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Misunderstandings by some about Saving Grace

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What truly terrifies me is this  .     If we truly have the Holy SPIRIT in us ,  and we have learned Christ ,  we would long by now be identical and see sin

the exact same way the apostles who warned about it did .    Men are destroying the churches .

Grace would be teaching us all things necessary to walk holy and to be grave and serious when error is spotted .   Grace would not make light of sin .

JESUS DID NOT .    Don't we KNOW JESUS IS the comforter .     WHY would the SPIRIT then approach sin differently than did Christ or the apostles who I KNOW HAD the SPIRIT .

We must do an all out exodus of mens acroynms and doctrines and do a massive ENTRODUS back into THE BIBLE .     DO IT NOW .  DO it now before its too late . 

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43 minutes ago, childoftheking said:

 

 

Yeshua, being the Person of God, knew the Cross was ahead of Him.   The Lord's prayer has nothing to do with the Law or with Grace, much like the 10 Commandments, do not have relationship to the Law or Grace.    And we should always abide by them, especially the ones that Yeshua redefined.

 

 

 

We “ should” but we don’t.......we need a loophole....

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1 hour ago, Blood Bought 1953 said:

 

We “ should” but we don’t.......we need a loophole....

Amen!!

 

And I absolutely believe if we truly are Saved and born again, we can NEVER lose our Salvation.

(1) God will never leave us

(2) Someone truly Saved and born again will never leave God

 

But twice we received from God in way of the Commandments and His Prayer.   These were important enough for God to PERSONALLy give them to us each time.   In my opinion, He wants us not only to observe them, but to obey and follow them!!

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2 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Every day I grow more and more worried for blood bought .    He is giving folks a license to sin .  He may not support sin , but he is giving folks a free pass to will full sin .

He has no idea the danger he is in .

There are others here who may be osas ,   but I do not even see them saying what blood bought implies .    

We should examine how he approaches sin and how all the apostles did .    And what a major difference in the two .   

Yet our pattern should be identical to the pattern set in that bible .     If not we are misunderstanding something big time .

I know what the problem is ,   anything to do with working out our own salvation with fear and trembling ,    Has been turned into legalism .

They took a big part of the original pattern set by CHRIST and kept by the apostels away from the church .   is it then any wonder why error only begat more error .

We gotta do something .     They think we are legalists ,  and have no idea we are simply keeping the same pattern the early church did .   Guess paul, james and

some of us are all legalists .   Cletus you just don't know how worried I am about this for some .    Wait ,  you actually do ,  you seem worried for them too .

 

You think I am wrong— I think you are wrong

You pray for me- I’ll pray for you

meanwhile......see if you can explain this: I have some very serious problems with a family member that would  drive many people to a life of misery or even suicide on a daily basis, yet anybody that knows me,knows that I am the most joy- filled person around — upbeat , witty, kind......what’s up with that? Why is my life so abundant if I have everything wrong?My faith has resulted in two things.....I want to know God more than anything in this world, and I sit around thinking about kind things to do to people.Doesnt that  make you scratch your head just a little bit.I would wager everything that humanly speaking, I have more peace and joy in my life than my critics have and there is less sin in my life than in theirs.I sin less and don’t even try.I think I am on to something good and I ain’t turning back.

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This may be true of a lot of Christian forums, but it is still a heartbreaking thing to see so many “hearts” divided.  There are so many divisions among us.  There is very little edification, just so much contending, this group against the other group.  

How would it be if we all had one “heart” and we made it our goal to avoid offending each other?  

I wish traditions of man would cease and we could do away with these acronyms and such.  The Bible is ALL TRUTH, and it’s supposed to flow in TRUTH.  Let’s endeavor to understand ALL scripture as it’s written, and in context.  This endless accusing of each other is not pleasing to our Father—not at all.  My heart is heavy this morning.  May our Father forgive us for what we’re doing with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.  So many people are reading what we say…. Are we driving them away instead of bringing them into the Flock?  

