Your closest friendnt Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 12, 2019 47 minutes ago, ἔκλειψις said: I don't think heaven is a place, but rather something more like a situation This is not strange to hear, because of how people may feel while they still live ... And the same can be said for Hell... Like that we hear people saying that I am in Heaven, and not only while they are of under the influence of...but they only say that also when they are in love...and under so many other sircumstances... Is like when someone does something to get their satisfaction. That results in that Heavenly feeling. This is not the Heaven or the oposite Hell... The ancient Greeks believe and welcomed the Gospel of Jesus Christ because it came for the New Inheritance for mankind, one that it was not available before.. They belive because they wanted to be Saved from Hades, the only inheritance for mankind before the descending one, because at the time of death everyone. Was descending to the place of the dead. They believe to be Saved from the Death inheritance for mankind, as to askent to the New Life inheritance the Heavenly one of Jesus Christ... Greeks were not ignorance of after life... I cannot say anymore about the ancient believes of the Greeks, which were parallel to Roman believes. Those Nations knew way to much about afterlife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaacsname Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Junior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 33 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 12, 2019 I was just going by the use of the primary preposition " en " ( in ) that precedes the words " heaven " and " hell " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 12, 2019 1 minute ago, ἔκλειψις said: I was just going by the use of the primary preposition " en " ( in ) that precedes the words " heaven " and " hell " Those places they do not exist because of this and that, while the proper grammar is important. They are places as in Greece, denotes location as I understand... The ancient Greeks they knew of Hades too much because they were properly informed, and that's why were brave people in facing all sircumstances because they face the afterlife without fear and cosmetics... I am careful not to go out of the poster's inquires. So far I think so good, we remain in the subjects relevance. I do not understand what is your actual suggestions.. But many believed in God and also in Jesus Christ, because they have seen and or experience the devil and other demons, not the good ones who come as the angels of light, they are not from God... And many have visions of Hell, inspite of denying Hell as a place in the heart of the earth. We cannot take over the post, one or two inquiries. I think is ok. Thanks for responding and your inquires as I am just only a member and not representing or qualify to debate those issues . but as an idividual I have seen the Devil more than once... Only Christian perspectives, nothing more than that.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael37 Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Servant Followers: 21 Topic Count: 241 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 6,901 Content Per Day: 3.26 Reputation: 4,831 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2018 Status: Online Birthday: 09/23/1954 Share Posted March 12, 2019 On 3/11/2019 at 11:28 AM, johnthebaptist said: Most people seem to believe that salvation and heaven are one and the same thing. In other words, they believe that if you are saved, then you are going to heaven. What do you think? If your name is in the Lamb's Book of Life you are saved and are destined to number among the population of heaven as foreknown by God. Php 4:3 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life. Rev 3:5 He that overcomes, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Rev 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Rev 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defiles, neither whatsoever works abomination, or makes a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life. Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. soteriology [sə(ʊ)ˌtɪərɪˈɒlədʒi, sɒ(ʊ)ˌtɪərɪˈɒlədʒi] NOUN theology the doctrine of salvation. ORIGIN mid 19th century: from Greek sōtēria ‘salvation’ + -logy. Powered by Oxford Dictionaries · Bing Translator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaacsname Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Junior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 93 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 33 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 12, 2019 12 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said: I do not understand what is your actual suggestions.. Oh, OK, I'll try to explain what I mean Reading something like " in heaven " and thinking Heaven is a place is like reading " he's in trouble " and thinking " trouble " is a place " he " is " in " when in fact it could be read as referring to the state of a situation Rev 19:14 ' And the armies which were in heaven ( en ) followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean " It's a directional preposition in Greek: ek - out of/from - preposition indicating directional outward a primary preposition denoting origin (the point whence action or motion proceeds), from, out (of place, time, or cause; literal or figurative. eis - preposition indicating directional inward into, unto, to, towards, for, among a primary preposition denoting movement inward; literal or figurative. en - in/by/with - preposition indicating fixed position a primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively). epi - on/upon/over - preposition indicating position of being on or over a primary preposition whose primary signification is "upon". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted March 12, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,825 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,753 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 12, 2019 3 hours ago, ἔκλειψις said: Oh, OK, I'll try to explain what I mean Reading something like " in heaven " and thinking Heaven is a place is like reading " he's in trouble " and thinking " trouble " is a place " he " is " in " when in fact it could be read as referring to the state of a situation Rev 19:14 ' And the armies which were in heaven ( en ) followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean " It's a directional preposition in Greek: ek - out of/from - preposition indicating directional outward a primary preposition denoting origin (the point whence action or motion proceeds), from, out (of place, time, or cause; literal or figurative. eis - preposition indicating directional inward into, unto, to, towards, for, among a primary preposition denoting movement inward; literal or figurative. en - in/by/with - preposition indicating fixed position a primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively). epi - on/upon/over - preposition indicating position of being on or over a primary preposition whose primary signification is "upon". Thank you for your response now is a lot better. Please I need some time to responsibly respond. