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naominash

Do We only want older Theologians here?

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6 minutes ago, PepperS said:

Agree. Those that have greater knowledge should not have to dumb down so that others can keep up. That being said, those with more knowledge should always be willing to help others to understand in a loving manner, that does not put down those with lesser knowledge.

Those who have more knowledge are there because they have put in the study and the prayer. In no way should they be asked to diminish their light.

Thats not quite what i said. What I said is it should be a two way street. Those of us who are more knowledgeable should "dumb down" the way we discuss, at least to a point, but they should do so in such a way to teach those younger in the faith how to increase their understanding. Its a two way street.

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1 minute ago, The_Patriot2018 said:

Thats not quite what i said. What I said is it should be a two way street. Those of us who are more knowledgeable should "dumb down" the way we discuss, at least to a point, but they should do so in such a way to teach those younger in the faith how to increase their understanding. Its a two way street.

Sorry, I thought I was able to elaborate how I felt as well. I will bow out.

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I am 65 yet feel young. Maybe because I workout everyday and still work 40 hours a week. I try not to talk down to newer believe's but try to make my vire of doctrine simple. Paul said to teach the younger the doctrine he handed down. It's easier in person to communicate because everyone can see how your coming across too. On line they cannot see your intent. But we are truly bless with this forum.

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12 minutes ago, PepperS said:

Sorry, I thought I was able to elaborate how I felt as well. I will bow out.

I apologize, i think i broke my own rule lol. I didn't make myself clear. You are fine-you said nothing wrong I think you just misunderstood my point and i was trying to clarify. Im one of those people who are bad about not making myself as clear as I should.

I was meaning it needs to be a two way street. Young Christians should seek to learn more and gain knowledge, and one of the best ways they can learn this knowledge (or at least how to obtain it) is from more mature Christians.

On the same note mature Christians need to understand that not everyone is on the same playing field.  Not everyone has attended seminary or Bible college, so we should seek to speak in such a way that A: is easy for all to understand and B: we should seek to teach and instruct them so they can learn and mature in their faith. Its our responsibility in fact to do so. 

Its a two way street, and if either side is treating it like a one way street (mature Christian holding themselves on a pedestal or a young Christian refusing to even attempt to learn) then nothing positive will ever come from it.

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1 minute ago, The_Patriot2018 said:

I apologize, i think i broke my own rule lol. I didn't make myself clear. You are fine-you said nothing wrong I think you just misunderstood my point and i was trying to clarify. Im one of those people who are bad about not making myself as clear as I should.

I was meaning it needs to be a two way street. Young Christians should seek to learn more and gain knowledge, and one of the best ways they can learn this knowledge (or at least how to obtain it) is from more mature Christians.

On the same note mature Christians need to understand that not everyone is on the same playing field.  Not everyone has attended seminary or Bible college, so we should seek to speak in such a way that A: is easy for all to understand and B: we should seek to teach and instruct them so they can learn and mature in their faith. Its our responsibility in fact to do so. 

Its a two way street, and if either side is treating it like a one way street (mature Christian holding themselves on a pedestal or a young Christian refusing to even attempt to learn) then nothing positive will ever come from it.

I thought I was saying the same thing. But, maybe I was not clear.

I think we are on the same page. Text can be hard sometimes

YSIC

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5 minutes ago, PepperS said:

I thought I was saying the same thing. But, maybe I was not clear.

I think we are on the same page. Text can be hard sometimes

YSIC

It can which brings forth another challenge to online discussion. One person says one thing which makes perfect sense to them, but someone else understands it completely different, and often rather then talking it out rationally they draw up battle lines. In this case im glad we were able to talk it out and resolve it, and i thankyou for your willingness to do so.

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1 minute ago, The_Patriot2018 said:

It can which brings forth another challenge to online discussion. One person says one thing which makes perfect sense to them, but someone else understands it completely different, and often rather then talking it out rationally they draw up battle lines. In this case im glad we were able to talk it out and resolve it, and i thankyou for your willingness to do so.

I really like and respect you. If we have areas of disagreement, so be it. It is not our disagreements which show who we are, but how we handle them.