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"There are a lot of "religious but lost" people who are doing the work of real believers, while real believers are doing the work of NO ONE , except to attend to their own carnal desires.

So, all of this, is meaningless. And that is because God does not accept anyone into his family based on their personal "worthiness", as all have fallen short, all are sinners.

The Cross is God's sole method to separate the lost from the saved.   There is no other method.   No works are accepted. No lifestyle.  No point of view.. No Opinion. =  "you must be born again".

God is the One who created the way Salvation SAVES, and Jesus is THE Way".  And there is NO other."

If people have all fallen short, they still fall short. This means they are ungodly, they still are ungodly. If God calls anyone, He transforms them, to be different from the ones who hate their brothers, they now love them, or there is no change at all, according to these peoples corrupted ideas. 

Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.


"Yeshua taught in the Lord's Prayer, that God DOES NOT FORGIVE US unless we first have forgiven those who have sinned against us:

That would still hold true , but something happened that changed everything —- the Cross.Your sins are forgiven before you even think of committing them."

The Lord did not forgive us until the cross, when Jesus the Messiah is on earth bringing the judgement of the Lord to redeem us back to Himself through His righteous blood offering, forgiveness is taught by Christ and it is empty minded to think that Jesus comes preaching forgiveness that is not about the forgiveness He came to achieve on the cross. So in order, sand not taking any of the words of Christ away, unless we forgive, and have that forgiving nature in us given by the Holy Spirit to be born again, this shows to the world, this is how the Father does not forgive us..

Acts 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

So to sum it up for you, if you are in the power of satan, in darkness, doing works of evil, you are never turned to the Lords light

"We study, learn, and grow, praise, work, and worship-- just as I imagine you do.  No one here is cursing you or challenging your salvation.  I really do not understand why you would reject anyone's wanting God's blessing for you, but... it's your choice to view it as a curse."

2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Jeremiah 17:5 Thus saith the Lord; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the Lord.
6 For he shall be like the heath in the desert, and shall not see when good cometh; but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, in a salt land and not inhabited.
7 Blessed is the man that trusteth in the Lord, and whose hope the Lord is.
8 For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreadeth out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat cometh, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit.

" I posted the scriptures above in love to remind you that ONLY our Father knows our hearts.  We are not yours to judge.  We are His.  "

Ezekiel 33:31 And they come unto thee as the people cometh, and they sit before thee as my people, and they hear thy words, but they will not do them: for with their mouth they shew much love, but their heart goeth after their covetousness.

Proverbs 26:28 A lying tongue hateth those that are afflicted by it; and a flattering mouth worketh ruin.

This is love for you..

Psalms 107:39 Again, they are minished and brought low through oppression, affliction, and sorrow.
40 He poureth contempt upon princes, and causeth them to wander in the wilderness, where there is no way.
41 Yet setteth he the poor on high from affliction, and maketh him families like a flock.
42 The righteous shall see it, and rejoice: and all iniquity shall stop her mouth.
43 Whoso is wise, and will observe these things, even they shall understand the lovingkindness of the Lord.

Proverbs 27:5 Open rebuke is better than secret love.

Proverbs 27:6 Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful.

Psalm 141:5 Let the righteous smite me; it shall be a kindness: and let him reprove me; it shall be an excellent oil, which shall not break my head: for yet my prayer also shall be in their calamities.

2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Acts 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.


"But if we do our best to walk in the light, we will fall short and sin against God, but Jesus will forgive us as long as we confess our sins"

We sin against the brethren, and sin against Christ, that is treading Him down under your feet to which there is no repentance.

1 Corinthians 8:12 But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.

We do not do our best, it is Christs best, which gives us the victory, it is all straight forward and good. We cant hate the ones we are to love, love is love and hatrwed is hatred..

1 John 2:9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.

1 John 2:11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

1 John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Luke 11:36 If thy whole body therefore be full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light.

