Mid Trib rapture anyone?

[Marilyn C]

48 minutes ago, Spock said:

 

Hi again Spock,

Another point you may want to consider regarding the 7 years, is found in Ezekiel 39: 9 `they will make fires with them (weapons) for seven years.`  This is after the Russian Federation & 3 others being dealt with by God on Israel`s mountains. Then the Peace Treaty and Israel buries the dead in a valley, (takes 7 months) and also burns the weapons, which takes 7 years. Interesting.

Marilyn. 

[Marilyn C]

31 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

I would submit: the "spirit" inside the body of Christ as he was walking the earth was none other than the WORD that said, "Light BE!" He, the word, took on the flesh of humans by being born as one. But the life inside was GOD HIMSELF, the second person of the trinity. 

My point all along is, He will forever more have this resurrected human body.

Resurrected, glorified, exalted body. I do know what you mean. Great we can agree bro.

[The Light]

22 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Sorry, but these are NOT the same events. That idea is nothing but MYTH that cannot be proven. The opposite, however, can be proven. 

You are rearranging Revelation so your theory WILL BE proven wrong.

AXIOM 2 on Revelation:

ANY theory that does not include the understanding that "the book" in Rev. 5 is a legal document created in heaven and about planet earth and incorporate into that theory the following facts is immediately suspect and will be proven wrong:

1. Neither God nor Satan can begin anything written on or about a seal before that seal can be legally opened. 

2. The purpose of the seals are to PREVENT either God or Satan from opening the book and beginning the events written IN the book - such as any trumpet judgment. 

3. Once a seal is opened, then what is written about that seal can legally begin - but not before.

4. The seals are numbered for their proper order. Any theory that attempts to rearrange what John has numbered for sequencing will be wrong.

5. Because the seals are sealing the book, nothing written in Revelation after the 7th seal [what is written INSIDE the book] can possibly come to pass before all the seals are opened so that the book can be opened. Therefore, any theory that moves a seal to align with a trumpet or a vial will be proven wrong. What we read in Revelation after the 7th seal is opened is what is written INSIDE the book: the trumpet judgments are written inside the book.

6. Neither God nor Satan could legally take the book and open the seals. It would have to be a man from the human race. Further, it would have to be a man who could redeem mankind - a man who could escape death and rise again - and escape from hell. 

7. There was a time when Jesus Christ was NOT found worthy to take the book and open the seals. He BECAME worthy once He fulfilled what was required to redeem mankind. 

You are attempting to move the 6th seal to the end of the week. Your theory will be proven wrong.

In your imagination, you think the 6th seal is the same event that happens after the days of great tribulation. However, John would be shaking his head. You see, John does not even open or begin the 70th week until the 7th seal and does not get to the midpoint until the 7th trumpet. The days of GT then in Revelation won't even START until after the 7th trumpet has marked the midpoint! But they cannot start until God has given His warning not to take the mark - so the days of GT cannot be until AFTER that point in chapter 14. In fact, we see the first time the beheaded people begin showing up in heaven is not until chapter 15.

The truth then is that the days of GT will not even BEGIN until long after the 6th seal events have finished - making it impossible that the signs at the 6th seal are the same as the signs that will come AFTER the days of tribulation - as shown in Matthew 24.

Then there is the PURPOSE: The signs at the 6th seal are the signs for the start of the DAY, while the signs after the tribulation of those days will be the signs for HIS COMING, as shown in Rev. 19.

Just so you know, Joel shows BOTH of these signs, and shows they are different - and for a different purpose.  Joel 2 is a blood moon sign, proving the moon is visible - but the Joel 3 sign is when Christ has come (to Armageddon) and both the sun and moon will be invisible - meaning darkness - not even the stars will give any light. So different signs for different purposes that will come over 7 years apart.

Hi LA,

All I can say is if you don’t have the understanding that Revelation is not in order there is not much use in me wasting a bunch of time trying to convince you of the obvious. I certainly understand your inability to place Matt 24 at the 6th seal,even though God is pretty clear with his sign. Of course the sign will be given to the Jews, the twelve tribes. That day, the day of his wrath, will not take them unaware. And yet when the fulness of the Gentiles comes in, the Goodman will not know when the master will return. There is a reason that people can’t figure out of it’s pre trib, mid trib or post trib rapture. That’s because the Gentile is raptured pre trib and the twelve tribes that are scattered across the earth are raptured prewrath. When the wrath of a god begins, only those that flee,when the abomination of desolation is set up, will go through the wrath of God. They will spend time, times and half a time in a place of safety. Gods people do not experience His wrath.

