Misunderstandings by some about Saving Grace

[Omegaman 3.0]

9 hours ago, Pekoudah said:

Read the bible and learn more before trying to teach  anyone...

 

You and your friends have been indoctrinated into a religious error that is popular in this time of false grace. But you display on top of that a lack of knowledge of the bible...which figures.

 

Learn the whole counsel of God...not just the few verses you have learned to support an error.

Somehow, I doubt that you know this person, their mind, their heart, and their life, well enough to make such a sweeping conclusion about their Bible knowledge. Just because we disagree on some point, does not mean that they are wrong, and we are right. I suggest putting a little more love and humility and thought into our posts, before we start sounding too accusative, dismissive, and condescending. 

[Pekoudah]

7 minutes ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Somehow, I doubt that you know this person, their mind, their heart, and their life, well enough to make such a sweeping conclusion about their Bible knowledge. Just because we disagree on some point, does not mean that they are wrong, and we are right. I suggest putting a little more love and humility and thought into our posts, before we start sounding to accusative, dismissive, and condescending. 

 

 

All I know from anyone on this forum is what they write. You'd have to read the whole thread and the other thread where...this person told me twice that what I wrote was unbiblical. When I wrote out from the bible the exact words...that proved the this person had never read those verse...then I question a person's bible knowledge. But I will only do that when the person is acting superior as if I don't know what I'm talking about.

 

I tried doing the ignore function on this forum...but I can't get it to work. There are factions here. I would rather not talk with people that can't discuss the bible...without always saying the same things over and over...the same few verses they know.

 

I'm not disagreeing with you...but to every story there are 2 sides.

[Omegaman 3.0]

27 minutes ago, Pekoudah said:

All I know from anyone on this forum is what they write. You'd have to read the whole thread and the other thread where...this person told me twice that what I wrote was unbiblical. When I wrote out from the bible the exact words...that proved the this person had never read those verse...then I question a person's bible knowledge. But I will only do that when the person is acting superior as if I don't know what I'm talking about.

 

I tried doing the ignore function on this forum...but I can't get it to work. There are factions here. I would rather not talk with people that can't discuss the bible...without always saying the same things over and over...the same few verses they know.

 

I'm not disagreeing with you...but to every story there are 2 sides.

I agree that there are two sides, sometimes more! It is also true that there are factions. Paul addressed that issue. He even said that there HAD to be factions, so that those who have God's approval, will be known. That is a rough paraphrase, but I think part of what he was getting at, is that while we should want to have unity, uniform opinions run the risk of uniform error. By discussing differences, we have a better chance of getting correct opinions on the table, and then we can choose the good, and toss out the bad.

I think differences of opinion, are good. They can drive us to the Bible, to learn more. What too often happens though, is that we go to the Bible, with mixed motives. We already know what we believe, and when our beliefs are challenged, we run to the Bible to find that "proof text" that proves us right, and the other person wrong.

"The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, But a wise man is he who listens to counsel."

Let's be Bereans, and see what the Bible says, the whole Bible, as you have suggested. We we read a text or text, we form conclusions. The conclusions may or may not be correct. We need to read what the verse of verses say, and not try to see how they support what we already believe. We we disagree with others, there are three possibilities:

1. We are right, and they are wrong
2. They are right, and we are wrong
3. Both of us are wrong

Let's all of us consider that most likely none of us are always represented by possibility 1 above. Believers all have access to the same Bible. All of us have access to the same Holy Spirit. All of us make mistakes, and most likely, all of us are slow to recognize them.

This should lead us to humility, and away from pride. Knowing this, we should check ourselves, and hesitate to call others wrong, but instead, react in love, with a desire to edify others, and not alway have to be right!

What I am right here, is not for you Pekoudah, it is for everyone, including myself. So, let;s just tone it down a bit, and get along, with the love of Jesus, for our fellow members of His family.

One thing I would like to point out for everyone, is that some of us are responding so quickly to the posts of other, that it is hard for me to believe, that we are putting much thought into our replies. Let's check ourselves, and calm down, not being fo quick to react, pause, pray, examine where we are coming from, before hitting the key that saves our message.

How will people know we are Christians? By our love for one another. Is that what people are seeing? The world is watching!

By the way Pekoudah, I like the way you responded to my post!

[Behold]

1 hour ago, warrior12 said:

When a believer is born again, something profound has taken place in his life.  Have you not read in scripture, that he now has the Holy Spirit to guide, teach and convict him when he goes contrary to the word.  It is a living experience that is true to him and as he goes along,  hearing and studying the word, he draws closer to the righteousness that the Lord so taught him to attain.  It is by Christ righteousness we are made righteous and not on our own, we can never achieve that on our own.  

You seem to place a lot of guilt on the church.  The onus for a man to walk upright before the Lord is on him as it is he that will face his maker to answer for his life on that day.  Study to be approved.  What are we encouraged to be like, not like the Bereans.

