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2 hours ago, Who me said:

 

Sorry I posted far to strong a reaction/reply.

That O.K., brother. God bless you.

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One of the things I always asked myself in this topic is - what exactly works mean? I understand it means good deeds. There are lot of unbelievers who do amazing charity work. Amazing deeds. I personally know many unbelievers who do deeds much better than me. Below verse from Hebrews is key to understand this. Without faith it is impossible to please God. Without faith, good deeds are not going to be pleasing to God. When we talk about good deeds, there is an external and internal thing. Externally they comply with God's will and may look to please God. But only God knows what's going on in their heart. Is that being done to bring glory to God? When a person is saved, this should come automatically. A person should do things to bring glory to God and please God. If not, there is something in saying that the person is saved.

Works come after saving faith. I think Bible is very clear. What James says in chapter 2 is that faith does not come alone. Faith should always be followed by works. If faith is that a person has with no works, then that is not true saving faith.

 

Hebrews 11:6

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

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On 4/2/2019 at 3:18 PM, ravindran said:

One of the things I always asked myself in this topic is - what exactly works mean? I understand it means good deeds. There are lot of unbelievers who do amazing charity work. Amazing deeds. I personally know many unbelievers who do deeds much better than me. Below verse from Hebrews is key to understand this. Without faith it is impossible to please God. Without faith, good deeds are not going to be pleasing to God. When we talk about good deeds, there is an external and internal thing. Externally they comply with God's will and may look to please God. But only God knows what's going on in their heart. Is that being done to bring glory to God? When a person is saved, this should come automatically. A person should do things to bring glory to God and please God. If not, there is something in saying that the person is saved.

Works come after saving faith. I think Bible is very clear. What James says in chapter 2 is that faith does not come alone. Faith should always be followed by works. If faith is that a person has with no works, then that is not true saving faith.

 

Hebrews 11:6

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

There is a number of things that stand out in this post.. 

One of them is "without faith it is impossible to please God".

There is a good possibility to post this statement and lead many readers to outer darkness...

We must make it clear with some introduction in reference to historical context is necessary to laid the foundation to help the readers built on a solid ground...

One example is Jesus after the Cross and the resurrection when he said;

All authority has been given unto me, go in all the world and preach the Gospel unto all Nations, and included the Jews by saying beginning from Jerusalem, and the Samaritans, and so on...

Before the Cross he send them only to Judea and forbidden them to go to other places, as Samaritans, or Gentiles....

In our messages where we referred to statements made before the Cross, and also made after the Cross we must help the reader, or listener to learn to corectly understand the context, even the istorical one. 

"EVEN THE REFERENCE TO GOD"

If we look in the Mosaic Law Coulture, we see that the ones who are being punished according to the Law, are not asked if they believe in God or not...

Those who obey the Law are not asked if they believed or not...

Important was to do what the Law says to be acceptable to others and to God!!!

They were judge by keeping or not keeping the Law not by believing...or not believing...

Not at the beginning, but as they were getting closer to Messianic times he , their Lord God began to tell them, not all whom accept because of their obedience to the Law pleases me, only those who obey the Law and believe in me please me; 

This is was said to the Jews only by their Lord God before the Cross...

Many Gentiles believe in him that time, but their faith was not accepted by the Lord God of the Jews...

Notice the language I used " the Lord God of the Jews", I did not say "God", or "Lord", I split hair for clarity...

Fast forwards in the times of Jesus Christ...

And the Gospel after the Cross, where faith comes first and it is paramount to anything else...

Not just faith in "God", many believe in God and will die for their faith in God, even for their faith in God, as in God the Creator, the God of Abraham, but the scriptures that says that

"without faith is impossible to please God", cannot apply to them and say;

we have faith -we have God, and he is please with us...

That was said to the "Jews only" in Before the Cross, and for the childre of the Lord God....and after the Cross fir those who believe in Jesus Christ.

After the Cross things have change with the new Covenant. 

Jesus the Messiah the one Moses told the people to follow and to stopped follow him-Moses-  and to start followed him- the Christ, the Messiah, because he is grater than me, Moses said. 

Jesus said to the Jews that time before his death on the Cross ,and it applies to the rest of the world for ever..

 Believe in God and believe also in me; 

If you believe in God and you do not believe in me, you do not have God...

"WITHOUT FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST, NO ONE CAN PLEASE THE HEAVENLY FATHER".

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On 3/27/2019 at 8:37 PM, vlad said:

 

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 What does that mean? That means Jesus does not love such people. Is that right?

No, we must not exchange 'love for 'knowledge.....they are not the same meaning. 

When He says He does 'not know them  that is exactly what He means. 

WHY does He not know them ? BECAUSE they had followed a FALSE christ/jesus....they had followed an IMPOSTER who 'pretended' to be JESUS....christianity is FULL of such PRETENDERS that we are warned of Mat 24v4,5......teaching we do not need to keep God's Law/Commandments. That is why Yashua calls them 'workers of iniquity/lawbreakers.  

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On 4/4/2019 at 9:42 AM, Betha said:

No, we must not exchange 'love for 'knowledge.....they are not the same meaning. 

When He says He does 'not know them  that is exactly what He means. 

