The one taken and the one left, who shall be saved ?

[Jostler]

1 minute ago, Montana Marv said:

So when do those born during the 1000 make it.

In Christ

Montana Marv

as defined in Rev 20, (if by 1000 you mean the  Millennial Reign) they participate in the second resurrection..."the rest of the  dead did not come to life until the thousand years were finished"

 

[seeking the lost]

36 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Only two resurrections. The First is the resurrection for the Just or Righteous. The Second resurrection is for the Unjust or Unrighteous.

Jesus Christ being the First fruit. The N.T. saints going next, followed by O.T. righteous Israel, then followed by all who did not follow Satan after the 1000 years. So many different avenues to get there.

The the Second resurrection occurs following the GWT judgement in which the Beast and False Prophet were the first fruits.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Hi Montana

The first resurrection is specified and limited no one who is not in the specified group is raised at this point.  If you add to the group you are also adding to the Word.  These are raised to reign, they do not go up anywhere.  The second resurrection includes all not raised in the first resurrection.  Notice the separation of the sheep and the goats.  You do realize sheep are raised in the second resurrection. 

Matthew 25:

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

This happens at the second resurrection which is also described in Revelation 20.

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The book of life is opened here and if your name is not found written there you are cast into the lake of fire.  Notice that the dead are judged according to their works.  Do you think that that is only non christians?

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, Jostler said:

as defined in Rev 20, (if by 1000 you mean the  Millennial Reign) they participate in the second resurrection..."the rest of the  dead did not come to life until the thousand years were finished" 

 

Those of the Second Resurrection go into the Lake of Fire.

You must define what a resurrection is.  What type of body is received.  Only two types of resurrections.

[Jostler]

4 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Those of the Second Resurrection go into the Lake of Fire.

You must define what a resurrection is.  What type of body is received.  Only two types of resurrections.

Again, Revelation 20 seems to describe a different reality than the one you're portraying here.  I'm not sure where else to look...but it's pretty clear that the Judgement includes both the saved and the unsaved.  Why  else would the Lamb's Book of Life need to be mentioned at all if none whose names are included in it are present to be vindicated by it?

Quote

Rev 20:15

And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

if none were found written in it, why would He bother to mention the above at all?   "Anyone not found...." pretty well demands the understanding that some WERE found....and some were NOT cast into  the lake of fire.  But they were still present at the  Judgement.

[Montana Marv]

1 minute ago, Jostler said:

if none were found written in it, why would He bother to mention the above at all?   "Anyone not found...." pretty well demands the understanding that some WERE found....and some were NOT cast into  the lake of fire.  But they were still present at the  Judgement.

Prove to us that we (those being judged) had a chance.  Christ then opens the books.  I gave you a chance here, here and here.  And your response was this, this and this.  You failed, You are guilty.

 

7 minutes ago, Jostler said:

Again, Revelation 20 seems to describe a different reality than the one you're portraying here.  I'm not sure where else to look...but it's pretty clear that the Judgement includes both the saved and the unsaved.  Why  else would the Lamb's Book of Life need to be mentioned at all if none whose names are included in it are present to be vindicated by it?

GWT judgment is for Unbelievers.  Those whose names were not in the Book of Life.  Christ tells them why they were not included.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

[Jostler]

1 minute ago, Montana Marv said:

Prove to us that we (those being judged) had a chance.  Christ then opens the books.  I gave you a chance here, here and here.  And your response was this, this and this.  You failed, You are guilty.

 

GWT judgment is for Unbelievers.  Those whose names were not in the Book of Life.  Christ tells them why they were not included.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

There's not much there I can respond to.  You assert that the  GWT judgement is for unbelievers ...but offer no Biblical reason to believe that.  And Rev 20 seems to clearly say that ALL the dead not raised in the first resurrection are going to be at the GWT judgement.

In the absence of Biblical evidence to the contrary, I have to stick with what I can see in the Word. 

[Montana Marv]

6 minutes ago, Jostler said:

There's not much there I can respond to.  You assert that the  GWT judgement is for unbelievers ...but offer no Biblical reason to believe that.  And Rev 20 seems to clearly say that ALL the dead not raised in the first resurrection are going to be at the GWT judgement.

In the absence of Biblical evidence to the contrary, I have to stick with what I can see in the Word. 

You must first figure out what it means to be dead (dead in Christ), or alive (alive in Christ).  The dead were judged.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Jostler]

Just now, Montana Marv said:

You must first figure out what it means to be dead (dead in Christ), or alive (alive in Christ).  The dead were judged.

In Christ

Montana Marv

  perhaps.  But I think I already understand that pretty well.  There are two kinds of death.  We're born into the second death.....dead spirits cut off from fellowship with God.  The new birth fixes that one.  The ultimate end of the second death (lake of fire) is fully overcome at that  point.

But there's still natural death of this body to go through.  And that is the death overcome by the resurrection.  There is a very good reason for why death is the last enemy to be put under His feet.

The power of physical death to HOLD us is also broken at the new birth.  But it's still appointed unto all men to die...and THEN comes judgement.  Being born again doesn't mean we escape that....just that it cannot hold us.

Quote

Heb 9:27

And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,

 

[R. Hartono]

On 3/28/2019 at 8:00 PM, Spock said:

Are you sure that link is correct? I’m not getting it. Thanks

Just type the title in youtube page

[R. Hartono]

7 hours ago, Montana Marv said:

.  Only two types of resurrections.

1 Thes 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

TELL ME HOW COULD THE ALIVE AND REMAIN ABOVE BE PUT TO DEATH LIKE THIS :

Rev 20:4 and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.