The born again believer has the statues written on his hearts and as his heart is changed, walks in this newness of life, striving to do what is right in the sight of the Lord.   Some take the path of counting the beads on a chain all day and reciting vain repetitions ect,, but the believer has the guide and teacher within him to guide him along the way.  The believer is a spiritual man and has to use his spiritual gifts to help him along the journey.  The word of God instructs and teaches us as to God will and each believer has to follow and abide in his own heart.

 

 

Acts 17:11 King James Version (KJV)

¹¹ These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

The "profound" experience you are referring to, is when God takes you from sinner and reproduces you (born again) as a Saint.  In about the blink of an Eye.   

What could be more profound then .. 35 seconds ago, a person is lost, going to hell, has no hope, ruined life,  and they are separated from God by their sin, and then.... they hear within their heart of the Love of God, ("faith cometh by hearing")  who as Jesus dying on THE Cross, ... calls them home to His Heart.  They hear His LOVE calling from the Cross, and they reach out in Faith and God takes their spirit and washes it CLEAN, for all eternity,  in the Holy Blood of Jesus.  OSAS

You said it right, Warrior12... this is "profound".

 I know that when this happened to me, i instantly had brand new inner "eyes".    And when it happened to my older brother, he told me "When i got up up off my knees, and wiped the tears from my eyes, i was standing on a world i had never seen before......everything looked different....even TREES looked different".    My Younger Step-Brother, was saved when He was about 8, and at 22 he was in Texas, and was in a Sunday morn service, and there was guest.   A missionary, who spoke.   Before his message had ended, my brother heard God in his heart call Him into the mission field.  

He left a high paying management job at Hewlett Packard the next day..... gave them his "2 weeks".    He had no idea what would happen.  He was single, making tons of money, had a good life.   Now he just quit that life because He heard God in his heart.  He had no idea what to do next.   He had people (loved ones)  telling him in the next few days..."well, that is just emotionalism, you can't leave a JOB LIKE THAT" !!!!!!!!!!!... "think of the cost of  your education, you're DEGREE"... "you are throwing it all away"...  This was his Step-Dad talking to him who also told him.. "well, if this fails, im not going to support you".  This is my dad.  He's the "step-dad", and in this case, He's playing the Devil's advocate. ..... As it is Jesus who said that a Believer's real enemies, would be found, often, in their own house, own family.  And of course, Jesus is always right.

It is now over 25 yrs ago that he left it all for Jesus.  (he didn't listen to the step-dad)  And what has happened?   He met his wife, she is a missionary....on the Fields of the Ukraine.  He has fathered 3 girls, all born in the Ukraine. He has built 2 Churches.  He created a street ministry and food-bank for the orphans in Odessa.   He has trained many many missionaries, both in Odessa - Kiev who joined the Churches, and also Americans who find His website and want to go.  And yeah, he also trained the Pastor's of these Churches.   Right now, he is there, but coming to the States for a visit with the family soon.  And what else?   He is the director of ... have you ever heard of "Missions To The World"? He directs it when he's in the states, and is also a full time Missionary with wife and family, STILL, when he goes back.  So that is what he has been doing since he heard the call of God and just simply said.  = "YES". "SEND ME".

So, Warrior12, what you said is a  BULLSEYE......as when Jesus touches you Through the GRACE of GOD, you are profoundly changed.  And that is why a person who really knows Jesus, wants to talk and teach and preach about HIM, and the Cross, and the Blood, and Grace.  They can open the bible to your inner man because God has opened it to them, especially if God has enabled and equipped them to teach.   And they can do so, with power, because, they are profoundly changed.  A person who is not really born again, can speak christianese, and misuse verses, twist the bible,  and talk about works, but they don't really KNOW the Master.

Here is a pic of the brother and wife and family.    This is about 10 yrs ago, but its my fav pic of them, as i love the sunflowers.

 

 

blessings, 

 

<B><

Edited May 16, 2019 by Behold

[frienduff thaylorde]

1 hour ago, Behold said:

Jesus is IS referring to ....The people who cast out devil in Jesus's name, and who lived HOLY LIVES , in Jesus's name, but ended up in hell because Jesus never knew them.... THESE  are simply people who are not born again, but talk a lot about Christianity.

"Living it"....is meaningless without being born again.   

Jesus is literally talking about Legalists in this verse you are using as your sarcasm.   He is literally LITERALLY talking to and about people who are religious but lost.  

YES HE IS .     And religious folks follow the doctrines and precepts of men .  NOT the WORD and words of GOD .     YOU RIGHT its the religious ones .   YOU RIGHT .

SO ,  lets ensure we follow JESUS and not men .

[frienduff thaylorde]

1 hour ago, Behold said:

Jesus is IS referring to ....The people who cast out devil in Jesus's name, and who lived HOLY LIVES , in Jesus's name, but ended up in hell because Jesus never knew them.... THESE  are simply people who are not born again, but talk a lot about Christianity.

