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Christianity vs Other Religions


theInquirer

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Hello, thanks for the reply.

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Look at what it encourages followers to do? Like ripping of your eye or arm if you look at another person lustfully [Matthew 5:29] or devalue humans to the point where you have to accept that a huge portion of humanity will have to suffer in hell for all eternity? What about encouraging slavery in Exodus 21?"

There is nothing like strawman arguments for devaluing an oponent.

People don not wake upand decide to commiting a crime, they wake up with thoughts of 'I want...'

Jesus is talking about how ones thourghts lead to action and to change those thought paterns.

 

Is it a strawman if I can quote it directly from the bible?

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Christianity is the largest religion and its also largely present in the power houses of the world, so its naturally that alot of good things come from christians. However, can we really say that these good things only came because they were christians? If we dont count in the christian church, then christian charity organisation dont seem all that impressive anymore. The largest private charity organisation is the Bill and Melinda organisation and it was launched by an atheist."

Why do Christian seek to do 'good'?

Why do atheists do 'good'? Are they not taking a 'Christian' idea and adopting it.

I never intented to say that christians do good or bad or anything. It was simply a reply to someone that said to look at the religion with the best results ( or something like that im sorry for quoting wrong if I am)

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

Why do atheists do 'good'? Are they not taking a 'Christian' idea and adopting it.

Exodus 21. Is that an Idea that atheists adapted?

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

That does not answer the question. It does not enable anyone to determine what is right or wrong except by how it affects me.

That would be true if there was no context. My reply was towards someone that asked something  about how atheists view the fact that christians did so much good or something like that.  My reply was that there is no universal atheistic view. I never attempted to say what is right or wrong. Again Im sorry if I misquoted that person

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Slavery is bad " Why is slavery bad? What moral reasons are there in atheism that say 'slaverey is bad!'

I already answered why I think that slavery is bad and you did not respond to it directly so I will copy and post it right now . "Slavery is bad because of 2 main things. 1 Is that  its unproductive in the grand scheme of things. Slaves are cheap but produce less. The hard work, that was usually reserved for slaves is now replaced with machines. In this time we need qualified workers and thats not something you get with slaves. Thats why we have an interest, to have qualified and well nourished workers. Nr 2 and thats the more important part, is that I dont want to be a slave. Its a fairly miserable "job", destroys your health, doesnt pay well and is generally just bad. Because I dont want it, I can assume that others dont want it too. I dont want people to force me to be a slave. I am physicially weak, but even if I wasnt, I dont want other people to force me into slavery and thats why I want some kind of protection. The legal system protects me and others and I have to return (not yet) pay taxes. People finance it with money but we can look at money as a ressource. People want ressources. Thats why they will go out of their way, to do the things I want them to do. In this case I want protection and give  ressources, they give me in return a legal system, police etc. Even without morality this could function as something like a soul-les ant community. But generally morality has a  fairly strong naturalistic explanation. Its a tool that that is very important for intelligent social animals. "

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

Yet atheist say things are evil. They say that somethings are wrong, not that they are alternative ways of behaviour. Interesting Dawkins book, 'The God delusion' was originally called, 'the Root of all Evil', he also discribes Islam as an evil religeon.

I also like to say that word evil, and that is usually combined with islam. I read Dawkins book and you have to admit that it makes good points. Just because we dont have objective evil, doesnt mean that we cant use that word.

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

Then there is the philisoipical argument, Atheism, Theism, and the Problem of Evil.

For something that doesn't exist it generates a lot of interest.

Religion indeed generate lots of interest. My case is a bit weirder because I would be executed in my home country for religious reasons but thats another religion. That justifies alot of my interest. From what I heard when I talked with atheists in america, is that leaving christianity (especially some of the sects like mormonism, jehowas witnesses, but also the "normal" christianity") often brings MANY problems. The common thing, among many atheists is that their social life dried up after leaving their religion. A religious enviroment often doesnt accept atheists and that could be frustrating and it could explain why so many atheists are loud about it. ( again that depends on your enviroment, its different in some places but thats the general idea that could explain why so many people have an interest in it). The other major ts almost impossible to reach high political positions if you are an open atheist, because the US is a very religious country and that influences votes. A faith can influence the decisions politicians make and that could be a problem. The other social/ political problems  , like rejecting same sex marriages or abortions, demanding to teach creationism in schools etc, are almost exclusively based on religion and that often brings it in the center of attention and public talks.

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Let me give you an example, of what a muslim would say: "What about prophet mohammad? There is no doubt that he lived, died and was burried, we even know that he is burried (at the mosque in Medina). He was born 600 years after the last prophet. He was born as a poor orphan, in mekkah where the jews, christians, paegans and others did not even believe in what he said, so he had to flee his home city. Just a few years later, he build such a strong force of believers, that he could easily take over mekkah and all the other cities around it and islamise it. And this group of believers, later became one of the most influencial forces that live on earth and it will probably outgrow christianity in the next 50-100 years."

 

Three key points. He died and is still in his tomb.

Islam spreads by force.

Islam believes that Jesus didn't die and that he will return.

