen plus scriptures, and have not answered my questions. This is a familiar tactic. I'm not here to engage. But to learn. All scripture you post are truth. God's word. But they do not answer the question given to you. Below were my questions.

Now I ask you, does your posts reflect the Spirit of Christ, Oseas?

I would ask how you apply the scriptures that you post, to your witness here on Worthy. Do you believe your spirit reflects the Spirit of our Savior?  Just asking, my fellow student of the word.

I am politely requesting you to answer in your own words, Oseas. Then, just back them with scripture. If this is possible.
If you can not do this, I understand.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[discipler777]

17 hours ago, George said:

18 hours ago, discipler777 said:

Yes, we should love the brethren/sisthren as ourselves. OTOH, we should also hate unrepentant willful sinners/evil-workers/Law-breakers, followers of deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons who reject or ignore or twist the Word of God or Holy Scripture. .......

The problem is that you should NEVER HATE the SINNER -- but hate the sin.  This is the issue I would have with this statement. 

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Yes, for the sake of salvation, God loves every sinner in the world who repents and believes in His Son, Jesus Christ, even ex-murderers like Paul and ex-robbers like the one at LUKE.23:43. These kind of repentant sinners/evil-workers/Law-breakers were or are few and far in between. IOW, most murderers and robbers are not repentant because it often takes a lot of willfulness and planning to become a murderer or robber. Paul can be considered an ignorant murderer/persecutor who was mis-zealous for God. OTOH, unrepentant sinners who do not believe in His Son are condemned to eternal condemnation/hell, even those who did not intentionally/willfully break any of God's Law or aren't murderers or robbers.(cf JOHN.3:14-21, ROMANS.5:12) 

How did Jesus Christ treat the Temple thieves at MATTHEW.21:12-13.? How did Jesus Christ speak to the unrepentant scribes and Pharisees at MATTHEW.23:13-39.?

So, it is not very scriptural and correct to say that Christians should never hate the sinner but just hate the sin, ie this statement can be misleading and it needs to be elaborated. Who is going to hell.? Is it the unrepentant and unbelieving sinner or just the sin going to hell.? What happened to Judas Iscariot, the son of perdition/hell.? What will happen to false prophets who are ravenous wolves in sheep clothing.? Should Christians still love such unrepentant false prophets and just hate their sins of false prophecies and false teachings.?

Doesn't God's law/commandment/word to love your neighbors/brethren/friends as yourself and hate your enemies still apply to Christians.?

.

Edited December 27, 2018 by discipler777

[discipler777]

5 hours ago, Mike Mclees said:

It talks about it also 1st John 2:1  Little children these things I write unto you that you sin not and if any man sin we have and advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous .

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There is a big difference between unintentional and intentional/willful sins. As per LEVITICUS.4:1-35, only unintentional sins could be forgiven by God through an animal sacrifice, eg a lamb offering. Intentional sins could not be forgiven = the sinner/evil-worker/Law-breaker would have to suffer for his/her sin, eg idolaters, homosexuals, murderers and adulterers were stoned to death and thieves had to pay 4X the compensation as a fine. This was why Paul had to suffer for his earlier intentional/willful sins of persecuting/murdering Christians even though he was saved and his life was spared by Jesus Christ/God(ACTS.9:15-16). Similarly for King David's sins of murder and adultery = he had to watch his sons dying and his family in disarray even though God spared his life and saved him.

The Apostle John was a Jewish Christian who was very well-versed in God's Law or Moses Law, ie the big difference between unintentional and intentional or willful sins/evil-works/Law-breaking. Eg 1JOHN.1:8-9 = 8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. The former "sin" refers to our inherited Adam's Original Sin, the latter "sins" refers to our unintentional sins/evil-deeds and maybe also to our repented-of intentional/willful sins.(cf 1JOHN.5:16-17)

So, 1JOHN.2:1 speaks of unintentional sins that may still be committed by Christians who are not perfect human beings, eg through accidents, mistakes, negligence, misunderstanding, etc = can be forgiven and forgotten by God. Otoh, 1JOHN.3:8 speaks of intentional/willful and unrepentant "Christian" sinners/evil-workers/Law-breakers, in whom Jesus Christ will not abide and whose sins will not be forgiven or forgotten by God.