WHY does He not know them ? BECAUSE they had followed a FALSE christ/jesus....they had followed an IMPOSTER who 'pretended' to be JESUS....christianity is FULL of such PRETENDERS that we are warned of Mat 24v4,5......teaching we do not need to keep God's Law/Commandments. That is why Yashua calls them 'workers of iniquity/lawbreakers.  

I disagree but O.K. let it be knowledge. Then without His knowledge the person in question will not be saved. If someone will say that there are no such words as "will not be saved" in this case again it would sound and look like those who accused Jesus over stressing the words of the scripture at the same time  overlooking the very message. The scribes were splitting hairs and stressing the letter of the scripture instead of the ideas.

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2 hours ago, vlad said:

I disagree but O.K. let it be knowledge. Then without His knowledge the person in question will not be saved. If someone will say that there are no such words as "will not be saved" in this case again it would sound and look like those who accused Jesus over stressing the words of the scripture at the same time  overlooking the very message. The scribes were splitting hairs and stressing the letter of the scripture instead of the ideas.

HOW can a person be saved if they don't know/follow their Saviour ???

it does not matter what PEOPLE say or do ....what GOD says and does is what counts....only those who obey will make it into His Kingdom Mat 7v23. The message is ,believe God and follow Him. We don't need to twist and turn scripture every which way to understand it.

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5 hours ago, Betha said:

HOW can a person be saved if they don't know/follow their Saviour ???

it does not matter what PEOPLE say or do ....what GOD says and does is what counts....only those who obey will make it into His Kingdom Mat 7v23. The message is ,believe God and follow Him. We don't need to twist and turn scripture every which way to understand it.

 

We obey God By believing in the One He sent.....believe Jesus died for your sins and arose from the dead —- that is the Gospel thAt saves

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On 3/27/2019 at 4:55 AM, vlad said:

Be it known to you that if the world loves you - God doesn't. And the other way around.

Joh 3:16  "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

You are right in that friendship with the world is enmity with God.  God still loves His enemies.  And it is true that Gods enemies hate us because Christ lives in us.  Christ loved even Judas, knowing he would betray Him and knowing satan had entered him.  

They also need to know that genuine Christians are those in whom Christ lives, and if He lives in us  we will love others as He does.  We will show kindness to other Christians as well as to unbelievers.  

 Jhn 13:35  By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”

The best pastors lead by example.   

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5 hours ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

We obey God By believing in the One He sent.....believe Jesus died for your sins and arose from the dead —- that is the Gospel thAt saves

Indeed,  Heb 13v8 Jesus Christ the same  'yesterday and today and forever.  As far as scripture tells us the 7th day Sabbath was His Holy day....no other. Just staying with the Word of God.

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22 hours ago, Willa said:

Joh 3:16  "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

You are right in that friendship with the world is enmity with God.  God still loves His enemies.  And it is true that Gods enemies hate us because Christ lives in us.  Christ loved even Judas, knowing he would betray Him and knowing satan had entered him.  

They also need to know that genuine Christians are those in whom Christ lives, and if He lives in us  we will love others as He does.  We will show kindness to other Christians as well as to unbelievers.  

 Jhn 13:35  By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”

The best pastors lead by example.   

God loves his enemies, because he died for the forgiveness of sins for all people including his enemies, 

Jesus cannot refuse faith in him from the worst person on earth, 

He has died on the Cross for all and he cannot take that back.... 

Even as some people are afraid to accept if, because of many reasons and one of them is that they do not want to be next door neibours to an unrepented believer...or to intetifiy Jesus with an unrepented believer...

This the beauty and the power of the Gospel, that jesus accepts the faith of unrepented believers....as they are unrepented believers he covers them with his blood, nothing can take them from him, even more sin....

They wrongly believe that the unrepented believers are in Hell....

Or those who practice iniquity, together with their good works are in Hell...

There is nothing in the Gospel to support that notion...

To the contrary the Gospel is inviting People as they are to believe...

Jesus died while we are yet sinners....

Jesus is calling those who are waring the robs of sinners, or those with robs of filthy rags, to believe in him thatbhe died on the cross for the forgiveness of their sins, made the propritiation for their sins, taking the punishment of our sins onto himself, among other things he was punish for our iniquity...

 and when they believe he covers them as they are with their filthy robs with his blood....

Positionaly are under the blood of his Attonment because they believe...

Not everyone who believes is cover with filthy rags, good and carefull people are also called to believe.....moral people and charitable people are called to believe....

Positionaly everyone the moment they believe are under the Attoning blood of Jesus Christ, as long as they believe. 

Then the process of cleansing their robs while they are under the blood of Jesus Christ...

Jesus has many kinds of banquets, and has a banquet among others for those who have cleanse their robs and are dressed in white....

We see that those who were cloth with robs of iniquity tried to crush the banquet of those who were invited to attent the banquet,  with their white robs....

Their names were not on the white robs guest list.

Then on being informed that they are on the list of those who are cloth with robs with stains of iniquity, we see that they tried to bleach, or cover  their "iniquity stains" with their good works, even their good works in the name of Jesus, good works with reference from the benefits to the children of the host .

But stiil they were not moved onto the list of the white gowns guest.....

They were still listed on the iniquity list.....

When they repent and stopped from their works of iniquity....they will not be found on the list of those who practice iniquity.....

But they will be given white gowns, and have the right to be parttakers and fiest on this banquet reserved for those who love Jesus with their repentance, and are living in his light.... 

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