You want to live in a cultre that will compell you to behave, that does not accept critism or questioning?

Yes, and islam never made the claim that he was risen from the dead. I also would not say that christianity spread exclusively by peaceful means but im too lazy to bring up history, but I will if I have to.  Islam believes that jesus rose to heaven, but deny crucifiction. Im no expert about the death of Jesus, so maybe there is historic evidence for the crucifiction. If there is something like that, then I will admit that this point is accurate. No I dont want  to live in a culture  that tells you to behave and not to dare to ask questions, my fear is that christianity will turn into something very similiar if it gets political power.

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Do you have any reason to think that this life is a test and not the only thing we have? How would a world look like, with no test and a limited life with no afterlife? If you can tell me how such a world would like like in your opinion, we could start to compare it with our world, and see if there are similarities.

What evidence do you have to show that there is no after life etc.

My evidence is that we have a conscious because our brain processes information with electrical and chemical means. Once this activity stops, our conscious ends. Our conscious seems to be limited to our brain, so if our brain is dead, we can strongly assume that "we" are dead aswell.

 

1 hour ago, Who me said:

"Also can you explain to me how atheism demonstrates a God?"

 

To argue against something that does not exist is pointless. Therefore because atheists argue against God, God exists.

That would only apply, if religion was a private matter. The problem is that many issues like abortion,  same sex marriages, teaching creationism in school etc are  based on religious reasons, and that makes religion turn from a private into a public matter.

Edited by Leyla
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3 hours ago, Leyla said:

Its not only about eternal life, its also about eternal torture and we cant leave that one out.

This statement is false. Whenever life is compared with it's corollary...it is always death. As in...choose between life and death...and not...choose between life and torture.

The god of torture is not the living God. You are confusing the devil with the living God. God is love. God gives life and takes it away.

Jer. 21:8 "You shall also say to this people, 'Thus says the LORD, "Behold, I set before you the way of life and the way of death.

 

 

 

 

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43 minutes ago, Pekoudah said:

This statement is false. Whenever life is compared with it's corollary...it is always death. As in...choose between life and death...and not...choose between life and torture.

The god of torture is not the living God. You are confusing the devil with the living God. God is love. God gives life and takes it away.

Jer. 21:8 "You shall also say to this people, 'Thus says the LORD, "Behold, I set before you the way of life and the way of death.

So God is love but satan takes us to him? Does it mean that satan can overpower God and take us with him? EDIT: What is the corolarry of torture? Non torture in heaven (=life in heaven)? If thats the opposite to eternal torture in hell, then why was it wrong for me to say that its about eternal life and eternal torture

Edited by Leyla
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5 hours ago, Leyla said:

Muslims adore their prophets and God too, thats why so many want to die in combat to share the same heaven as their prophets. I would not say that followers of other religions are doing it just because of fear of hell. The word gracious is what stood out, because the first sentence of the Quran is "In the name of Allah, the merciful, the especially/most merciful" (can be gracefull too, depending on translation). Christianity is not the only one, that believes their God to be graceful.   [Edit: Im sorry if all my comparisons with other religions are about islam, its the only other religion I know enough to talk about, I will try to include buddhism in the near future too]

I'm quoting and responding to only your response to my quote. 

The post you quoted was not my response to what makes Christianity different. It was on a side topic. But you did seem to address it with the part I bolded above. 

I said the difference between Christianity and other religions is Grace, not graceful. And it is not a side issue. It is the core foundation of Christianity - that we are not saved based on how good we are. We are saved because we believe. That is something that makes no sense to the human mind and is also the last thing someone would have come up with 2,000 years ago in the contemporaneous culture if they were starting a fake religion. 

Grace is the foundation of only one spiritual belief: Christianity. 

And regarding Islam, it is one of the most evil belief systems on the planet - if not THE most evil. The only reason it spread as far as it did is because of physical intimidation, which is supported in the quran. And that should not be surprising. It's author was a warrior and conqueror. And interestingly, when you read the quran you can see his message changing as he gains political and military power. It starts with "try to get along" and ends with "kill and enslave the non-believers. It is loosely based on the bible (old and new testaments) and even pulls stories out of false books from the NT period (e.g. the Book of Thomas). 

I consider two false prophets that have the most in common regarding how they created their religion to be Muhammad and Joseph Smith. They both stared with the bible and, um, embellished. 

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4 minutes ago, Still Alive said:

I'm quoting and responding to only your response to my quote. 

The post you quoted was not my response to what makes Christianity different. It was on a side topic. But you did seem to address it with the part I bolded above. 

I said the difference between Christianity and other religions is Grace, not graceful. And it is not a side issue. It is the core foundation of Christianity - that we are not saved based on how good we are. We are saved because we believe. That is something that makes no sense to the human mind and is also the last thing someone would have come up with 2,000 years ago in the contemporaneous culture if they were starting a fake religion. 

Grace is the foundation of only one spiritual belief: Christianity. 