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P S - Our inherited Adam's Original Sin is an inherited unintentional sin that can also be atoned/forgiven by the sacrifice of the Lamb of God.(JOHN.1:29, ROMANS.5:12, LEV.17:11, HEBREWS.9:22) The forgiven believers are saved from the curse of hell or spiritual death.(GENESIS.2:17)

[Blood Bought 1953]

37 minutes ago, discipler777 said:

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Yes, for the sake of salvation, God loves every sinner in the world who repents and believe in His Son, Jesus Christ, even ex-murderers like Paul and ex-robbers like the one at LUKE.23:43. These kind of repentant sinners/evil-workers/Law-breakers were or are few and far in between. IOW, most murderers and robbers are not repentant because it often takes a lot of willfulness and planning to become a murderer or robber. Paul can be considered an ignorant murderer/persecutor who was mis-zealous for God. OTOH, unrepentant sinners who do not believe in His Son are condemned to eternal condemnation/hell, even those who did not intentionally/willfully break any of God's Law.(cf JOHN.3:14-21, ROMANS.5:12) 

How did Jesus Christ treat the Temple thieves at MATTHEW.21:12-13.? How did Jesus Christ speak to the unrepentant scribes and Pharisees at MATTHEW.23:13-39.?

So, it is not very scriptural and correct to say that Christians should never hate the sinner but just hate the sin, ie this statement can be misleading and it needs to be elaborated. Who is going to hell.? Is it the unrepentant and unbelieving sinner or just the sin going to hell.? What happened to Judas Iscariot, the son of perdition/hell.? What will happen to false prophets who are ravenous wolves in sheep clothing.? Should Christians still love such unrepentant false prophets and just hate their sins of false prophecies and false teachings.?

Doesn't God's law/commandment/word to love your neighbors/brethren/friends as yourself and hate your enemies still apply to Christians.?

 

Matthew 5:43-45 ESV / 5 helpful votes

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.

Do do you have chapter and verse for  your “ hate your enemy” assertion?

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

6 hours ago, Oseas Ramos de Siqueira said:

Now it is you who MUST Judge me - my spirit -. What is written in the Word of God? -  God is a title, The Word is God -

1John 4:1 - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Well, God - the Word - is a Spirit: and they that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth. As was prophesied,"many false prophets are gone out into the world". Now, now, the false prophets are demons, by the way, the false prophets of the OT died, but the spirit of Devil which was within their bodies or in them, and did speak by their mouth to the people of Israel, it is now or in this present time polluting the whole earth with satanic apostasies spread among the believers in Christ as say Scriptures trying to depart my true brothers from the faith by twisting the Word of God speaking lies in hypocrisy. JESUS left very clear, saying: No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.

Again, it is you who MUST Judge the spirit that is in me and speaks by my mouth or through me. All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Spirit has never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.

Well, it could not be different. What can we learn of the words and teachings of the Lord JESUS?

Matthew 12:v.34-37

34 O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.

35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the Day of Judgment.   (Believe you or not, this Day of Judgment has arrived. JESUS is already sat in His throne, the Judgment Seat of Christ, in this seventh and last millennium, or seventh and last Day, in accord Genesis 1).  

37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

As I said above in another post, "if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His." 

What says the Word of God? John 1:v.11-13

1 He came unto His own, and His own received Him not.

12 But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

John 3:31-36

31 . . . he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.

32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.

33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.

34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

35 The Father loveth the Son - JESUS -, and hath given all things into His hand.

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the WRATH of God abideth on him.

Furthermore, a man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.

The testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of prophecy, I am a fellowservant of the brethren that have the testimony of Jesus

In Christ JESUS, KING of kings and LORD of lords 

 

 

Could you please change your writing style ......your posts are very hard on the eyes......

[discipler777]

5 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

6 hours ago, discipler777 said:

.

Yes, for the sake of salvation, God loves every sinner in the world who repents and believe in His Son, Jesus Christ, even ex-murderers like Paul and ex-robbers like the one at LUKE.23:43. These kind of repentant sinners/evil-workers/Law-breakers were or are few and far in between. IOW, most murderers and robbers are not repentant because it often takes a lot of willfulness and planning to become a murderer or robber. Paul can be considered an ignorant murderer/persecutor who was mis-zealous for God. OTOH, unrepentant sinners who do not believe in His Son are condemned to eternal condemnation/hell, even those who did not intentionally/willfully break any of God's Law or aren't murderers or robbers.(cf JOHN.3:14-21, ROMANS.5:12) 

How did Jesus Christ treat the Temple thieves at MATTHEW.21:12-13.? How did Jesus Christ speak to the unrepentant scribes and Pharisees at MATTHEW.23:13-39.?

