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16 hours ago, nzkev said:

I was thinking good or evil, you cant serve two masters

Galatians 4 

Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be lord of all;

But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father.

Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world:

But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.

But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.

11 I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

I was taught that all of nature Sings of the Lords Glory.

Scientist while cataloging observations are peering at a minutia of the door.

 

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18 hours ago, Sonshine☀️ said:

Hello :)… Nate, what I have learned about faith (that saves) is this—trust in Christ.  It is dependence and reliance upon Jesus.

….But it’s more than this really—It is trusting in the work of Jesus Christ to save you.  Faith is coming “Just As I Am,” empty-handed to the One Who shed His blood for you and saying, “Jesus, save me, a sinner.”

 

The finished works of Christ ,   The SHED blood .    Jesus had to not only pay the price of sin ,   He had to make a way to truly set us free from sin .

Lets be encouraged by what paul said more than once .     Being then MADE FREE from SIN you became servants to RIGHTEOUSNESS .

Now , let all serve HIM in SPIRIT and IN TRUTH and we shall walk as did HE in righteousness by HIS POWER that indwells us .

But let a man , woman , nor child EVER once forget ,   Our GOD will not be mocked .   If one reaps to the flesh he sows death unto himself

but if one follows the SPIRIT he reaps life everlasting .   And this paul did say .

For , Church ,  if you walk after the flesh   , YOU WILL DIE ,    BUT IF you MORTIFY the wicked evil deeds of the flesh , BY the SPIRIT ,  YOU WILL LIVE .

We will always be the servants to whom we obey .     And thus let us always exhort daily , lest any does become hardened through the deceitfulness of sin .

Who will we trust ,     MEN who say things are impossible ,   OR JESUS who in HIM ALL things are possible .   Will we be the servants of men , OR GOD .

Will we trust in the doctrines of men , OR the Words and WORD OF GOD ALONE .      IN HIM and I mean ONLY IN HIM  both the desire and ability to walk holy and righteous is given us .

But if a man takes off heeding THE SPIRIT ,    THEY WILL FALL and lest one corrects their end will be ugly .   We gotta mount up IN THE LORD and exhort daily

and The simplicity of it all is ,   Without HIM we can do nothing , BUT IN HIM we CAN .   Now ,    I want to see a shower of  praises unto HE who is able to keep us from falling .

But a child will fall , IF IT HEEDS NOT its creator .      And that is a FACT .   

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Now , let all POINT to CHRIST and let all PRAISE THE LORD .    

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On 5/15/2019 at 2:05 PM, natesute said:

There are 5 recognised phases of matter and 118 recognised elements. (Thanks Google)

"Evolution theory attempts to describe the formation of the universe, Earth and life, but fails because it cannot explain the genesis of energy, matter or life."  - Joseph Farah   (Thanks God)  :)

 

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On 5/13/2019 at 3:19 PM, natesute said:

I am an agnostic atheist although I am completely open to consider the possibility of God, and potentially believe as I used to.

As I dig into the nature of Christian belief, it seems to differ to the nature of scientific belief in one crucial way: instead of only allowing evidence to justify belief, a Christian also allows faith as a justification for belief.

I find this difficult to understand, as faith sounds to me like an acceptance of a claim because it feels to be true, and not due to some reasonable inference or deduction of any sort. Isn't it the case that two people could disagree on the basis of faith? For example, two people from different Christian denominations will disagree on certain elements of their belief because of a faith reasoning, which prevents them from addressing their disagreements because they both think that they are justified by their faith. Can't any claim be taken on faith? Can't I say that I think a dream was a message from God, based on faith, even if it wasn't?

If so, faith would be an unreliable way to reach truth. If not, what is it about faith that I'm not understanding?

 

On 5/15/2019 at 6:07 PM, natesute said:

Wow and a turn that was. Thanks @gordon7777 for the time and the consideration in your response. I really did appreciate the sentiment of your message. Respectfully, I feel that this could have been a bit more direct in addressing the problem I raised about faith used as evidence. I should also make it clear that, since I don't believe in God, I also don't believe that the Bible is the Word of God. I really am amazed at the breadth of your response, however, I'm sure you bring a lot of value to this forum.


You are Agnostic Atheist because you have never understood and practiced the Holy Scriptures. Jumping up and down in a frenzy and so-called Speaking in Tongues within Pentecostal Denomination, does not constitute the Original Church.

