BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: Not at all, for either of your posts. Which notably did not actually quote a single scripture. For just one example, you say, Heb. 8:10 “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people." This says nothing about the Torah of Moses being obeyed by the Church. To put the passage in its context, let's go back to verse 8: Heb. 8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 “not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the LORD." The portion in bold shows that this is a different covenant, not the Torah of Moses. Hi there! "Not at all, for either of your posts. Which notably did not actually quote a single scripture." I think you're just being silly....right? I routinely cite MANY SCRIPTURE REFERENCES in my posts.... "The portion in bold shows that this is a different covenant, not the Torah of Moses." Of COURSE it's a "different covenant"..... But SAME TORAH (Jer.31:33;Heb.8:10;10:16). NEW Covenant (Jer.31:31;Heb.8:8) SAME TORAH (Jer.31:33;Heb.8:10;10:16). "This says nothing about the Torah of Moses being obeyed by the Church." Sure it does! Here's the proof: 1. The church is ISRAEL (Ac.7:38;Dt. 4:10). 2. Israel partakes in the New Covenant (Jer.31:31;Heb.8:8). 3. The New Covenant is given as Torah (Jer.31:33;Heb.8:10;10:16). 4. The Church partakes in the New Covenant which is given as Torah (from 1, 2, and 3). It's all Bible, my friend! blessings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,111 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,550 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted November 19, 2019 You did it again: quoting numbers of verses, not the verses themselves, which, like the one I quoted, do not actually prove what you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 1 hour ago, WilliamL said: You did it again: quoting numbers of verses, not the verses themselves, which, like the one I quoted, do not actually prove what you say. You want the quote explicit? Ok! כִּי זֹאת הַבְּרִית אֲשֶׁר אֶכְרֹת אֶת־בֵּית יִשְׂרָאֵל אַחֲרֵי הַיָּמִים הָהֵם נְאֻם־יְהוָה נָתַתִּי אֶת־תֹּֽורָתִי בְּקִרְבָּם וְעַל־לִבָּם אֶכְתֲּבֶנָּה וְהָיִיתִי לָהֶם לֵֽאלֹהִים וְהֵמָּה יִֽהְיוּ־לִי לְעָֽם See "תּוֹרָה" right there in the NEW Covenant? Now....why do you oppose it? blessings.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 21 minutes ago, Roar said: There are unconditional covenants The Abrahamic, The Palestinian, The Davidic, and The New Covenants. The covenant that God made with Abraham in Genesis 12:1-3, and confirmed and enlarged to him in Genesis 12:6-7; 13:14-17; 15:1-21; 17:1-14; 22:15-18. The Palestinian Covenant of great importance is attached to this covenant in that it reaffirms to Israel, in no uncertain terms, their title deed to the land of promise. (Gen 13:15; 17:7-8) This Palestinian covenant amplifies the land features of the Abrahamic covenant. The provisions of this covenant is stated in Deut. 30:1-10. The Davidic Covenant, God’s covenant with David amplifies the seed features of the Abrahamic covenant. The provisions of this covenant is stated in 2 Sam 7:12-16. The New Covenant guarantees Israel a converted heart as the foundation of all her blessings. According to the OT principle that such a conversion cannot be effected permanently without the shedding of blood, this covenant necessitates a sacrifice, acceptable to God, as the foundation on which it is instituted. The provisions of this covenant promised to Israel was stated in Jeremiah 31:31-34 and confirmed by Isaiah (61:8-9) and Ezekiel (37:121-28). Hi there! I appreciate you! I've heard it said that "Palestine" is actually an insulting term...being derived from the Philistines who wrongly occupied portions of the Promised Land...and then David had to war against the Philistines... Anyway, maybe we shouldn't call it the "Palestinian Covenant".....but maybe we could use a different term? I'm thinking that's probably a good idea....lest we inadvertently uphold "Palestine" as a proper term for the land.....when in fact, it's the land of Israel, not Palestine. Anyway, just wanted to throw that out as food for thought.... blessings... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 (edited) 16 hours ago, Roar said: Very true! And we Christians are NOT EXCLUDED from Israel (Eph.2:12)....we are FELLOW HEIRS (Eph.3:6) and we jointly share in the promised land inheritance (Gal.3:29;Mt.5:5). When we inherit the land, we will again obey 100% of all Torah (Dt.30:1-8), as you know. By the way, it's pretty cool to realize that the promised land is much larger than in the cool image you posted above.... The promised land (as I'm sure you know) actually extends all the way into about half of Iraq! (to the Euphrates). blessings! Edited November 19, 2019 by BibleGuy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 Just now, Roar said: You know at one time Jews were actually called palestinians by the British a long before the term became popular as a term to describe Arabs that fled Israel upon its founding. Right....but I think that's derived from the term "Philistines"....which is an insult to the Biblical viewpoint of the land as ISRAELITE land..... So, at least for me, personally, I like Biblical terms (rather than British terms) to describe stuff..... Anyway....just wanted to throw that out there.... blessings.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 19, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2019 Just now, Roar said: You mean like this? Yeah baby! Something like that! Although....when you view the Nile river approaching the Mediterranean...it appears to break up into two distinct paths a few miles before reaching the Med.Sea. So, I'm not really sure about which Nile river path is correct.....Biblically..... You can see it on google maps, for example.... Just wondering.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLB Posted November 21, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 727 Content Per Day: 0.41 Reputation: 137 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/18/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/16/1959 Share Posted November 21, 2019 On 11/18/2019 at 9:08 PM, BibleGuy said: However, James plainly says Abraham WAS JUSTIFIED by works (Jas.2:24), and not faith alone. Did you read my post? But Abraham was justified by the work or action of obedience. The obedience of faith. Justification by faith requires obedience as well, in which repentance is required. Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? James 2:21 Not the works of the law Not good works Not work that earns a wage But Abraham was justified by the work or action of obedience. The obedience of faith. But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26 Those who who do not obey the Gospel will not be saved. JLB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BibleGuy Posted November 21, 2019 Group: Senior Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 777 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 224 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/05/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 21, 2019 54 minutes ago, JLB said: Did you read my post? But Abraham was justified by the work or action of obedience. The obedience of faith. Justification by faith requires obedience as well, in which repentance is required. Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? James 2:21 Not the works of the law Not good works Not work that earns a wage But Abraham was justified by the work or action of obedience. The obedience of faith. But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: Romans 16:26 Those who who do not obey the Gospel will not be saved. JLB Hi there! There appears to be a bit of a contradiction lurking in your comment, I think. You wrote: "Not the works of the law. Not good works. Not work that earns a wage. But Abraham was justified by the work or action of obedience." My response: Your comment assumes that Abraham's obedience was NOT obedience to God's LAWS. However, God chose Abraham BECAUSE Abraham walks in obedience to God's laws (Ge.26:5). Obedience of faith IS faithful obedience to God's law. After all, Faith is of Torah (seen also in Mt.23:23;Dt.32:20;Ps.119:30,86,138)....so of COURSE Abraham's faith was exhibited in FAITHFUL OBEDIENCE TO GOD's LAWS. blessings.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resurrection Priest Posted November 21, 2019 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 467 Content Per Day: 0.29 Reputation: 153 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/20/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted November 21, 2019 I'm new to this forum. Thought I might share a little. I've read through the posts in this thread. All very good discussion. I've read that in the Hebrew "believe" is an action word, not just something that happens in the mind. Belief always includes the actions resulting from that belief. A belief that does not encompass actions resulting from that belief, is not really belief. It is counterfeit. A mob boss may wear a shiny cross on a chain around his neck, but that doesn't make him a "Christian", filled with spirit of Christ. He may just be buying "fire insurance", or trying to deceive others into thinking he is Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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