Intimacy before marriage: which are the principles behind it?

[simplejeff]

3 hours ago, theInquirer said:

So I have a sort of abnormal question: is sex supposed to be saved for that one person you will marry or is it to be saved for marriage?  ....

Also, I guess it's somewhat a given, but I do want to point out that I am NOT trying to find a basis for having sex (I'm not married); rather, I am attempting to better understand the principles behind God's keeping sex for marriage so that I may comprehend further what other standards of behavior would be acceptable in a relationship. 

Already partly or even fully answered perhaps, in the thread already,

but

see for yourself,  what does Yahweh (God) say?   His Word is THE STANDARD.    All Yahweh Says is Truth, and He is the Only One Who can give Eternal Life also.    Therefore,  DO as He Says, according to His Meaning,  not man's meanings.    His Standard is True and Right and Good.  Men are not.

[Willa]

Is Jesus Christ the Lord and Master of your life?  If He is you will not struggle against His divine word.  

Many places in Scripture is says that there will not be anyone who continuously practice fornication, any sex outside of marriage, that goes to heaven.  

1 Cor. 6:9   NKJV Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[fn] nor sodomites, 1Co 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 1Co 6:11  And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

 Heb 13:4 Marriage is honorable among all, and the bed undefiled; but fornicators and adulterers God will judge.

 

 

[wingnut-]

17 hours ago, theInquirer said:

I know, but I'm saying because of how you said the marriage covenant was sort of a reflection of Jesus and the church, but Jesus hadn't come back then, so how could it be a reflection back then of what did not exist then?

 

Prior to the New Covenant you had the Old one, in which God compared His relationship with Israel to that of husband and wife.  The Old Testament parallels the New, but the plan was always the same.  As far as Jesus and the church as the Bride, it isn't a sort of reflection, it is exactly how it is defined in scripture.

 

Ephesians 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. 28 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, 30 because we are members of his body. 31 “Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.”32 This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church.

[enoob57]

it has and always will be about purity in God in the doing... it is why it is so abused here in the darkness! Flesh vrs. Spirit as such...

[dr3032]

People become of one flesh only after marriage, thus it is only after the ceremony where any kind of intimacy may take place.

As for what is or is not okay beforehand, i'd say it falls to the individuals. Me personally, I think i'd play it careful and try to avoid too much physical contact. No kissing nor hugging. I guess i'd have to see if an arm over the shoulder or holding hands was too much, those are on the fence for me. The giving of a gift is weird to me, because it comes with a level of expectation, especially in the confines of a romantic relationship. Compliments would have to be on her personality, or only things from the neck on up. No "your dress looks nice," because then i'd probably just be checking out her body.

However, someone might look at my restrictions and have a giggle. They might not see kissing or hugging as all that intimate, or they might enjoy giving people gifts or recieving them. The only thing I can think of to do would be to sit the other person down and try to get a feel for where their own personal boundaries are.

[Billiards Ball]

On 2/14/2019 at 2:33 PM, theInquirer said:

So I have a sort of abnormal question: is sex supposed to be saved for that one person you will marry or is it to be saved for marriage?  While those two might sound like the same thing, I am primarily referring to situations of engagement where one essentially knows who they will marry, but they aren't married yet.  Is sex to be saved just for marriage or just for the one person you'll marry?  

I mean, I suppose one could argue that the whole basis for saving sex for just that one person that you'll marry could only be that it ought to be saved for marriage exclusively in the first place, but I'm not sure that's a valid argument or not, so I need some constructive advice.  

Also, I guess it's somewhat a given, but I do want to point out that I am NOT trying to find a basis for having sex (I'm not married); rather, I am attempting to better understand the principles behind God's keeping sex for marriage so that I may comprehend further what other standards of behavior would be acceptable in a relationship.  

An engagement is a contract to make a later (marriage) contract, and not a guarantee. Engaged couples break up at times, so save it for the person you marry.