FAITH IS EVIDENCE THAT ELOHIM EXISTS.

 

Luke 17:19 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

19 And to the man from Shomron he said, “Get up, you may go; your trust has saved you.”

 

Luke 17:19 King James Version (KJV)

19 And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole.

 

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On 5/16/2019 at 10:55 AM, Sonshine☀️ said:

…. And something else that’s beautiful about Faith is that it grows! :)  Faith as little as a grain of mustard seed is just as much the same faith of God’s Elect.  It is still living faith.  It is the same, just smaller in amount—but it can grow!  The more time you spend with your Father and get to know all about His wonderful love, the more your faith will grow.  

Philippians 2:13 New King James Version (NKJV)

13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.

 

If we read the words and see the outcomes of everything, then we see when we have faith as a grain of mustard seed, nothing is impossible to us, because it is strong faith. The believer begins small, without the Lords Holy Spirit, but grows in the Lord, to serve others who need your help and even the Lord dwells in them with His angel birds. Through faith makes us strong, and when filled with the Holy Ghost as we see happens, they speak the word with boldness, nothing small or smaller. That same example of faith is testified for us in Abraham who starts all faith for us to receive the promises from God, strong in faith, giving glory to God, not staggering or small in faith but standing fast in the faith, to be strong..
 
Matthew 17:20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
 
Matthew 13:31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
 
Acts 3:16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faithwhich is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
 
Acts 4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
 
Romans 4:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
 
1 Corinthians 16:13 Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.
Ecclesiastes 7:19 Wisdom strengtheneth the wise more than ten mighty men which are in the city.
 
Philippians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

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On 5/13/2019 at 9:19 AM, natesute said:

I am an agnostic atheist although I am completely open to consider the possibility of God, and potentially believe as I used to.

As I dig into the nature of Christian belief, it seems to differ to the nature of scientific belief in one crucial way: instead of only allowing evidence to justify belief, a Christian also allows faith as a justification for belief.

I find this difficult to understand, as faith sounds to me like an acceptance of a claim because it feels to be true, and not due to some reasonable inference or deduction of any sort. Isn't it the case that two people could disagree on the basis of faith? For example, two people from different Christian denominations will disagree on certain elements of their belief because of a faith reasoning, which prevents them from addressing their disagreements because they both think that they are justified by their faith. Can't any claim be taken on faith? Can't I say that I think a dream was a message from God, based on faith, even if it wasn't?

If so, faith would be an unreliable way to reach truth. If not, what is it about faith that I'm not understanding?

Good for you! If you are as open as you say, and I hope you are... you are in good company. Josh McDowell, Dr. A.E. Wilder-Smith, Lee Strobel to name a few former agnostic atheists who were open to the possibility that God really might exist and what he says (as opposed top how many misinterpret what he says) might be actual truth. 

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On 5/15/2019 at 9:57 AM, natesute said:

I have never had a problem with religion. In fact, the contemporary, Pentecostal environment in which I've spent my Sundays is far from ceremonial, dogmatic or traditional. My experience of Christianity has always been about the relationship with Jesus, an understanding that brought me much peace and happiness. It was not a negative experience with the religion or the faith that made me agnostic.

In the way you described faith here, you used experience of hearing the Word of God to justify your belief. An experience used to justify a belief is evidence. However, as hearing the Word of God and then consequently believing in God is a strictly personal, anecdotal experience, it cannot be a justification for my belief. Unless of course I have the same experience.

I am here because I want to be clear with my understanding before I come out as agnostic, but I certainly won't deny that I want to believe again, I have nothing to lose by doing so and everything to gain. What scares me isn't the absence of consciousness, but eternity. It is terrifying to think that the state of death would be never-ending. I am not scared of going to hell, for the same reason I'm not excited to go to the heaven of anti-God. I don't believe in God, and I don't believe in anti-God.

 

 

 

“ Fear Of the Lord ( and Hell) is the beginning of Wisdom” What Christianity all boils down to is- Did He Walk out of that Tomb or did He not? If not , ignore Christianity , it is all a lie.If the man that claimed He would arise from the dead and walk out of that tomb, actually did what He said He would do— you had better listen to every word He said.It would be wise to narrow the search down to this one thing— it determines everything else.

Edited by Blood Bought 1953
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