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I once made an observation at work about some long term colleagues.  There are some people with 20 years of experience who've done nothing more than repeat their first year 20 times.  Then there are those who've spent most of those 20 years learning, growing, and improving.   When I hear someone has 20 years of experience at something, what runs through my head is wondering if that means they merely avoided being fired for 20 years or if they have a vast wealth of knowledge and experience and are actual experts.

I've observed something similar in Christians.  There are those who are constantly growing, learning, and maturing and striving ever onward.  Then there are those relatively satisfied with where they are with minor improvements over time.   There are those Christians for whom theology is a living breathing discipline of learning more and more about God.  They see questions and challenges as opportunities for re-examining what they believe and coming to a deeper understanding of things.  Then there are those Christians who find a "doctrinally correct" church and spend year after year honing their arguments and counter arguments about why their brand of Christianity is the best one.   They see questions and challenges as opportunities to correct people and debate which brand of Christianity is correct.  

I think much of the frustration with "older theologians" is with those Christians who've fossilized and spent years honing their knowledge of arguments and counter-arguments over why their particular sect is the most correct one.  It's not to say they are not good Christians and not growing spiritually.  They are usually growing personally and walking with God.  But their ability to teach and help younger Christians grow is heavily limited to indoctrination (rather than education), giving them recipes and directions to follow, trying to get them to become part of the correct denomination and church, and making sure that they have the right opinion on various debated issues among Christians.  It's often mostly about telling younger Christians how they should act and what they should believe.

There are then those "older theologians" who've been constantly pushing forward both in their spiritual lives and their theological understanding of various things for decades.  For them, it is practicing the process of spiritual growth and walking with God that is most important.  They trust God to shape and form young Christians' lives over time so they focus on teaching them how to learn and grow and walk with God.  

Theological dialogues among the fossilized old theologians often end up as arguments with curmudgeonly gray haired saints trying to keep the young whippersnappers in line and making sure everyone has the correct beliefs.   Theological dialogues among the striving old theologians often become treasure troves of shared experiences and spiritual insights focused on how to better spiritually grow. 

Of course, few fit neatly into these categories of fossil or striver.  There is a continuum between the two to some degree.  However, I have observed a number of Christian teachers over the years that do tend towards one end or the other.  To the extent a teacher is fossilized, their main focus is often on helping new Christians better fit into particular churches and denominations.  To the extent a teacher is striving and growing, their main focus is often on helping new Christians learn how to spiritually grow.  

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Two things bore me to tears .......secular television shows about Biblical things, and Intellectual debates about the same....the latter seem to revel in their ability to come off as superior thinkers......I ignore both....

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On 1/11/2019 at 12:17 PM, naominash said:

I feel like sometimes we alienate younger or less mature believers in different seasons of life. By younger, I mean under the age of 50. 

I don't think this is always on purpose. Here's what I mean:

- Almost all the topics are on often-repeated advanced theological debates.  Me Try Praises and Prayer equests

- Almost none of the topics in the Activity list are on practical Christian lessons that apply to people in different seasons of life like singlehood, college, motherhood, fatherhood, marriage, work, dating, ministry, etc.

People really need this, though.

- Disdain for the young. Someone accused me of just being a 'millenial' because I didn't like missing church for work. I see a lot of posts about the way things 'used' to be and how everything now is just going to hell in a hand basket.

- Lack of awareness of time for studying Scripture. 

Of course you have more time to develop theories on Revelation if you're retired with no kids in the house!

- Unnecessary lofty speech and big words

What if someone who never went to church or didn't have a degree wanted to understand what you were saying??

- Lack of patience

This is the biggest one. I'm glad you believe that Jesus is the only way and that the Bible is true above all worldly philosophies. But did you get there overnight? We're you always a Christian?

I've seen liberal Christians run off. I've seen Christians that are only 95 % conservative run off. Pentecostals? Gone. Catholics? Gone. 

Wisdom and knowledge is a gift. We didn't earn it. Speak the truth, but speak it with humility and love.

Anyone who sits on the wrong side of OSAS? Barely tolerated. 

Partiality is a sin. If you want the forum a certain way because it's a sanctuary from young people/liberals/Joel Osteen fans, it will die. Jesus is for everyone, not just the theologically astute.

 Sorry for my hoary breath my dear.

 

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