[The Light]

39 minutes ago, Spock said:

The Light is very confusing. I know it’s late here and I’m tired but his last post to me “use your logic Mr Spock” seemed pretty incoherent. Maybe I’m just tired........

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I’m attempting to get you to understand that the starting point to understanding Revelation is to put the coming of Jesus, Matt 24 at the 6th seal. This is exactly where God says it goes. That Matt 24 coming is not Armageddon, it is the gathering that Paul says occurs before the day of the Lord.

[Marilyn C]

46 minutes ago, The Light said:

I’m attempting to get you to understand that the starting point to understanding Revelation is to put the coming of Jesus, Matt 24 at the 6th seal. This is exactly where God says it goes. That Matt 24 coming is not Armageddon, it is the gathering that Paul says occurs before the day of the Lord.

Hi The Light,

Oh but God`s word tells us that the heavens and earth shake and then the Son of Man comes in power and great glory with His angelic army. (Matt. 24: 29 - 31) There is only one shaking of heavens and earth as Heb. 12: 26 tells us. And that is just prior to the Lord descending as the sky rolls back, (Rev. 6:14   & Rev. 19: 11)

The Body of Christ has long gone before then. They will judge the world system and fallen angels, from their position of ruling with the Lord in heaven. (Rev. 3: 21   1 Cor. 6: 2 & 3)

Marilyn.

[Spock]

6 hours ago, The Light said:

I’m attempting to get you to understand that the starting point to understanding Revelation is to put the coming of Jesus, Matt 24 at the 6th seal. This is exactly where God says it goes. That Matt 24 coming is not Armageddon, it is the gathering that Paul says occurs before the day of the Lord.

Do you think Jesus was teaching them about the rapture.  Look at the questions they asked him?

[The Light]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi The Light,

Oh but God`s word tells us that the heavens and earth shake and then the Son of Man comes in power and great glory with His angelic army. (Matt. 24: 29 - 31) There is only one shaking of heavens and earth as Heb. 12: 26 tells us. And that is just prior to the Lord descending as the sky rolls back, (Rev. 6:14   & Rev. 19: 11)

The Body of Christ has long gone before then. They will judge the world system and fallen angels, from their position of ruling with the Lord in heaven. (Rev. 3: 21   1 Cor. 6: 2 & 3)

Marilyn.

Matt 24

³¹ And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

I don't see any Armageddon in these verses. I see the gathering that Paul speaks of that occurs before the day of the Lord, the day of his wrath.

 

As far as you saying that the sky rolls back when the armies of heaven come it simply says

Rev 19

¹¹ And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

We can also see heaven opened in:

Rev 4

 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.

Additionally, I know that the body of Christ is gone before then. They were rapurted pretrib.

 

Edited March 26, 2019 by The Light

[The Light]

1 hour ago, Spock said:

Do you think Jesus was teaching them about the rapture.  Look at the questions they asked him?

I think Jesus was telling the Jews about the sign of his coming and the end of the age. He tells them about the tribulation period (The first 5 seals) and them he tells them about the sign of his coming, to gather his elect FROM HEAVEN (the church) and EARTH (the twelve tribes).

[WilliamL]

7 hours ago, Spock said:

Do you think Jesus was teaching them about the rapture.  Look at the questions they asked him?

The questions they asked him were from their perspective of their Jewish Messiah establishing the earthly Kingdom of David in Jerusalem. (Disciples: "Rapture? Whazzat?")

Now, the answers that they got, like so many answers before, were far beyond anything that they expected, or ever had in mind.

[Spock]

38 minutes ago, WilliamL said:

The questions they asked him were from their perspective of their Jewish Messiah establishing the earthly Kingdom of David in Jerusalem. (Disciples: "Rapture? Whazzat?")

Now, the answers that they got, like so many answers before, were far beyond anything that they expected, or ever had in mind.

So William, are you implying Jesus was talking about the rapture in some of his words in the Olivet Discourse?  If so, which words (verses in 24-25) do you specifically show are meant for the rapture, not the second com8mg?