And regarding Islam, it is one of the most evil belief systems on the planet - if not THE most evil. The only reason it spread as far as it did is because of physical intimidation, which is supported in the quran. And that should not be surprising. It's author was a warrior and conqueror. And interestingly, when you read the quran you can see his message changing as he gains political and military power. It starts with "try to get along" and ends with "kill and enslave the non-believers. It is loosely based on the bible (old and new testaments) and even pulls stories out of false books from the NT period (e.g. the Book of Thomas). 

I consider two false prophets that have the most in common regarding how they created their religion to be Muhammad and Joseph Smith. They both stared with the bible and, um, embellished. 

Is killing whole cities in sodom and gomorha, almost the whole world with the flood, ordering to kill for example 1 Samuel 15:3-4 or supporting slavery in exodus 21 part of the grace? I would dare to say that the bible has almost as many bad elements as the Quran, though it obviously doesnt beat it.

 

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1 minute ago, Leyla said:

Is killing whole cities in sodom and gomorha, almost the whole world with the flood, ordering to kill for example 1 Samuel 15:3-4 or supporting slavery part of the grace? I would dare to say that the bible has almost as many bad elements as the Quran, though it obviously doesnt beat it.

 

Nope. The OT is a history book. The Quran instructs current believers to kill.

The OT is the history of Israel, God's chosen people. It is a history of them succeeding, and of them failing. It is His first covenant.

The New Testament is the new covenant, which completes the old one. And it is about God sacrificing his only son so that all may live in eternity with him. It counters what will happen to us if we do not believe - we die, once an for all. This body we occupy is but a temporary dwelling. Those that accept His free gift go on to an eternal relationship with our creator in a perfected body. Those that don't simply die, as the animals do. As is said in Ecclesiastes, they eat and drink and enjoy the fruits of their labor, and then they die. In fact, I see them as NPC's, except every one of them is given the opportunity to be awakened to the revelation of who Jesus is, and acceptance of his free gift. In fact, we were all "NPC's" before we were awakened.

The violence in the OT is there for a clear reason. And Israel was actually punished for NOT completely wiping out all artifacts of some nations, including their children. But we are no longer in that world, and have no idea what those civilizations were like. i.e. we should not sit in judgement of Gods instructions to those that lived many thousands of years ago based on terribly limited knowledge. 

And the most violent thing Jesus tells us to do is shake the dust off our feet as a testimony against them when we leave a town that refuses to believe. 

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5 minutes ago, Leyla said:

Is killing whole cities in sodom and gomorha, almost the whole world with the flood, ordering to kill for example 1 Samuel 15:3-4 or supporting slavery in exodus 21 part of the grace? I would dare to say that the bible has almost as many bad elements as the Quran, though it obviously doesnt beat it.

 

 

“ Won’t the Creater of the universe do rightly?” I am not smart enough to be God’s critic.I’d wager God has valid reasons for everything that He has ever done and it will be US apologizing on Judgement Day- NOT Him.

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3 minutes ago, Still Alive said:

 And the most violent thing Jesus tells us to do is shake the dust off our feet as a testimony against them when we leave a town that refuses to believe. 

Case in point, and well stated. Thank you. 

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   On 3/28/2019 at 5:18 AM,  Blood Bought 1953 said: 

It’s been said many times but it bears repeating—Religion says “ do”, Christianity says “ done”. Christianity is NOT a religion.....

I can copy you Quran verses of "do" and "done" and if I looked for similair things in other religious books, then I could find it too.

 

In regard to Salvation.....all religions make you earn it, usually your good deeds have to outweigh your bad deeds to be “ worthy”Of Eternal life .What “ religion” declares you are “ MADE worthy” by the death of an innocent God/Man and offers eternal life as a gift? All you have to do is receive it.No other “ religion” comes close.

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1 minute ago, BeauJangles said:

Case in point, and well stated. Thank you. 

I've been arguing against people making comparisons between Christianity and Islam for many years, ever since I actually started studying Islam after 9/11. Up to that point I saw it as merely another false religion. It is not. It is dangerous to civilization. In fact, an old Jewish radio talk show host, Michael Medved made an excellent comparison with Judaism, Christianity and Islam:

Judaism:  

political: Yes They have strong laws that members are expected to honor at the personal level. Their laws only apply to their members.

Evangelistic: No. They do not actively seek to bring in new members. Their laws only apply to their membership.

Christianity:

Political: No. The only requirement for being a Christian is to believe Jesus died for your sins. If a person is not a Christian, none of it applies to them

Evangelical: Yes. The desire of a Christian is that all men come to Christ and we are told to do what we can to bring all men to Christ.

Islam:

Political: Yes. As with Judaism, they have strong laws. In fact, they micromanage their members' lives to the point of telling them when to pray, what direction to point their head when they pray, which foot to enter a room with, which hand to use to wipe your butt, etc. And if you don't comply, depending on the rule, you are to be executed.

Evangelical: Yes. The quran teaches that the whole world is to be either converted or brought into slavery, forcing ALL MEN to abide by their rules. 

 

The above explains why Islam is so dangerous. They are both political AND evangelical. And Islam's politics are BRUTAL. 

 

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