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthebaptist Posted March 13, 2019 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 6 Topic Count: 118 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 4,361 Content Per Day: 2.32 Reputation: 2,109 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/25/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/03/1953 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 20 hours ago, ἔκλειψις said: I don't think heaven is a place, but rather something more like a situation Yes, I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthebaptist Posted March 13, 2019 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 6 Topic Count: 118 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 4,361 Content Per Day: 2.32 Reputation: 2,109 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/25/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/03/1953 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 19 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said: You sure that you are reading the scriptures, or a lot of sermons on theese subjects... Because you have raised a number of subjects... The scriptures asks only those who have heard and understand the good news of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, which comes as a package which includes the New Heavenly Inheritance for mankind in Jesus CHRIST , this is to believe in Jesus Christ, so they can inherite a place in Heaven... That's why Jesus Christ died so our sins are not counded against us, for this Heavenly Inheritance, which Jesus earn not only for himself , but for everyone who believes in him, we are co-heirs with him of Heaven. If the Heavenly FATHER has given Jesus Christ his Heavenly Inheritance, yes he has because Jesus is in Heaven, and more he Rules, he is sitted on the Throne in Heaven and he gives us our portion of Heaven to each one of us who believes.. Because everyone who believes has the Lord's Jesus the inheritor of Heaven, and his righteousness and his Life. It is with this righteousness we have by faith in him that we have a right to a place in Heaven... Heaven it's a right for everyone who has Jesus Christ the Lord of Heaven righteousness... Not only Heaven, but among other things...He is who now have the keys of Hades and Death... Not like before... The Sin cannot take a believer to Hell. Only those who die with the denial to believe in Jesus CHRIST as the Saviour.. Not those who do not have the faith in him and who also are not having the denial in him... When Jesus Christ said; if you do not believe in me you will perished, he was talking to people who were invited to believe in him, to those to whom the Gospel was preach, and said that we do not need to belive in you, we have Abraham and Moses.. That's why Jesus said they denied me because of Moses...now Moses has become their Antichrist, not that Moses who was seen to worship Jesus on the mountain of configurations and whom came from Heaven and who said to disciples that Jesus is the Christ..but that they are blinded not to know the truth about Moses. Because Moses said follow the Christ as I also I am following the Christ... There are people who jave not believe but they have not denied.. to believe Jesus Christ as a SAVIOR... We are judge by him , he is our Judge, and he knows when we as believers are having his imputed righteousness by faith, we also have sins in our life , that's it... But Jesus knows that we have the right to Heaven because of having his imputed righteousness... Sin cannot give us death in Jesus Christ, as we are protected by his blood; We are under his blood by faith in him dieing for us. Nothing can snatce us from him, from his blood, Self righteousness is good for obvious reasons. No need for having a selfrighteousness for Heaven. Our faith in Jesus Christ make us ready for Heaven...for our Heavenly Inheritance. Consiense is another subject all together. Trouble consiense and faith in Jesus Christ= Heaven. Life... Peace in consiense with the denial to believe in Jesus CHRIST= Hell. -Death.. This is more than I can digest in a single sitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behold Posted March 13, 2019 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 7 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,795 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 3 Joined: 07/30/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2019 (edited) On 3/10/2019 at 10:31 PM, johnthebaptist said: I would suggest salvation is a matter of the Lord rescuing us from the messes we get ourselves into. Heaven is something else. I would suggest that salvation is the restoration of your broken relationship between you and GOD, that was accomplished by God in Christ Bleeding out and dying on a cross for YOU. And regarding getting into a "mess"......If you want to get yourself out of a mess, then, just don't get into one, is the best means to avoid a mess. Or as someone said....if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.. etc. However, If you want to live in eternity with God and Christ and the born again, then you need salvation. Salvation does not save you from a "mess'.....Salvation saves you from a lake of fire. Salvation rescues you from God's eternal judgement due you for your lifetime of sinning, that is only accomplished by FAITH IN God on a Cross paying for all your SIN by His own Righteous BLOOD. Edited March 13, 2019 by Behold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael37 Posted March 13, 2019 Group: Servant Followers: 21 Topic Count: 241 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 6,901 Content Per Day: 3.26 Reputation: 4,831 Days Won: 2 Joined: 07/05/2018 Status: Online Birthday: 09/23/1954 Share Posted March 13, 2019 21 hours ago, ἔκλειψις said: I don't think heaven is a place, but rather something more like a situation So you're not a Bible-believer... Joh 14:1-3 (1) Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. (2) In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. (3) And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there you may be also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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