1 Corinthians 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.


"The Lord's prayer has nothing to do with the Law or with Grace, much like the 10 Commandments, do not have relationship to the Law or Grace."

All Jesus speaks is grace, and the ten commandments are everlasting, everything done is glorious and for purpose, it is man that has no purpose and is temporary like his understanding..

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Psalm 119:144 The righteousness of thy testimonies is everlasting: give me understanding, and I shall live.

Psalm 111:8 They stand fast for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.


"And I absolutely believe if we truly are Saved and born again, we can NEVER lose our Salvation.

(1) God will never leave us

(2) Someone truly Saved and born again will never leave God

 But twice we received from God in way of the Commandments and His Prayer.   These were important enough for God to PERSONALLy give them to us each time.   In my opinion, He wants us not only to observe them, but to obey and follow them!!"

Born again is for few, and everybody is concerned about themselves, and not having the character of Christ to be only for another. The Lords prayer teaches humility, the word coming and in front of them that is their daily bread, the forgiveness that has been sent of Christ the hope of eternal life, the delivery from the devils temptation, for now God took His Kingdom to Himself and gave the power of His word  and the glory through Christ, who taught one way only, if you fear you will not be exalted, and when you exalted your fear is on it's way in the judgement..Does anyone see with me, that God highly exalted Him because He was obedient unto death and that this should be your way too, to lay your lives down ?

Jude 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

Philippians 2:3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.
4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others.
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

"I wish traditions of man would cease and we could do away with these acronyms and such.  The Bible is ALL TRUTH, and it’s supposed to flow in TRUTH.  Let’s endeavor to understand ALL scripture as it’s written, and in context.  This endless accusing of each other is not pleasing to our Father—not at all.  My heart is heavy this morning.  May our Father forgive us for what we’re doing with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.  So many people are reading what we say…. Are we driving them away instead of bringing them into the Flock?  "

When a person says their own opinion, it is against the Lord, even if they think they mean well. Nothing can drive anyone away, division  was sent by Christ, HIs sheep hear Him, others do not, and the Lord will decide on judgement day, and if anyone is pleased the way they are, remain as you are, and if anyone thinks they know nothing as they should know, good for you to rethink now..

2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

Acts 13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

John 10:25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

1 Corinthians 8:1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.

Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

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9 hours ago, frienduff thaylorde said:

Every day I grow more and more worried for blood bought .    He is giving folks a license to sin .  He may not support sin , but he is giving folks a free pass to will full sin .

He has no idea the danger he is in .

There are others here who may be osas ,   but I do not even see them saying what blood bought implies .    

We should examine how he approaches sin and how all the apostles did .    And what a major difference in the two .   

Yet our pattern should be identical to the pattern set in that bible .     If not we are misunderstanding something big time .

I know what the problem is ,   anything to do with working out our own salvation with fear and trembling ,    Has been turned into legalism .

They took a big part of the original pattern set by CHRIST and kept by the apostels away from the church .   is it then any wonder why error only begat more error .

We gotta do something .     They think we are legalists ,  and have no idea we are simply keeping the same pattern the early church did .   Guess paul, james and

some of us are all legalists .   Cletus you just don't know how worried I am about this for some .    Wait ,  you actually do ,  you seem worried for them too .

 Then you just don't understand what Grace really means.   He has told no one to go and sin.  Every believer has to study the word and examine it for themselves, pray and seek the Lord wisdom for his guidance .  The bible speaks volume on sin and its avoidance. He is not saying that we should not go and sin willy nilly and still be a spirit filled  believer.  No, the man who does so is not saved to begin with.   The human condition is that we are not perfect and and everyone would have to give his personal accountability as no one can fool his creator.  But we have an advocate that when we do err, we can go to him with confidence .  So then, you have no reason now to ask God to forgive you of anything, as you follow the law perfectly, isn't it.  Your prayer should not include anything of asking for forgiveness as you do no wrong, you obey perfectly.  Examine yourself man with this foolishness.   