[Stu of Whoville]

• Planning to be married is not the same thing as being married.  It would be quite possible to have sex with the person you were pretty sure you would marry and end up having sex with a dozen different people.  You were sure you were going to marry each of them but there was some sort of breakup and you didn't.
• Planning to be married requires no commitment from you beyond the planning stage.  No minister has asked whether you will promise to love , comfort, honor and keep your fiance for better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and health, and forsaking all others, be faithful only to him/her, for as long as you both shall live?
• In Genesis 2:24 the Bible says, "Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh."  ---  You will notice that there is an expectation that the man is ready to leave his parents home in order to make a new home with his wife.  Therefore, there should be no sexual relationship until a person is ready to take that step of creating a home and family.
• Sex before marriage creates a casual attitude towards sex that remains even after a person is married.  (This is basically sex without commitment.)  Even though you are doing marital things you have made no marital commitment to one another.  This casual attitude toward depth and commitment won't change just because you stood in front of a preacher and have a piece of paper now.  The sexual activity already changed your relationship with your prospective spouse - and there is no way to undo that style of relationship just because you are "married" now.
• In Old Testament times the act of intercourse was also the act of being married.  If you had engaged in this activity then you had become one flesh and as one flesh you were not to be separated.  Exodus 22:16  says "If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his wife."  In our society we expect for a young man to make a commitment to the young woman with whom he wants to have a sexual relationship. That means expressing solemn promises in front of God, friends and family who have come to witness their union.  The casual love them and leave them attitude of modern America is found nowhere within the pages of Scripture.

We live in pretty much a godless society and casual, rampant sexuality is one of the reasons for that. The God of the Bible stands in opposition to a hyper-sexualized society where people use one as a means to pleasure rather than a form of committed love.  Premarital sex is the prime cause of unwanted pregnancy and frequent abortions. Premarital sex is the primary reason for single-parent households. Premarital sex increases the likelihood of later divorce by about 20%.  Premarital sex feels really good, but the consequences are often catastrophic. 

I have never seen a situation where waiting until marriage made the marriage worse, but I have seen dozens of times in which not waiting nearly brought that marriage to an end.

[Jostler]

Quote

Luk 12:20

“But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?’

Life can end in a moment  for either party in an engagement.  Where does it leave the survivor if the unexpected arrives?

The highest expression of the image of God that He placed in mankind is found in the union of male and female, co-creating children in  purity.   That is an image of a holy trinity - a reality that has nothing  to  do with gender or sex - expressed in an image of it.   The reality is about oneness expressed in three persons.  Any violation  of  that mars and  violates the image.  It presents a false image of  who God really  is.  Which is one big reason why satan attacks  the sanctity  of marriage and sexual purity and uses perversion of it so liberally in his plans and works.

It's the only blood covenant left among men since the blood of Jesus  was shed.  There is a shedding of blood at the first union that  cannot be repeated.  That blood covenant is "til  death do us part" and it's serious business in heavenly places.  Violation of it has huge consequences.

Edited February 27, 2019 by Jostler

[Who me]

On 2/14/2019 at 7:33 PM, theInquirer said:

is sex supposed to be saved for that one person you will marry or is it to be saved for marriage? 

Change the image for a moment.

Is a Brides wedding dress purely for the wedding, could she use it before the wedding to go to parties or shopping?

She knows she's getting married so why not?

 

The same arguments apply.

Keep it for marriage.

[Prycejosh1987]

On 2/14/2019 at 7:33 PM, theInquirer said:

So I have a sort of abnormal question: is sex supposed to be saved for that one person you will marry or is it to be saved for marriage?  While those two might sound like the same thing, I am primarily referring to situations of engagement where one essentially knows who they will marry, but they aren't married yet.  Is sex to be saved just for marriage or just for the one person you'll marry?  

I mean, I suppose one could argue that the whole basis for saving sex for just that one person that you'll marry could only be that it ought to be saved for marriage exclusively in the first place, but I'm not sure that's a valid argument or not, so I need some constructive advice.  

Also, I guess it's somewhat a given, but I do want to point out that I am NOT trying to find a basis for having sex (I'm not married); rather, I am attempting to better understand the principles behind God's keeping sex for marriage so that I may comprehend further what other standards of behavior would be acceptable in a relationship.  

I think we are allowed to kiss our partners and hug them and spoon with them, etc it just says that sexual immortality(which is oral, anal, and other perverted sex) and actual sex is forbidden.