"Living it"....is meaningless without being born again.   

Jesus is literally talking about Legalists in this verse you are using as your sarcasm.   He is literally LITERALLY talking to and about people who are religious but lost.  

Notice all those good works they were doing feeding the poor , and casting out demons .      YEAH this dung pile UNITY trash of just have good works , lets find common ground junk

that the POPE and about ninety five percent of protestant churches teach , is a pile of trash .     I shun it .    I am going out preaching JESUS ONLY SAVES

and reminding folks just like paul ,     Continue in him to the end ,     if you walk after the flesh church YOU WILL DIE , but if you through the SPIRIT do mortify the evil flesh

YOU WILL LIVE .      This all inclusive comes , and it has NOTHING IN ME .      TOTAL darkness and fake love and fake unity .    We better wise up , all of us .

We cant follow men ,   whose common motto is who are we to judge as they pass over about every sin out there for the sake of satanic unity .   

Those will be told I never knew you .   

[Debp]

7 hours ago, Betha said:

What the churches of the world lack is OBEDIENCE....right from the start....and thus are deceived into a false salvation Jas 1v21-25. 

It's all there in the first few verses of Eph 2 and good for ALL who believe and obey from the beginning of GOD's instructions to us the 10 Commandments as first step.

 Faith must be in the Word of GOD AS GIVEN....not in the way WE understand it with our human senses...it's trusting the WORD alone and must rest in/on the foundational Law/Principles GOD set up.

More sweeping, incorrect statements.   All churches disobedient and having false salvation?!   10 Commandments the first step?!  It is Jesus Christ who is our foundation, the first step, and we rest in Him, and abide in Him to walk in the Spirit.   

4 hours ago, Betha said:

 

I keep saying we learn mostly slowly and in stages as we grow and mature....but they claim everything they see and hear as INSTANT. It does not even happen like that in our human life, and they will have to learn patience so necessary for an eternal existence where nothing is rushed. This world teaches the opposite.

Another misstatement of what we believe.   Sanctification is a life long process.... although we are also sanctified by Christ when we are born again....sealed with the Holy Spirit.

3 hours ago, Betha said:

 They have allowed themselves to be lulled to sleep with never-ending grace and forgiveness by a false god and false ministers. 2 Cor 11v13-15.

Now even claiming our God is false?!

Since you are continually putting down all churches, and Christians who believe we are saved by grace through faith (and have good works as a result of that)....may I ask you what you consider yourself to be?   7th Day Adventist or ??    

[gordon7777]

We have to depart from iniquity, or the Lord departs from us for iniquity..

Acts 3:26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Proverbs 21:15 It is joy to the just to do judgment: but destruction shall be to the workers of iniquity.

Luke 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

Born again of God is that same thing too..

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

[frienduff thaylorde]

1 hour ago, Behold said:

Jesus is IS referring to ....The people who cast out devil in Jesus's name, and who lived HOLY LIVES , in Jesus's name, but ended up in hell because Jesus never knew them.... THESE  are simply people who are not born again, but talk a lot about Christianity.

"Living it"....is meaningless without being born again.   

Jesus is literally talking about Legalists in this verse you are using as your sarcasm.   He is literally LITERALLY talking to and about people who are religious but lost.  

We would be surprised today at who the true Pharisees are .  Its the false love ones ,  they wont warn against sin  , error ,   they just follow precepts of men

and talk about a God and a love  of which they know neither one .    Everything is backwards these days .    They preach a love that is hate

and they call those who love , HATERS .     Its all backwards man .      They call bondage freedom ,   and those who have been set free and warn others they act like WE IN BONDAGE .

they preach a liberty that serves the flesh .   THEY know nothing about GOD .    I frankly care not if the POPE or ninety five percent of even our churches

cant stand my solid stance ,  OH WELL ,    get over it I say to them , CAUSE this man WILL DIE ,  WILL DIE long before I give up and sell out .  LONG BEFORE .

And I pray only good for my enemies , only life .       But I refuse with the totalness of my entire being this fake love unity inclusive pile getting sold today .

[frienduff thaylorde]

1 hour ago, Omegaman 3.0 said:

Somehow, I doubt that you know this person, their mind, their heart, and their life, well enough to make such a sweeping conclusion about their Bible knowledge. Just because we disagree on some point, does not mean that they are wrong, and we are right. I suggest putting a little more love and humility and thought into our posts, before we start sounding too accusative, dismissive, and condescending. 

disagree on some point, does not mean that they are wrong, and we are right.

well they cant both be right .   so lets rule that one out .    Usually one is wrong and the other is right .  and sometimes both are wrong and neither right .

But believe me , its easy to spot one who is biblically wise , versus one who was trained in the ways and wisdom of men .

REAL EASY .     

Folks lets start over IN BIBLES ONLY  .   or risk it all .   choice is ours .