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1 hour ago, Sonshine☀️ said:

This may be true of a lot of Christian forums, but it is still a heartbreaking thing to see so many “hearts” divided.  There are so many divisions among us.  There is very little edification, just so much contending, this group against the other group.  

How would it be if we all had one “heart” and we made it our goal to avoid offending each other?  

I wish traditions of man would cease and we could do away with these acronyms and such.  The Bible is ALL TRUTH, and it’s supposed to flow in TRUTH.  Let’s endeavor to understand ALL scripture as it’s written, and in context.  This endless accusing of each other is not pleasing to our Father—not at all.  My heart is heavy this morning.  May our Father forgive us for what we’re doing with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.  So many people are reading what we say…. Are we driving them away instead of bringing them into the Flock?  

Nice post ! but it will never be achieved in this 'present evil world Gal 1v4. Why not ? because it is ruled by it's own god and his evil ministers who will not allow TRUTH to be spoken. 2 Cor 4v4;  11 v13,14. and those who do speak out against the false teaching of a deceived world are silenced.

This world is following a wrong spirit that thrives on confusion, contradiction, disobedience and everything ANTI-God....UNTIL Christ returns from Heaven. It is HE who calls true Followers into HIS Flock, not we, most of whom are themselves still going astray after false shepherds.1Pt 2v25. 

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3 minutes ago, Betha said:

Nice post ! but it will never be achieved in this 'present evil world Gal 1v4. Why not ? because it is ruled by it's own god and his evil ministers who will not allow TRUTH to be spoken. 2 Cor 4v4;  11 v13,14. and those who do speak out against the false teaching of a deceived world are silenced.

This world is following a wrong spirit that thrives on confusion, contradiction, disobedience and everything ANTI-God....UNTIL Christ returns from Heaven. It is HE who calls true Followers into HIS Flock, not we, most of whom are themselves still going astray after false shepherds.1Pt 2v25. 

If recall correctly,

The Angel armies far outnumber the enemy.

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24 minutes ago, warrior12 said:

 Then you just don't understand what Grace really means.   He has told no one to go and sin.  Every believer has to study the word and examine it for themselves, pray and seek the Lord wisdom for his guidance .  The bible speaks volume on sin and its avoidance. He is not saying that we should not go and sin willy nilly and still be a spirit filled  believer.  No, the man who does so is not saved to begin with.   The human condition is that we are not perfect and and everyone would have to give his personal accountability as no one can fool his creator.  But we have an advocate that when we do err, we can go to him with confidence .  So then, you have no reason now to ask God to forgive you of anything, as you follow the law perfectly, isn't it.  Your prayer should not include anything of asking for forgiveness as you do no wrong, you obey perfectly.  Examine yourself man with this foolishness.   

The human condition is he is perfect, a perfect deceiver, perfect excuser, perfect for seeking all good things for himself, perfect at avoiding truth and perfect at calling darkness his light. Speaking of accountability and not checking the words you speak, or giving the scriptures to make as certain as we can, that we do no lie in Gods name ? Christ had to die for the words He spoke, as the world hated Him for His righteous judgement. His blood is what released the Holy Spirit into the world, and it is His body and His blood we eat and drink, we no longer feed off corruption, it ceased, what we hunger for and thirst for, and what we receive to eat and drink now is righteousness, and that is why that new creature only knows this, they cant know what they no longer receive. Just the same as the ones not cleansed, never knew the way of Holiness, they see it as a way to fail and that this is advocated for, it my well be, but still the wicked believer is to be put away from you, or if you think they are not wicked, or you dwell with them, or you are them, this is why it is a narrow path few find, as the world is on the wide one to destruction, because they believed the perfect lie, the devils way out appealed to them as everybody around them agrees to their deluded falling away ways.

 

Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

1 John 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

1 John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

 

 

1 Peter 1:18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Peter 3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.

1 Corinthians 9:25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

 

 

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

1 Corinthians 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

1 Corinthians 5:9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

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