So, it is not very scriptural and correct to say that Christians should never hate the sinner but just hate the sin, ie this statement can be misleading and it needs to be elaborated. Who is going to hell.? Is it the unrepentant and unbelieving sinner or just the sin going to hell.? What happened to Judas Iscariot, the son of perdition/hell.? What will happen to false prophets who are ravenous wolves in sheep clothing.? Should Christians still love such unrepentant false prophets and just hate their sins of false prophecies and false teachings.?

Doesn't God's law/commandment/word to love your neighbors/brethren/friends as yourself and hate your enemies still apply to Christians.?

 

Matthew 5:43-45 ESV / 5 helpful votes

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.

Do do you have chapter and verse for  your “ hate your enemy” assertion?

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MATTHEW.5:21-22 & 27-30 (NKJV) = Murder Begins in the Heart

21 “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not murder, and whoever murders will be in danger of the judgment.’ 22 But I say to you that whoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment. And whoever says to his brother, ‘Raca!’ shall be in danger of the council. But whoever says, ‘You fool!’ shall be in danger of hell fire. ...

Adultery in the Heart

27 “You have heard that it was said to those of old, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin,pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

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At MATTHEW.5 above, did Jesus Christ say that God's law/commandment/word to not commit murder and adultery, and to "love their neighbor and hate their enemy" no longer apply to Christians.? 

Scripture needs to be rightly divided.

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Edited December 27, 2018 by discipler777

[discipler777]

11 hours ago, Mike Mclees said:

22 hours ago, discipler777 said:

2CORINTHIANS.3:1-4 & 12-18 (NKJV) = 3:1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? Or do we need, as some others, epistles of commendation to you or letters of commendation from you? 2 You are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3 clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart. ...

.

12 Therefore, since we have such hope, we use great boldness of speech— 13 unlike Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ. 15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart. 16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.

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2COR.3:6 was talking about the elementary principles of Christ where salvation is not by keeping the letter of the Law but solely by faith in Jesus Christ and being born-again of the Spirit, in whom the letter of the Law/Word of God is spiritually unveiled. Hence, the letter or Law kills but the Spirit gives (eternal) life.

2COR.3:6 is not much related to the 'how-to' in the giving of the Word or Law/commandments.

Has God made you His mediator to determine who goes to heaven or hell. I went to the cross once for my sins. Have you ever had to Ask God to forgive you of a sin since you were save? . Do you know the struggles of men. Have you ever had a addiction.? Do you know anything about it at all. I praise God today because Im free even though there is temptation at time. It discusses that in Hebrews also. It talks about it also 1st John 2:1  Little children these things I write unto you that you sin not and if any man sin we have and advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous . I think you should let God decide.  Love and compassion longsuffering seems to be something you could study more.

We also have a High preist that wast Tempted as we yet without sin. Therefore let come to the throne of Grace boldly.

 Without grace there would be no hope at all.  You and I could get acquainted better then.

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JOHN.13:7-17 (NKJV) = 7 Jesus answered and said to him, “What I am doing you do not understand now,but you will know after this.”

8 Peter said to Him, “You shall never wash my feet!”

Jesus answered him, “If I do not wash you, you have no part with Me.”

9 Simon Peter said to Him, “Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and myhead!”

10 Jesus said to him, “He who is bathed needs only to wash his feet, but is completely clean; and you are clean, but not all of you.” 11 For He knew who would betray Him; therefore He said, “You are not all clean.”

12 So when He had washed their feet, taken His garments, and sat down again, He said to them, “Do you know what I have done to you? 13 You call Me Teacher and Lord, and you say well, for so I am. 14 If I then, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another’s feet. 15 For I have given you an example, that you should do as I have done to you. 16 Most assuredly, I say to you, a servant is not greater than his master; nor is he who is sent greater than he who sent him. 17 If you know these things, blessed are you if you do them.

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Alas.! some refuse to have their feet washed clean by other brethren from the dirt of willful or intentional sins/evil-works/Law-breaking done unrepentantly or ignorantly or from following deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons. They may even kick out violently with their unclean/dirty/smelly feet.